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Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by pumpdogs, Mar 8, 2010.
Atogwe was placed under the lowest tender why do you think we have not gone after him yet?
we're bringing in Ryan Clark for a visit today and he's expected to sign
Perhaps the better question is, "why Clark instead of Atogwe?"
bekus he dusnt fit are planz
eye sea wat ewe did their
Love the crack.I guess anything will be better than wilson.
maybe you should email the FO. im sure they have a good idea of why.
Clark is easier to remember and spell that Atogwe?
Seriously we dont really know if there have been any contacts with his agent .A lot of contacts are made without the press knowing about it.
The press get the" leaks" only when one of the parties involved thinks its convenient
And we dont know if there is any interest in him from our side.He may have some warts we dont know about or he may not fit our scheme or pocketbook..
Typos aside, this is actually a pretty important question. What is it about Clark's game that the FO likes over Atogwe's game? Is it an institutional preference for placing a premium on rush defense at every position? Do they see Atogwe as an inferior player? Do they believe Clark will fit better in Nolan's defense?
Worth noting that our first choice was Antrel Rolle, who's not very good against the run. So it might be that Clark represents to the FO a "best of both worlds" scenario where we can get a potentially very good pass defender while not sacrificing rush defense.
Clark's biggest fault is that he doesn't generate much in the way of INTs. You'd like your free safety to intercept 5 or 6 passes a year, and Clark just doesn't do that. I wonder if the FO is willing to sacrifice INTs from the FS position in exchange for having the spot locked down for at least the next two years while a long term option is groomed. That sort of security is worth the tradeoff, IMO.
In the end, this is probably a "what can OJ Atogwe do that Ryan Clark can't?" type deal.
IMO Rams will match any offer poison pill aside. Just because they tender him low does not mean they dont want him. They are banking on him signing a low contract. They really do not know what his market value is so they are letting other teams set it.
With that said I am glad the FO is not wasting their time with it.
The purpose of a poison pill is to ensure that the other team doesn't match the offer you make. You seem to be confusing the poison pill with the RFA tender levels. They're different concepts. An RFA tender just dictates the level of compensation a team would receive should a tendered player sign with another team; a poison pill is a contractual provision designed to ensure that the player's current team doesn't match the offer made by the new team.
Making OJ Atogwe a contract offer with a provision that he's guaranteed $100 million dollars and a private island if he plays more than two games in St. Louis in one year is a poison pill. The Rams couldn't match that without committing financial suicide, thus a poison pill.
I doubt Bill is in to the poison pill.
The issue may be more about timing... you make an offer to Atogwe and now you have to wait 7 days, and by the time the Rams get around to matching the deal Clark has gone and found himself a job elsewhere because you've publicly broadcast to the world that he's really #3 on your list.
If reports about Clark's asking price are true (3.5-4 million per year with a 6 million signing bonus) I think that's a huge selling point right there. If I were Ireland I'd rather take Clark at that price than Atogwe at likely twice as much and have to engage in poison pill dealings, which they may not feel is gentlemanly.
very cute AZ
Maybe it's because NO ONE gives a **** about the Rams or any of their players. Seriously. they probably saw he was a Ram and moved on to the Steeler with a Super Bowl ring.
If we were to offer a contract to Otogwe, the Rams would have right of first refusal. There would be no compensation but you would likely have to offer stupid money or put a poison pill in there to not have the Rams match teh offer. Although if nobody signs him to an offer sheet by June 1, then the Rams will have to pay him 7M or let him walk as the tender will expire.
Just as a point of reference, Antrle Rolle (4) didn't intercept 5 or 6 passes last year either. If picks are our concern we should have ran with Darren Sharper (9). And if picks are also our concern, then Clark(3) has more picks than Atogwe (2). So....there has to be something deeper here.
Yeah thats why I said poison pill aside.....
They would match any offer unless it had a poison pill.
We signed two raiders last year.
I was thinking that the other day!
I was like wait...how did we not realize this earlier? haha
this year was our reach for the Cardinals haha!
but at least our talent pool is extending to GOOD teams...Steelers Cardinals
Atogwe has 19 INTs in 5 seasons, which is a pretty good total, compared to anyone but Sharper.
I interpreted his statement as "The Rams will match any contract unless there's a poison pill inside it (i.e. if Atogwe plays 5 games or more in St. Louis, he receives X amount guaranteed)."
Atogwe would be a great pick up, but I do think that some here are right where the Rams are just letting the rest of the league set the value on him.
beyond that, it's my understanding that the league frowns heavily on "poison pills" and has gone out of its way to discourage them since the Hutchinson fiasco. Also, any team with their own FAs, I'd think would be reluctant to THROW that first punch; in terms of payback, it'd be like waving a red flag in front of a league full of charging bulls.
So short of the poison pill, you have an exercise in futility trying to wrestle him away from the Rams, and in a current market where demand for decent FSs outstrips the supply (Jest are now also players), we'd run the risk of losing Clark to a better offer, while we're tilting at windmills.
maybe its why we have to wait a week till st. louis will match and then we lose him and the rest of the FS are gone
Your logic does not belong on a team messageboard!
One thing nobody has mentioned, Otogwe is coming off a pretty nasty injury if I recall, which is why the Rams arn't sure what his value is....too much risk involved IMO.
I think either one is a good pickup, although Atogwe is a year younger and he is more of a ball hawk.
Ehhhwww....Clark has warts ?? I don't want him....
Just kidding...if Nolan sees fit to invite Clark in for a look-see, it's good enough for me.
However, his addition is a little puzzling, unless they are going to let Bell go (you know, if the rumor of a $14m bonus is true). Clark is listed as a FS and filled in for Polomalo when he has been out, switching over when he was not injured, but...he's really more of a SS than a FS...That said, it's not like this regime to have two SS playing the positions as we did it all last year. He's an upgrade, for sure, over Wilson even if Bell is retained. The only question I'd have about him is his age. Does this mean they have higher hopes for Clemons and/or Culver than we have ?? Thinking that Clark can hold the position while these guys develop more ?? Does he have any ties to Nolan ??
Some interesting questions...
There is no $14 million bonus. What team would agree to that term for a SS? As for Atogwe, apparently his shoulder is such that he couldn't pass a physical. You never know how a player will return from shoulder surgery. No team will guarantee big money to him and the Rams will match any reasonable offer. There is no way Parcells will breach the unwritten "poison pill" code for a damaged safety.
probably because he will cost a lot and the FO knows the Rams will match any offer
I can tell you why, he had a shoulder injury and the Rams don't want to pay him even though they know he'll be ready for off-season activities because they have a new owner coming in.
Atogwe needs to be the guy we target now. He should have been our target after losing out on Rolle. Hell, one can debate Rolle vs. Atogwe to begin with.
My guess is that he's looking for a ton of money, because otherwise, I see no reason why we haven't brought him in for a visit yet.
Clark re-signed with the Steelers, so there's no reason to not go after Atogwe at this point. If we can't get him, so be it, but I believe the FO has to try at this point.
We're back on the 2 & 3rd tier players. Dansby's it folks...
All I have wanted was the FO to pluck two players minimum off the FA pool with at least one being a LB. We got a beast in Dansby and I'm still hopefull for a WR or FS. I think we should have waited on pulling the plug on the three we sent packing till we see there replacement here.
Honestly though, Porter was gone no matter what. Akin was replaced by Dansby, and Gibril Wilson needed to be upgraded. So my guess is they assumed at worst they have to burn their first 2 picks on Safety and OLB. With the depth of the draft, they probably just figured it was worth the risk to save whatever money they did by shedding the extra weight so soon (didn't they miss some roster bonuses based on that? I know it was said that they missed having to pay Porter his).
Here's some info from the Rams beat writer on Atogwe. His response makes it sound like the injury wasn't of major concern.
bfulton: Is Atogwe so hurt that he might not be the same player next season or has he just not finished an expected successful healing?
Jim Thomas: No. It was pretty routine shoulder surgery. By all accounts his rehab is on schedule and he's expected to be ready in plenty of time for training camp.
angelrene: Whats up with the rams basically lettting OJ Atogwe walk away do they really think Pool is a better safety than Atogwe?
Jim Thomas: Let's see how the Atogwe thing plays out, but it was a real puzzler seeing him get the lowest tender. He was the only player on the defense that got any takeaways when it came to INTs and forced fumbles.