What hasn't this franchise tried since Marino / Shula? Big Hint - it invovles the QB

Eli is an elite QB. His numbers and career performance reflect that. Yes, the Giants have a good defense. The Steelers' defense has also been very good with Roethlisberger as QB. Hell, the Dolphins defense was ranked 6th in the NFL this year. So what's you're point?

And no, I didn't miss the point. Brady is an elite QB. It doesn't matter where he was drafted now, because there may never be another 6th round pick in the history of the NFL that does what he's been able to.

But I'd ask you, if drafting a QB very high isn't the key to finding a franchise QB, then what is? Because what the Dolphins have been doing over the last decade clearly isn't.

 

I am against taking a first round quarterback for the sake of taking a first round quarterback.

If there is one that is worth it, of course I am down for it. If Matt Barkley was in this years draft I would be screaming for Miami to get one of the top three. The top two makes it a little harder to move up. If it isn't too expensive I am all for trading up for RGIII.

After that, who is worth a first round pick?

 

lol The point of the whole thread and what the OP posted was dealing with drafting a QB in the 1st. That's why I was wondering if you read the first three pages.

Again, imo the Dolphins don't NEED a "franchise qb" to be SB contender. I don't know how many times I have to say that it'd be nice, but I don't view it as a necessity if the rest of your team is solid and you have a pretty good QB. And yes, I haven't seen anything that suggests Matt Moore can't be good enough to do that.

 

With the rules in the NFL being what they are, offense will continue to be more important. That's not say a team with good balance can't win, though as we've seen, more times than not it's the team with the stud QB. That's what we're talking about here, percentages. The percentages say the advantage goes to the team that has Brady over the team has Joe Flacco or Alex Smith, regardless of what defenses those other two QB's may have.

But also, while Flacco and Smith are no Brady/Brees, they're no slouches. Flacco still sported a QB rating of 80, while Smith had a career year.

 

That doesn't mean the strategy is flawed, it means the talent evaluation was flawed.

For example, I don't look at the Pat White pick and go oh, we shouldn't have taken a QB there. I look at it and go Pat ****ing White as a QB, are you kidding me?

Nothing to do with the position, it's the player(s).

 

Again, Rodgers, Brees, Roethlisberger, Peyton, Eli, Brady.

You can think it's not a necessity all you want. The facts disagree with you.

 

The facts you're hand-picking can be made to look that way.

If you look at all of their teams and see the only big difference between theirs and ours is that they have one of those QBs then idk what to tell you.

 

So did Matt Moore.

 

What is a first round pick worth?

To me, once you factor in the rookie cap, you can breakdown the first round pick like this:

Do you have a franchise QB? No, then pick who ever you think has a shot at becoming one, regardless of what Mel Kiper says that person should be picked. If yes, follow whatever rules there are to picking that position.

 

And I've answered that by saying drafting a QB in the 1st round gives you the best odds. I agree with the OP on that. You're using Tom Brady, the exception to the rule, to try and prove your point. It's like playing Blackjack. Sure, you can go against the book and still win at Blackjack, but the ODDS say you won't be as successful in the long run. Sure, the Dolphins COULD draft a QB in the later rounds and have him turn into a stud, but the ODDS are more likely that he won't.

 

At times. But just not whiffing on that high of a pick all-together can do wonders for the rest of your team.

 

The first round pick is worth the player you have to give up to make the pick.

What if you do not think anyone has one? Do you still pick a QB in the first round?

 

Haha tell the Dolphin's that

 

Matt Moore had a solid season. No one would argue that.

 

And I've already said that you're opinion doesn't make it a fact without the stats.

Blackjack is a horrible example with all the variables that go into it. Actually that just makes it a great example for my pov.

 

Exactly.

 

Hand picking? If by "hand picking" you mean showing you the last 8 winners of the Super Bowl, then yes. I hand picked. Sorry.

 

No, it doesn't. Both are about the odds. The odds say a QB drafted in the 1st round will be better than a QB drafted in any other round. If you can't grasp that then I don't know what to tell you.

 

lol 8 isn't a hand picked number to choose for that? ok.

A trend is only a trend until the new one begins. The teams that are consistently contending are doing a lot more right then just having a "franchise qb."

 

lol And I already said do you really think all of those starters were worth their draft positions? Come on.

Look if you're just going to go in circles with **** I've already said and answered then it's a waste of time.

 

That's my point.

Let's say ONLY for argument's sake that Wheeden will be a franchise QB but only last for 5 years. I say he's worth a first round pick, even if he'll end up being available in later rounds. If you believe that he's a franchise QB, you take him in the first.

To answer your question, no, if no one is there that you think is a franchise QB you don't pick him.

 

Because trends (i.e, Rules) change in the NFL. Would it be more appropriate if we compared QB's who won the Super Bowl from 1972-1979? How about 1983-1990?

 

Trying to find a Tom Brady is like playing Russian roulette with a mini-gun.

 

Again, the teams that are consistently contending are doing a lot more right then just having a "franchise qb."

If anyone thinks that having any one of those QBs you deem "franchise" is the only key thing holding this team back then I completely disagree with you.

I've already said I don't agree with reaching for a QB in the 1st that you aren't sold on just bc the possibility of a "franchise qb" is there.

Now I'm done.

 

Drafting a qb in the first round is a great idea, but don't draft a guy in the first round just to be drafting a QB. Shula drafted Marino #24, but he didn't mortgage the rest of the team to get him. There is a lot to be said about timing...We've had the #1 and the #2 overall picks recently and guess what ?? There just wasn't a franchise QB out there in those years... Is RG3 a franchise guy or is he another Flacco or Ryan...because I don't want to mortgage the future for a Flacco or Ryan (thank you Bill, one thing you did right)...when you do that, you can't put the best cast around the guy and and you end up with a Joey Harrington or David Carr....no thanks...

 

Aaron Rodgers was there when we had the #2 pick. Also, though I wouldn't consider Matt Ryan the cream of the crop, Atlanta hardly mortgaged the franchise to get him, nor would the Dolphins had they drafted him. He could've sat behind Pennington for a year.

Now, if you want to argue that neither of those two would have the success here that they're having with their respective teams, that's a different story.

 

Even knowing how he has performed up to this point elsewhere, I still think Brady Quinn would've been the right pick in 2007.


I think only he and Aaron Rodgers were places where we incorrectly passed on a guy.

 

I was not a Brady Quinn fan. I didn't want him then and I do not want him now.

 

That's a perfectly fair opinion. Plenty of people didn't want Rodgers in 2005. I wasn't vehemently against him, but preferred others (Brown, Edwards, Benson - in that order), I was vehemently against Alex Smith that year however.

 

oh brother why do some fans keep making excuses for not trying tobe better.

oh we are fine at wr ? really Bess and Hartline are not the wrs we need to see the playoffs let alone reach a super bowl.

oh we need to spend the next 5 first rdpicks only on oline and defensive backe.

oh our young talent equals Wes Welker , no they dont people get real.

my favorite is fans think that if they see a qb one time and he throws a int that he will not be a qb .

Adam I am not trying to mock you because we do have some that think that but here is the real problem.

we are in the afc East and i have heard that crap for ten years now. We have had sorry *** coaches make stupid decission and we had
had gms like Muhler Spielman , Ireland, and coaches like Wanny , Cam, and Sparano overlook Anquan Boldin Linebacker Patrick Willis and other players to get guys like vernon Carey .

we then proceed to spend millions on onplayers who dont the damn ball anw we go out ans wesing these crappy 4 th tier players whohave madeno impact or very little impact.
pretty much what the orignial poster said is truth.

Oh here is a problem or could be a problem , we draft Beck and Henne and welet lame *** coaches screw them up.
exp you throw Beck out on the field against a great Eagles team and the kid gets screwed up and then you put Henne out there and the coaches pull him out to run the wildcat which defenses in high school could stop.

we practicaly gave Gus no fair chance or Brian Griese a fair chance so i can say we have had 4 or five qbs that our inept
coaches have really destroyed instead of develping .

I know many will will disagree but I am only calling it as I see it.

 

Oh ****. We got another one going multicolor posting.

 

And that's been the real issue; GM's and Coaches associated with this organization afraid to try. Afraid to get ****-canned for making the wrong decision. So, they mortgage the future and trade 2nd Round picks for AJ Feeley and Daunte Culpepper because, hey, if he works out no one will care about that 2nd round pick. And if he doesn't work out, I'll be gone so who gives a **** about that 2nd round pick.

 

That is a good point as well.