With Long now gone to the Rams....

I was not aware of any of this.

Parcells is a Hall of Famer :shifty:

It's not nearly as wacky as you're acting. A pretty small minority of draft picks sign second contracts, and the correlation between that and merit is quite a bit looser than is being suggested.

You need to put in effort to make a well-reasoned assessment. It's very easily possible for it to be a good decision to draft a player and a bad decision to re-sign them, or even the reverse.

Parcells error wasn't in who we drafted per se, its in who he made coaches.

The talent that was brought in was fine for his antiquated system, Sparano & Henning were horrible in developing talent and putting together a game plan.

We have no one left from that draft because the players don't fit our current system.

As much as I despise Quitcells, that was a bad draft class anyway....none of the top 10 guys have really panned out. You can argue Matty Ryan, but what has he really won ?? Let's also keep in mind that all those guys are still in the league, just not here... Jake left on his own accord and his body has broken down of late... All are players that can contribute, but none are 'all pros' save for a healthy Jake...

I've said this a couple of times, but I think we'll see even more guys leaving after their first contract with the new CBA...it's inherent in the structure of the NFL and the CBA that these guys will be choosing more money over any percieved loyalty to any team...yes, I know that 2008 class was not in the new CBA, but the point is that it's happening and going to continue to happen...

At any rate, none of that helps us now...lets worry about what we do from here on out....

EDIT: Clarify...the entire 2008 draft was mediocre, not just our picks...

"Fin D wrote:

Parcells error wasn't in who we drafted per se, its in who he made coaches.

The talent that was brought in was fine for his antiquated system, Sparano & Henning were horrible in developing talent and putting together a game plan.

We have no one left from that draft because the players don't fit our current system.

true about not being able to develop the talent, but they drafted wrong that year as well...

Merling was number 32 that year....

"dcafiero wrote:

I was not aware of any of this.

I'm dumbfounded by this discovery.

"CANEPHINS wrote:

There is now ZERO, ZILCH, NUNCA, NADA, 0 players left from the 2008 draft class on our roster. The only players on the team from that 2008 lot is Bess & Carpenter, who were an UDFA.

5 seasons later and every single person out of that draft is no longer with us. This was the Parcells draft as it was his first with the team.

How brilliant of a mind is Parcells again? Was letting Long go part of the final cleansing of Parcells hands on the team? We know Bess is trade bait right now and kickers come and go. So was letting Long walk part of the whole reset, no Parcells picks, and it is fully the Jef & Joe show?

btw...I fully anticipated that Long would not be back. It just stings that we let a #1 overall pick walk with nothing in return.

Thats what happens when you change coaches and schemes. Players like Kendall Langford, Jake Long, etc no longer fit and you move on to new ones.

"Fin D wrote:

Parcells error wasn't in who we drafted per se, its in who he made coaches.

The talent that was brought in was fine for his antiquated system, Sparano & Henning were horrible in developing talent and putting together a game plan.

We have no one left from that draft because the players don't fit our current system.

I somewhat share that opinion. Henne might have been a much better player with better coaching. Langford and Thomas were fine. Merling was either really terrible or miscast in the role they envisioned him playing.

Our opinions differ only because I am reluctant to write that draft off completely because of bad coaching/wrong system as you have.

"CANEPHINS wrote:

There is now ZERO, ZILCH, NUNCA, NADA, 0 players left from the 2008 draft class on our roster. The only players on the team from that 2008 lot is Bess & Carpenter, who were an UDFA.

5 seasons later and every single person out of that draft is no longer with us. This was the Parcells draft as it was his first with the team.

How brilliant of a mind is Parcells again? Was letting Long go part of the final cleansing of Parcells hands on the team? We know Bess is trade bait right now and kickers come and go. So was letting Long walk part of the whole reset, no Parcells picks, and it is fully the Jef & Joe show?

btw...I fully anticipated that Long would not be back. It just stings that we let a #1 overall pick walk with nothing in return.

Actually it's a pretty successful draft. Not re-signing with a team has dick all to do with the success of a draft. To me it's players who stick in the league.

Jake Long/Kendall Langford scored big deals. Donald Thomas never should have been cut. That was daft at the time. He just scored a 4 year $3.5 million a year deal. For low round running backs both Parmele and Hillard are still kicking in the league (Parmele had 47 touches last year for the Jags). Even our 7th rounder Dotson kicked around for 4 years. The only outright bust was Murphy.

Is it sad we have nothing to show for it 5 years later. Yes. I'm sure quite a few teams are like that also. However, going forward with the Joe Philbin style team...I look at the money were not paying Vontae, Smith, Langford, Long, Thomas as opportunity for change.

By the way don't look ahead to the next couple drafts. All we have left from 2009 is Hartline/Clemons. 2010 is Odrick/Misi/Jerry/Carroll/Jones/Spitler. However outside of Jones does any of them fit long term? 2011 is also looking like a Pouncey only year once Clay/Thomas and Wilson get the boot.

"finyank13 wrote:

true about not being able to develop the talent, but they drafted wrong that year as well...

Merling was number 32 that year....

I get it....but no one consistently hits on all their picks. A lot of the guys that we picked are playing on other teams as contributors.

People need to really understand the definition of a successful draft pick. It seems right now people think successful pick only equals top 3 player at a position and still on the team....and that is not the definition of a successful pick.

To repeat a point from another thread:

Jake Long's departure from Miami to St. Louis in free agency Sunday night means 42 of the top 64 players in the 2008 draft -- not quite five years ago -- are no longer on the teams that drafted them.
That's 66 percent of the drafted players gone from their original teams ... 19 of the first 32, 23 of the next 32.

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20130318/jake-long-nfc-west-nfl-free-agency-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2Ntcxu3SA

"Fin D wrote:

I get it....but no one consistently hits on all their picks. A lot of the guys that we picked are playing on other teams as contributors.

People need to really understand the definition of a successful draft pick. It seems right now people think successful pick only equals top 3 player at a position and still on the team....and that is not the definition of a successful pick.

I know what a successful pick is....

all of those guys with the exception of Long and Langford arent.....ironically they are both in the Lou right now...

"Mcduffie81 wrote:

I somewhat share that opinion. Henne might have been a much better player with better coaching. Langford and Thomas were fine. Merling was either really terrible or miscast in the role they envisioned him playing.

Our opinions differ only because I am reluctant to write that draft off completely because of bad coaching/wrong system as you have.

Your stance confuses me though.

You recognize the problems outside of player talent and admit many players from that draft are fine....but you aren't willing to take the next logical step.

Its kind of like you admit the animal in front of us swims, has web feet, has a bill, admits it quacks, is a bird.....but you're not willing to call it a duck.

"finyank13 wrote:

I know what a successful pick is....

all of those guys with the exception of Long and Langford arent.....ironically they are both in the Lou right now...

2 players that are really good like Long & Langford make a pretty good draft.

When you have zero players left from a draft 5 years out, that is a horrible outcome. Theoretically, the guys from that draft should be your core veterans.

Had we made different/better choices where we picked the players would fit any system and would still be here. This isn't even an Ireland thing, as it really doesn't matter anymore who made the final call. They were the wrong calls. Merling was the worst of the selections actually.

"DrAstroZoom wrote:

To repeat a point from another thread:

Thank you. I always love how when this crap happens it's a Dolphins thing and NEVER another teams problem also.

"schmolioot wrote:

When you have zero players left from a draft 5 years out, that is a horrible outcome. Theoretically, the guys from that draft should be your core veterans.

Had we made different/better choices where we picked the players would fit any system and would still be here. This isn't even an Ireland thing, as it really doesn't matter anymore who made the final call. They were the wrong calls. Merling was the worst of the selections actually.

It's a theory by fans...not a reality as Astro just pointed out. 42 of the top 64. Willing to bet it's a common trend year after year also.

"VanDolPhan wrote:

Thank you. I always love how when this crap happens it's a Dolphins thing and NEVER another teams problem also.

This is a Dolphins board though. I don't think most of us care what other teams did five years ago

"schmolioot wrote:

Had we made different/better choices where we picked the players would fit any system and would still be here.

That is simply not true. There are not a lot of players that fit any system. You are just saying things you think you should be, even if that's not how reality works. Why would the FO that year even be looking for players that fit any system anyway?

If we had overpaid for Long and kept him here, then following your logic, it would have been a slightly less bad draft.

Draft quality is not based on what team the player ends up.

"VanDolPhan wrote:

It's a theory by fans...not a reality as Astro just pointed out. 42 of the top 64. Willing to bet it's a common trend year after year also.

It is. No other profession has employers taking in the same number of new employees each year.
Think about it. The draft contains the same number of players each and every year. There are no new teams, which means the attrition rate is = to draft picks and UDFA

"schmolioot wrote:

This is a Dolphins board though. I don't think most of us care what other teams did five years ago

It should...especially when it's a common trend throughout the league and that perception just isn't reality.

Plus I do love all the ranting this morning considering the fact most folks realized months ago we weren't keeping Jake. But a little tease drew folks back in.

"Fin D wrote:

Your stance confuses me though.

You recognize the problems outside of player talent and admit many players from that draft are fine....but you aren't willing to take the next logical step.

Its kind of like you admit the animal in front of us swims, has web feet, has a bill, admits it quacks, is a bird.....but you're not willing to call it a duck.

Point taken lol! I was more or less trying not to be argumentative. I should have elaborated.

I don't admit the players taken we're fine. 2 of them were (Langford and Thomas). I don't like the idea of passing over Ryan for Long and Henne. Thats a big one. Merling was a big miss for a #32.

"Mcduffie81 wrote:

Point taken lol! I was more or less trying not to be argumentative. I should have elaborated.

I don't admit the players taken we're fine. 2 of them were (Langford and Thomas). I don't like the idea of passing over Ryan for Long and Henne. Thats a big one. Merling was a big miss for a #32.

Meh, don't believe the media hype.

Matt Ryan is a very pedestrian QB. The numbers don't lie.
He has been lucky to have the weapons and team around him. IF we had taken him instead of Jake, he would've already been long long gone.