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What about Pat?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Pandarilla, May 4, 2010.

  1. Pandarilla

    Pandarilla Purist Emeritus

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    Should be good for Finfans to vent on our latest whipping boy:

    http://blogs.palmbeachpost.com/thed...olphins-must-decide-whats-next-for-pat-white/

    "Almost undoubtedly the most disappointing draft pick of the current regime’s three-year run, White, the 44th selection overall last year, accomplished little as a rookie, going 0-for-5 passing and rushing for 81 yards on 21 attempts."

    "The other possibility for White is a position change to either wide receiver or returner. But coach Tony Sparano was adamant all last year neither would occur, that White was a quarterback. White has proven himself to be a good athlete, so receiver is a possibility, though the Dolphins seem set there. They have needs at returner, but again, with his slight build, that seems a reach."

    My opinion, we should drop him faster than a Carrot-top prop (I said a hip hop...). Let the roasting begin...
     
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  2. gafinfan

    gafinfan gunner Club Member

    You'll get no toasting/roasting from me.
     
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  3. #1dolphinsfan

    #1dolphinsfan New Member

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    I am all for letting him walk I didn't want him when we drafted him
     
  4. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    there will be a position change for Pat White:
    special teams, wr, slot, scat back, qb trick-plays
    whatever ...
    there will be a position change for Pat White


    & he better make the most of it :yes:
     
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  5. late again

    late again Senior Member

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    I don't want to blast the guy, either. But I will say this - neither, do I want to see him as Henne's back up. IMO we're much better off with Thigpen and Pennington.
     
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  6. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    let him play.
     
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  7. Vinny Fins

    Vinny Fins Token Gay Dolfan

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    At what position?

    Is he better than 7 or 10 at the QB slot?
    Is he better than any of the Four WRs we're likely to dress?
     
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  8. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    Im not a coach, so i can't say what he'd be great at. I do think he's a guy that we could put at qb and scare people with though. If you were an opposing team, you would not want to see a guy like pat white line up at qb. You just don't know what the offense will do with him in there.

    Yeah, i know the responses i'll get, "well we know, nothing but suck!".

    But we all know that we haven't seen enough of him to make a true judgment. the idea of casting him off seems wrong to me.
     
  9. late again

    late again Senior Member

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    Exactly. The best players need to fill those positions.
    But still, I hate to think that we've absolutely wasted an early pick. So maybe there's a place for him.
     
  10. mustang20241

    mustang20241 New Member

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    I was actually very surpised/excited when I heard we drafted him and still got sean smith.

    Now at QB we are set and WR, as far as Pat's unknown ability, we are set as well.

    I dont like half the formations he was used in or what he was supposed to do. Even when he had a shot in the steelers game he threw like 2 passes. They were all run calls and he even nearly got a first down on 3rd and 10 and nearly died because of it.

    I would like to see him used in a wildcat or pistol style formation. I think he should throw some screens or something. Be more ****ing creative. I especially liked the pass he threw agains the Falcons where he faked the draw and threw it 10 yards past ginn. Only if he had more attempts. Too early to cut him lose, although his job is probably just going to be a creative wildcat/pistol option. We just need to let him pass more.
     
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  11. miamiron

    miamiron There's always next year

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    You can't be serious...

    Any offensive snaps on offense are taking away valuable
    playing time from better QBs and that includes the 3 playing in front of him.

    I could see if he showed some semblance of playing football at a NFL level but he was terrible last season

    I've been a Dolphin fan for 40 years and White is one of a handful of the worst QBs I have seen wearing a Dolphin uniform.

    There comes a time when you just have to say we Fuc*** up and lets move on..the time is near for Pat
     
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  12. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=- Club Member

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    I'd trade him to the Pats for something
     
  13. jetssuck

    jetssuck I hear Mandich's voice...

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    Roster spot = more valuable than Pat White
     
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  14. mustang20241

    mustang20241 New Member

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    Well what I'm saying is your can't just throw him in to hand the ball off on a draw from the shotgun. Open up the playbook more. You can't judge a QB from throwing 5 passes with Joey Haynos running wild out there. You also can't say cut him loose because it was one year where he saw like 30 snaps.
     
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  15. Roman529

    Roman529 Senior Member

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    Trade him for a 7th round pick in 2011. He just is too small to play QB, and we don't need another shrimp WR/KR.
     
  16. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    Here's what we know, so far, about White:










    That's it...we really know nothing because the regimes' plan of making him a QB has failed (so far). Their plan of making him a WCxQB has failed, so far. Any other plans they've had for him, we as fans are not aware of. He's not really a WR. He's not a RB. He's not a returner. He's not really a QB....He's an athlete without a position at this point. The sad thing is that since he was such a high pick, they are less likely to give up on him, meaning that some potentially decent WR, RB, TE or QB will be cut or traded (if we're really lucky) to make room for him.
     
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  17. jetssuck

    jetssuck I hear Mandich's voice...

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    My advice to Pat:

    [​IMG]
     
  18. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=- Club Member

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    Who knows, he might be the Michael Jordan (in basketball) of baseball. (Because it'd be a shame if he becomes the Michael Jordan in baseball of baseball)
     
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  19. #1dolphinsfan

    #1dolphinsfan New Member

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    it would be a mistake to put him in at QB ever if he goes in on the wildcat they all know it is going to be a run and if it is a pass and i was the defense i wouldnt be to scared i am a fin fan and if i see him as our starting QB i am scared for our team not the other team
     
  20. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=- Club Member

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    [​IMG]
    I don't even know if Pat knows what's up...
     
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  21. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    before brandon marshall, you'd be right. But now that we have him, you're wrong. It doesn't matter who our QB is, with Brandon Marshall on the field, we can score from anywhere on any pass from any QB.

    defenses will have to respect that, even if they dont want to.
     
  22. The G Man

    The G Man Git 'r doooonnne!!!

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    Wonder if he can play FS? :headscratch:
     
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  23. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Wow...sorry Pat...with Ted Ginn gone and Jason Allen a mere role player now, you've been selected for the "kick me please" position amongst Dolphins fans.

    I'll withhold judgment on White until OTA's/Vet Mini Camp begins, if he throws more accurately, keep him as the WC Qb, if he is spraying the ball around same as last yr..maybe white should look into baseball.
     
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  24. jetssuck

    jetssuck I hear Mandich's voice...

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    Aw come on Pads, still plenty of room in the tent :shifty:
     
  25. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Well, last spring it was Cameron Wake, this year, it's the 3 CFLers and Pat White, in 08 it was Donald Thomas and Jason Allen.

    I just sort of pick a hill to die and while away the early part of the year defending it..that is what I do...:wink2:
     
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  26. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    I've heard it said that "Pat White has small hands"..no doubt that comes from the lack of information that Chad Henne's mitts are 9 inches, White's are 9.25:

    [​IMG]

    His hands look fine.
     
  27. Delfin Alejandro

    Delfin Alejandro Premier League Champs

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    He should be on the small hands commercial...

    [​IMG]

    If he gains weight, Pat will be our returner.... lol
     
  28. #1dolphinsfan

    #1dolphinsfan New Member

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    I disagree yeah Brandon Marshall is a hell of a WR but he isnt going to make Pat White a good QB when Matt Leinart was starting for the Cards he sucked and he had 3 Really good WRs to throw too in Fitzgerald, Boldin, and Breaston and he still really sucked and we only have one really good WR in Brandon Marshall would he help out pat white a little? sure he would but he is going to make him a good QB Pat White isnt a NFL QB IMO the best thing he could do for his career is do what Antwaan Randle El did when he got into the NFL and that is make the switch to WR or some other postion. I dont want to hear anything about how brandon Marshall made Kyle Orton have a good year because to be honest Kyle Orton didnt have a bad year when he started 15 games for Chicago 2 years ago the only things he increased when he went to denver was 4% higher completion % and 3 more TDs
     
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  29. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Funny thing about Orton/Marshall/Denver is they still ran the Wildcat in Denver..with BMarsh on the field...they called it the "wildhorse".
     
  30. Coral Reefer

    Coral Reefer Premium Member

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    Quicker we all forget about this draft pick the better.
    That's all I'll say.
     
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  31. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Let him compete in camp. He looked awful last year. Some of the arguments for him were unbelievable. Other than one carry against the Pats, he averaged around 2.1 yards every time he touched it. 90% of the time he entered, he was a drive stopper.

    That said, if he can compete and if they give all the QB's level playing field - let it happen.

    I don't think he will be better than the other three and should be cut. If he can't compete - give him a chance at another position (which I doubt he will make the team there either) - trade him or cut him and recognize the mistake.
     
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  32. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    My problem with that line of thinking is..why wasn't the same said of Chad Henne after his rookie season?

    White was not a drive stopper, quite the opposite if one cares to dig around up in Club, Vengeful Odin did a study that examined every White appearances and he found White did not stop drives.

    Pat White will have to compete this preseason, let him compete and let's see what he has before committing Ginnocide on Pat White.
     
  33. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=- Club Member

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    What position is he supposed to compete for?
     
  34. jetssuck

    jetssuck I hear Mandich's voice...

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    Are you saying that you didn't notice that tremendous amount of upside last season?

    Or the fact that after Penny handed him a 0-3 hole to climb out of, he went 7-6 against the leagues toughest schedule?

    Maybe ya missed him set the Dolphins single game consecutive completions record?

    I mean come on Pads, to even compare the two is ridiculous....

    Regardless of whether or not White was a drive killer, he was nothing special save a few plays and even then it wasn't really that special. And with this OL, this RB unit and Marshall leading the WR corp, giving a handful of plays to Ronnie to run the WC is enough....Pat White isn't even a WC contributor, he's got his own "little package" and it's just not worth taking Henne off the field. This is a physical offense, physical team..... he's out of place.

    As far as him being a victim of "Ginnocide" (great term btw..lol)...............well he should be and for the same reason, he just doesn't fit on this team.
     
  35. jetssuck

    jetssuck I hear Mandich's voice...

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    I'd suggest 2nd base
     
  36. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    I also saw him singlehandedly lose the Titans and 2nd Bills games.

    Do those count?

    Even then that is not the point, White at the least should be given as much of a chance as Chad Henne had before he became the starter.



    I saw some good flashes out of White's 50 plays, for example "if" he had connected with Ted Ginn in Atlanta, and he had no problems entering the game in pressure packed situations such as the 1st Jets game or the final 25 seconds in the Titans game when Ricky scored the 2pt conversion on the Jet Sweep.

    And there was the bad, the lame duck throw in the Steelers game, the panicky pitch of the ball in the face of a blitz in the wishbone formation..

    But the thing of it is, those are objective comments, both good and bad, most of the time when White is being discussed people grow very biased, meaning "I won't use facts, White is just a waste, why bother with facts"?


    If the glove don't fit, you must acquit!
     
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  37. #1dolphinsfan

    #1dolphinsfan New Member

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    If you run the wildcat with pat white in the game it is the spread or shotgun formation it only works with a RB
     
  38. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I read that and I'm sure I argued about it. The only reason a drive might not have stopped, per se, is because of the plays made after him (mostly on 2nd and 10 or 3rd and 10) by Henne. But, it often put our offense in more difficulty. However, there were plenty of drives that were stopped that he came in on that put the team in those positions and they struggled to convert. Often it came during a drive that was moving and the offense was in a good rhythm passing and running.

    The facts that are meaningful are this: compared to every other offensive set or package, White's package was worse. Henne passing? More yards per play; Henne at QB handing off? More yards per play; Wildcat with Ronnie? More yards per play.

    Any arguments beyond that is special pleading and specious. His offensive set of plays was not only the worst set for the offense, it was just bad overall. His yards per play were atrocious.

    - - - -

    Now about the Chad Henne comparison. Surely you jest, Padre? It's as apples to oranges as it gets. First, he was simply the backup the whole season. There's no criticizing a player for being a backup to the player who was 2nd in MVP voting! That's absurd. Second, without getting any real practice time as a backup, or any packages put in for him (as there were for White), with no starts, he was 7 of 12 in the one game he entered in a pinch (even then, he looked vastly superior to White and had decent stats). Third, he proved in the pre-season his rookie year that he had significant passing talent (going 16 of 20 in the final game) and a great arm.

    If Pat White had shown a rifle, accurate arm; an ability to thread the ball through a needle; if he were a good physical specimen at 6'3, 230 (versus 6'0, 190); things would be different. The problem is he hasn't shown that. If he looked like Drew Brees did in Brees' rookie season, no one would be wondering about the pick. He looked nothing like him.

    Again, the argument I'm saying for Pat is - sure, let him compete. But, from what I've seen from college and from last year (preseason or regular season) he shows zero "flash" (to put it in Tony's words) that he can be an NFL calibre QB.

    The real danger is keeping him over Thigpen - if Thigpen plays better - only because White is a 2nd round pick.
     
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  39. jetssuck

    jetssuck I hear Mandich's voice...

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    The problem is..........there's a cost to this beyond that 2nd round pick. It's a huge risk to spend the time in practice and game snaps, on a package designed around a player that is at or near the bottom talent level, of all the skill position players on the team.

    He's never gonna sell the WC lacking the running ability of Ronnie Brown and all we're left with is a bunch of spread/option stuff that we'd likely be better off using Thigpen for anyway. (Or IMO just forgetting altogether)

    He and that package of his are a distraction, the WC got to their heads and they decided to re-invent the wheel. Well we have some brand new bad *** wheels now.... that's why he's a waste

    It's going to be a tough time getting to 53 players and if we keep him, we're probably going to lose one of those promising young project players that you're so high on.....

    Let me ask you this

    If Pat White returns and looks basically like the same guy as last year and shows no real significant improvement, would you be willing to cut him loose in order to free up that roster spot....... or are you determined to ride him to dust or glory, consequences be damned?
     
  40. Pandarilla

    Pandarilla Purist Emeritus

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    I knew he was pretty much doomed to fail as soon as they said "let's tinker with his throwing mechanics". Like 99.9% of all NFL QB's who've had their throwing style messed with (when will they learn Bernie Kosar, when will they learnnnn!).
     

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