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Tua WAY ahead on Medical schedule

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by DOLFANMIKE, Jun 14, 2020.

  1. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    I would have. No QB since 1978 in the database I have (which admittedly is missing a few QB's) has ever had his first 16 games starting all with below average passer rating. That's how anomalous the situation is.

    I totally agree with KeyFin that it's better to have more prospects on the roster, but that prospect doesn't have to be Rosen. We would have been better off drafting someone else with a low round pick IMO if all you want is another low probability prospect.
     
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  2. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I was firmly against trading for Rosen. I don't agree with the idea that he was "basically free". We traded down in the 2nd in a separate trade. We traded a 2nd and a 5th for him and that 2nd we used probably meant we missed on the player we wanted who was taken by NE and has played well in a similar system. But at this point that's a sunk cost. He's basically a third QB for us now and I didn't then and don't now believe he's likely to ever be a quality starter, but the perception of him being the victim of poor situations and the fact that he's relatively cheap for us gives him value. I only dump him if his value is lower than another player we want to keep. In a non-covid season I wouldn't have been surprised if most teams kept only two QBs on the roster. Right now though I expect teams will take different approaches. Maybe some team with high expectations for this season gets wiped out and they get desperate enough to overpay for Rosen?
     
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  3. Etrius24

    Etrius24 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    We paid almost nothing for Rosen and the Cardinals are paying almost all of his salary. It is a no lose low risk move.

    That said the team was a dumpster fire especially early last season and Rosen got the **** kicked out of him.

    Much like the Tannehill debate... Many people did not ever see him succeeding and leading a team like he did last season when he was in terrible situations in Miami.

    Maybe Rosen does suck... But when you have a green as piss 21 year old QB out there running for his life getting hit every play and getting the **** kicked out of him... It is pretty hard for that 21 year old to succeed.

    Clearly Tua should be the first focus for the future... But I really think that Flores and company saw something in Rosen.

    Flores had no issue getting Harris and Taco out of here. There was no hesitation to ship Minkah away either.

    IMHO if they did not see improvement in the kid and the right attitude and work ethic he would already be gone...

    Remember even though the offers were on the low end... Several teams asked about Rosen at the draft wanting to trade for him.... Miami said no. If they did not see something they would have dumped him for a 6th or 7th round pick like they did with Harris.
     
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  4. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Several here have expressed that and made the case that now's the best time to get value from him in a trade. Others mentioned trading him at the end of last season or on draft day once we landed Tua.

    To switch back to this thread's original topic, it's great news that they're saying Tua is "miraculously ahead of schedule". But in the grand scheme of things it means nothing and could be true or 100% false...we just don't know. As that news article said, it's a turn-off for teams to hear a guy is on schedule for recovery...they want them to be well ahead to sensationalize the outlook just like all media does with everything these days.

    I really hope Tua is the long-term answer, but I'm not betting against Rosen either because we have that two-horse race. The goal is for at least one of them to develop and it's an awesome problem to have, regardless whether Tua is ahead of schedule or not. The "Rona" basically bought him an extra three months to rehab so that's worked in his favor and the team's favor...I can't wait for camps to finally start!
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2020
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  5. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think what they see is more value to us than a 6th or 7th round pick. Which I agree with. We have a ****ty OL we added a bunch of draft picks and FAs with out long track records to. We have a 38 year old starting QB with an injury history and reckless play-style and rookie QB coming off of a catastrophic college injury. I don't equate that with them seeing him as a potential future starter.

    And don't fall in to the mistake of assuming any QB in a bad situation can have a Tannehill like season. It's about evaluating the QB in isolation. Tannehill showed consistent skills regardless of the results. That's why you can't look at stats for those answers. Rosen, in isolation, showed the same consistent issues for 5 seasons now. And they are issues that have proven to rarely be resolved. He's had some decent stat games and a ton of bad ones, but that's more the result of luck or other players making plays. He's been the same guy. Of course with more experience he'll have more of those plays that he's practiced a ton and will be better at, but he's not going from one the worst starting QBs ever to Aaron Rodgers. More realistically he's going from worst to a guy you feel comfortable filling in a couple of games for you. That's where his cheap contract brings us value.
     
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  6. Etrius24

    Etrius24 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Rosen may or may not be garbage.... With Tannehill he got consistent playing time over a few year period where we could see improvement

    Rosen has not had that opportunity as of yet

    Until Rosen gets that chance we really do not have anything to gauge his future on.
     
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  7. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    The Rosen question is an interesting one. As was pointed out, the Cardinals are the ones paying most of his salary so it's not like he's costing us a lot of money. Additionally let's be realistic. Fitzpatrick ain't no spring chicken so his days in Miami are certainly numbered, be it one more season or two more seasons. It appears to me that Flores is looking LONG term and building a team to last for the next decade, not the next year or two.

    As I stated earlier, it was once commonplace for a team to carry 3 quarterbacks on its roster. Now the general rule of thumb is 2. If we don't trade Rosen, that should be a tell that Flores sees him as a viable option, even if it's merely back-up behind Tagovailoa which we are going to need once Fitzpatrick leaves the team.

    If we trade him, then it was a failed experiment that really didn't cost us much of anything. We rolled the dice on a former 1st round draft pick whom we rescued from a dumpster fire of a team and gave him a shot on a team in which we pulled the fire extinguisher out on out own dumpster fire.
     
  8. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    In the COVID era, I can see teams carrying 3 quarterbacks just like I can see them carrying an extra kicker (who probably plays another position as well). I mean, if a player is running a fever it's basically a mandatory 2-week suspension/quarantine with pay, so teams will have to be more versatile in filling out rosters.
     
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  9. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    You make an interesting point. In this age of coronavirus, I can see the logic of the NFL allowing teams to carry more than their 53 man active roster plus practice squad.

    It would make perfect sense to temporarily allow teams to carry up to 10 extra players on their practice squad.
     
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  10. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I just don't agree that three years in college and one in the pros of consistent starting and a couple of starts in Miami equals "not having anything to gauge his future on".
     
  11. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yeah, they'd have to allow unlimited players on injured reserve and a way to get these guys back on the field without making major mid-season cuts, so expanding the practice squad AND making them semi-protected players would make more sense. Maybe make guaranteed practice squad contacts closer to NFL salary level and make players semi-protected from trade (giving us the right to match the offer), something like that where we could drop someone like Rosen or UDA's on the expanded practice squad but not risk losing them.

    Personally, I'd be all about an NFL developmental league similar to baseball. Different coaches, different season (maybe starting in May or June) and make only rookie to 4th year players eligible. Maybe limit rosters to 30-35 players but they can be called up at anytime or moved down and remain semi-protected. That way every team has a Rosen they're developing without stretching that 53-man roster....and we get football for an extra 8-12 weeks.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2020
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  12. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Well after I posted this, I did something more thinking. Ever since I’ve watched football, the standard NFL roster was 53 players.

    There were 6 preseason games always played on Saturday

    There were 14 regular season games always played on Sunday.

    The came Monday Night Football (yes I’m that old lol)

    Then the regular season games expanded to 16 games and reduced preseason to 4.

    Then came Thursday Night Football.

    And the standard roster has remained 53 players.

    With the addition of 2 more games that MEAN something and players playing full bore...and the reduced rest teams have with Thursday night games, thus increasing injuries, the league really needs to look at expanding teams’ rosters permanently to make up for the more physically difficult schedules teams are playing.
     
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  13. The Guy

    The Guy Well-Known Member

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    When you consider the comparison between the percentage of QBs who were drafted highly and never panned out and the much smaller percentage who were drafted highly, played poorly initially due to poor surroundings, and then rebounded to have great careers, the default explanation for poor play initially should be that the QB is simply inadequate. Poor surroundings as an explanation is the exception to the rule.

    Being drafted highly shouldn't create some magical expectation that defies performance.
     
  14. Drizzy

    Drizzy Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    a 2nd round pick is almost nothing?
     
  15. 61Finfan

    61Finfan New Member

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    While I would love to see Tua on the field this season, i would also like to see Rosen play and make sure we wouldn't be parting with a gem if we do let him go. Medically cleared Tua doesn't mean game ready to me.
     
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