What if there's no 2020 Season?

How many players will opt out?At what point are we seeing a diluted product?I hope things improve soon.

"firedan wrote:

How many players will opt out?At what point are we seeing a diluted product?I hope things improve soon.

Its a good question. Two days ago, the official word was that the opt out deadline would be seven days from when the league and the players officially signed the new agreement on rules for this season, which is expected to be tomorrow. But then last night, word was that the league doesn't want to give them that much time. That leads some (myself included) to think that they're scared too many will take the option the longer that they have to think about it.

It looks like the league is trying to stop the growing flow of players opting out, and will set Wednesday as the firm deadline for players to make the choice. If they stick to their guns with that, it will be interesting to see if any players get cold feet and "retire" for the 2020 season, then come back in 2021.

Honestly the NFL had a giant head start on the virus.. im surprised that theres so much flexibility amongst clubs i thought there would be heavier restrictions in place.

"Unlucky 13 wrote:

It’s still being negotiated and finalized, but the players’ opt-out deadline at this point is looking like Wednesday.

— Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) August 2, 2020

It looks like the league is trying to stop the growing flow of players opting out, and will set Wednesday as the firm deadline for players to make the choice. If they stick to their guns with that, it will be interesting to see if any players get cold feet and "retire" for the 2020 season, then come back in 2021.

Here's how I see it- if players want to opt out, encourage them to. And if enough opt out, then maybe we see 32 teams with rosters similar to Miami's last season. That's fine with me because it's still football.

Like I said earlier, I don't think we have a season once all is said and done...maybe we play a partial season instead. Or maybe they get creative and we have a 4-6 game season and a 32 team playoff...who knows? I can't see some states getting in 4 solid months of football though with their full rosters. So to me, it makes sense to encourage those who don't want to sacrifice their lives to opt out now so you have real numbers going into camp and an idea of how you can make football take place.

"KeyFin wrote:

Here's how I see it- if players want to opt out, encourage them to. And if enough opt out, then maybe we see 32 teams with rosters similar to Miami's last season. That's fine with me because it's still football.

Like I said earlier, I don't think we have a season once all is said and done...maybe we play a partial season instead. Or maybe they get creative and we have a 4-6 game season and a 32 team playoff...who knows? I can't see some states getting in 4 solid months of football though with their full rosters. So to me, it makes sense to encourage those who don't want to sacrifice their lives to opt out now so you have real numbers going into camp and an idea of how you can make football take place.

I know that everyone looks at it differently. Personally, if we can't have something very close to a regular 16 game season, then I don't want it to happen at all. Just the way I am.

I rarely find myself agreeing with Odell Beckham Jr, but apparently we're on the same page with regards to the NFL season.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/08/03/odell-beckham-jr-wouldnt-mind-not-having-a-season/

“Obviously with everything that’s going on, it doesn’t make sense why we’re trying to do this,” Beckham said. “I can understand basketball was already in the playoffs. Five-on-five basketball in an arena is going to be more intense than regular-season games. Hooping is different than playing an eleven-on-eleven contact sport where there’s 80 people in a locker room.

“We’re not ready for football season. So why are we trying to push forward? It’s obviously for their money. And that bothers me because there’s always been this — and I hate saying it like that — but the owners’ , ‘Oh we own you guys,’ and just kind of that unfairness going on that they don’t see us as human. I just feel like the season shouldn’t happen and I’m prepared for it to not happen and I wouldn’t mind not having it.”

"Unlucky 13 wrote:

I know that everyone looks at it differently. Personally, if we can't have something very close to a regular 16 game season, then I don't want it to happen at all. Just the way I am.

A shorter season wouldn't really bother me too much unless it's something silly like 8 or less. However, it seems that the most likely scenarios are either:
1) A full season that the NFL goes ahead full steam, forcing some or many teams to play with weakened rosters due to calloffs and positive tests along the way.
2) A delayed season that doesn't start until a vaccine has entered the equation. Several are going through stage 3 trials right now. It may not be a great look for the NFL to try and coopt this for their players (or any guarantee that players/staff would jump at it) but if they wanted to press for this, it's possible the majority of the league could be ready by November/December and then play either a short or delayed season.
3) A season that starts off strong, but after several major incidents, shuts down around week 6-8ish and likely doesn't come back until the 2021 season.

I still think we will have to see what the next 3-4 weeks hold for MLB to really get a good gauge on things. If they can get things back under control, it bodes better for option 1. If MLB falls apart, it looks like options 2-3, or a cancelled season altogether. I don't think that's likely though, the NFL owners will not want to abandon their TV money.

"Unlucky 13 wrote:

I know that everyone looks at it differently. Personally, if we can't have something very close to a regular 16 game season, then I don't want it to happen at all. Just the way I am.

Sure, I can see that perspective as well....but you have to realize that we're not preparing for that (hence, shortening the opt-out phase, some teams living off-site, etc.) As of today they're planning a standard football season even though they're not sure if it can actually happen. So I think we'll just have to roll with the punches and see what happens.

I think there's still 50/50 odds we never make it out of training camps, and if that comes to pass then so be it. Let teams practice when they can between now and January, run team scrimmages, etc. to keep players fresh for next year. That would be huge for younger players without the game-time stress of having to perform immediately, so I don't think it would be the worst thing ever if we don't have a season. Heck, it would be AWESOME for Tua and Rosen alike.

I do think they try to have some semblance of a season though...but I have a feeling that it will start and ultimately fail. I would imagine it's super hard to just pull the plug for the whole year because we're all hoping that this stuff passes, but I also think most of us know that it's not going to just disappear as well. Given that they have to make plans today though without having the info they really need to make that decision, I'm not sure what they can really do except "wing it" until they know more.

There's too much at stake for them to just pull the plug on the whole year, so I have a feeling we're going to try to play like normal until it can't happen anymore. But what do you do when you have healthy West Coast teams and sick East Coast squads (or whatever)? I mean, if Chicago and Jacksonville have low levels of virus and can play 16 games, but Dallas and San Fran can't.....then what? How would you structure a playoff if some teams play more than others...or do you just cancel all games when a few teams can't make it? There's so many hypothetical situations that are likely to happen and I don't think they can plan for all of them today.

I would think a good start would be to give every team multiple bye weeks and let them choose when they take em...which means schedules would no longer be set in stone. That in itself would be a massive undertaking though and I'm not sure if the league wants to deal with it....meaning it would be smart to just cancel the whole darn thing. But I don't see them doing that either.

A shortened season presents the very real possibility that a team less affected by roster depletion could put together a "perfect season" of 8 to 10 games against expansion team quality competition. Be careful what you wish for. It's football but, I'd prefer to wait for real football.

"Hooligan wrote:

A shortened season presents the very real possibility that a team less affected by roster depletion could put together a "perfect season" of 8 to 10 games against expansion team quality competition. Be careful what you wish for. It's football but, I'd prefer to wait for real football.

Yea I think if this season does happen it will be treated as the strike year with the replacements.

Record will be official but stats will be asterisk

"texanphinatic wrote:

2) A delayed season that doesn't start until a vaccine has entered the equation. Several are going through stage 3 trials right now. It may not be a great look for the NFL to try and coopt this for their players (or any guarantee that players/staff would jump at it) but if they wanted to press for this, it's possible the majority of the league could be ready by November/December and then play either a short or delayed season.

Option 2 i probably the "safest" route but you also have to consider football in 2021- what does that do to the schedule if we have games Nov-March? Do camps still start in July with preseason in August? There are just so many variables with the biggest one in this scenario if vaccines actually work!

"KeyFin wrote:

Option 2 i probably the "safest" route but you also have to consider football in 2021- what does that do to the schedule if we have games Nov-March? Do camps still start in July with preseason in August? There are just so many variables with the biggest one in this scenario if vaccines actually work!

Yeah it would be tough on some teams if they are playing the playoffs and SB into like April or May. I would assume lightening the offseason load and reducing/eliminating preseason again before the 2021 season would play a role in letting the players recover fully. Reducing the 2020 regular season would help, at least doing like a 14 game season if not a 10-12 game season. They could also cut down on the playoffs to skip another week or two. Just have the 4 division winners face off in the week 1 playoffs, the 2 winners face off in a championship and then the SB.

I don't see how they can with players face to face on every play, in huddles, smashing into each other, bleeding at times, sweating and breathing heavy, all of the traveling, the stadiums, the lack of proper training and conditioning, etc, etc, etc. At this point, it just doesn't seem possible.

"Sceeto wrote:

I don't see how they can with players face to face on every play, in huddles, smashing into each other, bleeding at times, sweating and breathing heavy, all of the traveling, the stadiums, the lack of proper training and conditioning, etc, etc, etc. At this point, it just doesn't seem possible.

Is there any evidence that it spreads by anything other than breathing it in from someone else who breathes it out?

Honest question.

"resnor wrote:

Is there any evidence that it spreads by anything other than breathing it in from someone else who breathes it out?

Honest question.

Here is the list from the WHO.

https://www.who.int/news-room/commentaries/detail/modes-of-transmission-of-virus-causing-covid-19-implications-for-ipc-precaution-recommendations

Basically, it can transfer from many bodily fluids from one person to another, and that can include things like one person spitting or sweating on the other's clothes, and then the other person touching that spot, and then putting their finger on their own face.

Obviously, players breathing on, and inadvertantly spitting on one another happens all the time in football. I don't see how that can be avoided.

"Unlucky 13 wrote:

Here is the list from the WHO.

https://www.who.int/news-room/commentaries/detail/modes-of-transmission-of-virus-causing-covid-19-implications-for-ipc-precaution-recommendations

Basically, it can transfer from many bodily fluids from one person to another, and that can include things like one person spitting or sweating on the other's clothes, and then the other person touching that spot, and then putting their finger on their own face.

Obviously, players breathing on, and inadvertantly spitting on one another happens all the time in football. I don't see how that can be avoided.

This is what I don't understand. If it can spread like that, why did the FDA say you can't get it from someone touching say, fruit in the store, and then you get it from the fruit?

There just is so much conflicting information.

"resnor wrote:

This is what I don't understand. If it can spread like that, why did the FDA say you can't get it from someone touching say, fruit in the store, and then you get it from the fruit?

There just is so much conflicting information.

That is partially due to viral load and how well it lives on individual surfaces I'd guess.

"resnor wrote:

This is what I don't understand. If it can spread like that, why did the FDA say you can't get it from someone touching say, fruit in the store, and then you get it from the fruit?

There just is so much conflicting information.

I guess that there's some nuance to it. I mean, in most cases people aren't going to be covered in sweat when they're touching produce at the store like football players are, and hopefully they aren't spitting on it. My wife and I have long done a water/vinegar rinse with all of our fruit when we bring it home anyways, and then I always rinse it with water again before I eat it.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/08/04/cba-revisions-to-2020-season-for-covid-19-will-extend-if-needed-to-2021/

The league has planned ahead, and the protocols that are now in place for the 2020 season will be the same in 2021 if things don't get better.

"Unlucky 13 wrote:

I guess that there's some nuance to it. I mean, in most cases people aren't going to be covered in sweat when they're touching produce at the store like football players are, and hopefully they aren't spitting on it. My wife and I have long done a water/vinegar rinse with all of our fruit when we bring it home anyways, and then I always rinse it with water again before I eat it.

I've researched this extensively and the CDC believes that the virus doesn't survive on most surfaces for long. They think cardboard is ideal and it could live there up to 24 to 48 hours, while it would be minutes to less than a few hours on metals and plastics. Sun exposure and good ventilation shrink that time. Meanwhile, airborne particles also last minutes to hours...but they're really not positive with any of it!

All I can say is, wipe down everything (including your hands) during any shopping trip...that's all you can really do since we don't know enough to have a definitive answer on any of this. To spin this back to the mask conversation, one of the reasons for it is you touch the checkout screen at walmart then scratch your nose (or wipe your eye, whatever), and now you have everyone else's germs on your face. I think that's the key to all this- just don't touch your face before washing your hands.

Good to hear someone else lobbying for the same.

Florio

Getty Images
NFL teams have, technically, a “virtual bubble” around each practice facility. But the bubble bursts each night, as players and coaches go home.

Coupled with testing that has a 24-hour turnaround, the ability of players to go home (and potentially catch the virus from a family member, even if the player himself doesn’t go anywhere) creates a real risk of an outbreak. An easy way to limit that risk is to harden the bubble, putting players, coaches, and other essential staff in a hotel.

That issue has been discussed in recent days from the perspective of whether the league should mandate a harder bubble. Apparently, however, there’s another way to skin the cat: Set up a voluntary bubble.

You know, voluntary. Like voluntary workouts. Voluntary, as in not really voluntary.

That’s exactly what the Saints are doing during camp. According to the NFL, nothing prohibits it, because the Saints aren’t mandating it. It’s voluntary.

So why isn’t every team doing it during training camp? Those that do it likely will have fewer outbreaks, and in turn will have a team that is more prepared for the regular season.

As to the regular season, why not continue the voluntary bubble? If the coaches are doing it and the executives are doing it and the team leaders are doing it, everyone else will fall in line. Really, who wants to be the one who’s going home at night and showing up the next day to interact with teammates who are sacrificing family time to remain sequestered? Whether side eye or stink eye or evil eye or some combination of the three, the player who doesn’t go along will have a hard time getting along.

That’s not to say that squeezing a player to choose living with the team over living with his family is right or wrong. But the reality is that teams can set up a voluntary bubble, and that the teams that are the most effective at getting everyone to volunteer will likely do a better job of keeping their players available to play. Which will in turn give them a better chance to win.

"resnor wrote:

Is there any evidence that it spreads by anything other than breathing it in from someone else who breathes it out?

Honest question.

There are several ways it can spread. They don’t completely know and, at this stage, things are still unpredictable. Regardless, I think it is safe to say that lining up face to face, breathing heavy on each other’s faces, sweating, smashing each other, bleeding etc,etc,etc, is not a good thing. It’s safe to say the risk greatly increases. That’s why the world is wearing face masks.

https://sports.yahoo.com/source-penn-state-lb-micah-parsons-expected-to-opt-out-declare-for-2021-nfl-draft-020419910.html

Penn St LB Micha Parsons becomes the third high profile player to opt out of the 2020 season, with the expectation that he's finished playing college football, joining VT CB Caleb Farley and MIN WR Rashod Bateman. All three are expected to be first round picks.

I think that this should help persuade people that there will be a draft next April no matter what happens otherwise.

"Unlucky 13 wrote:

https://sports.yahoo.com/source-penn-state-lb-micah-parsons-expected-to-opt-out-declare-for-2021-nfl-draft-020419910.html

Penn St LB Micha Parsons becomes the third high profile player to opt out of the 2020 season, with the expectation that he's finished playing college football, joining VT CB Caleb Farley and MIN WR Rashod Bateman. All three are expected to be first round picks.

I think that this should help persuade people that there will be a draft next April no matter what happens otherwise.

Honestly, it would be FANTASTIC for us draft wise if there was no season.

I highly doubt we end up with the #5 pick again. They would either need to roll the draft positions or do some sort of lottery for the top where our odds would still be weighted well.

Then again without a season it would be really tough to draft everyone in somewhat accurate slotting to where it should be.

There could be a Joe Burrow waiting to break out who doesnt get a shot. A guy with first round potential who goes in the 4th or later.