Tua...''He's the greatest prospect ever''

"JJ_79 wrote:

Nice Highschool footage but I‘m happy he now plays like he plays. I don’t wanna see any of that Cam Newton, Tebow or whatever stuff on Sundays.

Does seem to show how much his speed and quickness was reduced by the hip injury. I wonder if he gets any more of it back.

"FinFaninBuffalo wrote:

Does seem to show how much his speed and quickness was reduced by the hip injury. I wonder if he gets any more of it back.

I mean what is he at 90% of the time he’s dropping and ripping it faster than anyone in the game..?

I mean I do think he needs to threaten the D every week with some on purpose runs thru the lane, slide, standup, spin the ball and then look at the defense over your shoulder back to the huddle type plays

Defenses are getting deeper in their drops, I’m seeing crowded parts of the field in the backend area

"djphinfan wrote:

I mean what is he at 90% of the time he’s dropping and ripping it faster than anyone in the game..?

I mean I do think he needs to threaten the D every week with some on purpose runs thru the lane, slide, standup, spin the ball and then look at the defense over your shoulder back to the huddle type plays

Defenses are getting deeper in their drops, I’m seeing crowded parts of the field in the backend area

I‘m fine with that but I don’t wanna see him running like he did in the beginning of the clip and I don’t wanna see him trucking people. I’m happy he plays a lot smarter now!

"OwesOwn614 wrote:

Tua Tagovailoa has won 11 straight games vs. head coaches that have won a Super Bowl. Tua is 6-0 vs. Bill Belichick, only QB to win his 1st 6 games vs. single SB-winning HC in NFL history

Tua also has the most passing yards (2,416) through 8 games than any QB in Dolphins history pic.twitter.com/vO155l6cmk

— Cameron Wolfe (@CameronWolfe) October 29, 2023

Head coaches don’t suit up on the field.

"Finatik wrote:

Head coaches don’t suit up on the field.

The head coach is much more important than you seem to be indicating.

"The_Dark_Knight wrote:

The head coach is much more important than you seem to be indicating.

They are important. We've seen that 1st hand. But they also don't throw the ball, block, tackle, catch the ball, pick the right hole to run through, cover someone, play with injuries, or kick the ball. You can have the greatest game plan but the players HAVE TO EXECUTE IT. It's just like saying that Tua has X amount of wins in his career vs. another QB.

"FinFaninBuffalo wrote:

https://x.com/i/web/status/1718823009006633142

He's the most likely of our guys to get a gold jacket. Especially since he won a ring in Kansas City.

Tua is so good that they are trying to change the analytics out of his favor now. All we heard for two years was Tua had no air yards, all he throws is 2 yard slants. Now he's the leader and this is happening. :sidelol:

This was after Herbert's check down and screen clinic last night.

"The_Dark_Knight wrote:

The head coach is much more important than you seem to be indicating.

Head coach is very important, but don't discount the effect of a great QB. Best example is Belichick being an average HC in NE without Brady (as well as average in Cleveland) while being considered maybe the greatest ever with 6 SB's with Brady. The player — especially an elite QB — has a massive influence on the game. McDaniel has also done poorly without Tua, though it's very small sample size.

"TheHighExhaulted wrote:

Justin Herbert peppered the Bears underneath, completing 27 of 30 passes under 10 air yards for 222 yards & 3 TD (+8.2% CPOE).

Herbert averaged the 2nd-lowest air yards per attempt of his career (4.9) and recorded a season-high 60.0% success rate.#CHIvsLAC | #BoltUp pic.twitter.com/BAoyi6WHLU

— Next Gen Stats (@NextGenStats) October 30, 2023

This was after Herbert's check down and screen clinic last night.

We'll see how Herbert ends up this year, but this is the first year he might end up in that statistically "elite" category. Average rating in the NFL this year is 89.3 thus far, and Herbert is at 101.1, which is the first time he's over 1 standard deviation above the mean.

It's still the case Tua > Herbert, not just in terms of overall career rating thus far (not a big difference, but still: 97.8 vs. 96.8) but more importantly in terms of the ability to put together an elite offense around him.

"TheHighExhaulted wrote:

https://x.com/i/web/status/1719011690275057999

Tua is so good that they are trying to change the analytics out of his favor now. All we heard for two years was Tua had no air yards, all he throws is 2 yard slants. Now he's the leader and this is happening. :sidelol:

Tua now being carried by his pass protection. A totally ridiculous statement that I am happy to hear.

"Finatik wrote:

They are important. We've seen that 1st hand. But they also don't throw the ball, block, tackle, catch the ball, pick the right hole to run through, cover someone, play with injuries, or kick the ball. You can have the greatest game plan but the players HAVE TO EXECUTE IT. It's just like saying that Tua has X amount of wins in his career vs. another QB.

All true but to make my mic drop moment in how important the head coach is…

Tua with Flores vs Tua with McDaniel.

Same player, same skills, same abilities, but one knows what to do with it while the other knows how to cry racism being a man of color…fired by a man of color.

"TheHighExhaulted wrote:

https://x.com/i/web/status/1719011690275057999

Tua is so good that they are trying to change the analytics out of his favor now. All we heard for two years was Tua had no air yards, all he throws is 2 yard slants. Now he's the leader and this is happening. :sidelol:

"He has a noodle arm."
"But his throws travel further downfield than all of the other QBs. And with greater accuracy than most."
"Successfully throwing the ball downfield doesn't show how strong your arm is."

"OwesOwn614 wrote:

"He has a noodle arm."
"But his throws travel further downfield than all of the other QBs. And with greater accuracy than most."
"Successfully throwing the ball downfield doesn't show how strong your arm is."

If only we had a strong armed QB who could throw from the 50 yard line and hit Tyreek in stride 5 yards deep in the end zone for what's officially recorded as a 42 yard TD.
It's such a pity Tua's noodle arm prevents him from making such throws.

It's true though, arm strength isn't about throwing it 60 yards. It's about how fast you can throw the ball on outs or whatever...like a weaker arm has to throw sooner.

I'm not trying to argue over how strong he is or isn't, but let's be honest in our discussion. I don't think the people you're referring to were ever arguing that Tua couldn't throw the ball downfield.

Tua has a weaker arm than some other QBs, but the main point is it doesn't matter. Anyone focusing on arm strength when production is very high is focusing on what does NOT matter in evaluating that QB. Tua is integral to us having the #1 offense because his accuracy and decision-making speed more than compensate for any physical weaknesses.

"resnor wrote:

It's true though, arm strength isn't about throwing it 60 yards. It's about how fast you can throw the ball on outs or whatever...like a weaker arm has to throw sooner.

I'm not trying to argue over how strong he is or isn't, but let's be honest in our discussion. I don't think the people you're referring to were ever arguing that Tua couldn't throw the ball downfield.

I'd suggest that since #1 is riding a 2-year wave of leading the league in YPA, air yards, AND downfield accuracy (which admittedly affects the first stat), the question isn't if arm strength isn't a desired trait but if it's overrated. Tua doesn't have Burrow's or Herbert's arm strength but he's been playing at a higher level than both. At some point, it might be nice to have a car that accelerates from 0 to 60 in 4 seconds but practically, a car that takes 6 seconds to get there is more than good enough. I know people who would call the second car "slow".

Everybody has an idea of what attributes they prefer. I prefer leadership and the ability to get the ball to playmakers (wherever they are downfield) over the ability to throw a 60-yard pass that might connect 30% of the time. My QB may not fit the profile for the ideal QB but nobody else does either and he's plenty good enough.

"cbrad wrote:

Tua has a weaker arm than some other QBs, but the main point is it doesn't matter. Anyone focusing on arm strength when production is very high is focusing on what does NOT matter in evaluating that QB. Tua is integral to us having the #1 offense because his accuracy and decision-making speed more than compensate for any physical weaknesses.

Exactly. Drew Brees had a much weaker arm than Daunte Culpepper but I think we all know which one we would rather have had as our QB.

"cbrad wrote:

Tua has a weaker arm than some other QBs, but the main point is it doesn't matter.

The people that are calling Tua's arm weak support this argument by saying his arm is not on the level of Herbert, Mahomes, etc. Problem is, while the last part is true, it's basically like saying that 1997 Toyota Supra (with a twin turbo) is slow because it "only" has a top speed of almost 180 MPH while a Lamborghini Aventador has a top speed of 217 MPH, which ignores the fact that 180 MPH is still freaking fast.

"cbrad wrote:

Tua has a weaker arm than some other QBs, but the main point is it doesn't matter. Anyone focusing on arm strength when production is very high is focusing on what does NOT matter in evaluating that QB. Tua is integral to us having the #1 offense because his accuracy and decision-making speed more than compensate for any physical weaknesses.

Tua is proof that a QB's arm doesn't need to be strong. It just needs to be strong enough. From nfl.com's next-gen stats, where he was rated the second-best deep passer last season:

Rank
2 Tua Tagovailoa - Miami Dolphins · Age 25

• Deep attempts: 27-of-50, 891 yards, 10:2 TD-INT, 122.1 passer rating

• Deep comp: 54%

• Deep xComp: 43.6%

• Deep CPOE: +10.4%

• PASSING SCORE (on deep attempts): 99

The first half of Tagovailoa's season sure was special. In Weeks 1-9, Tagovailoa completed 15-of-25 deep attempts for 480 yards, a 5:2 TD-to-INT ratio, a 110.4 passer rating, a 97 passing score and a CPOE of +14.7%. His EPA per deep-pass dropback was an eye-popping +1.27.


This is where you're expecting me to tell you everything fell apart, given the additional time Tagovailoa missed with concussion issues and Miami's reduced output over a 3-5 stretch to finish the season. But the QB's numbers don't quite fit that narrative: It turns out his performance didn't vary significantly when comparing the two halves of 2022. The biggest difference in his deep-passing stats the rest of the way ended up being in CPOE, in which Tagovailoa dropped by more than eight percentage points. Otherwise, he posted a perfect 5:0 TD-to-INT ratio from Week 10 on. In other words, he was good -- really good -- at throwing deep throughout the season, finishing as the only qualifying quarterback in the entire NFL with a deep passing EPA per dropback over 1.


If not for the spectacular year of the top QB on this list, Tagovailoa would have been No. 1. Second place isn't too bad, either.

https://www.nfl.com/news/next-gen-stats-top-10-nfl-deep-passers-of-2022-geno-smith-tua-tagovailoa-excel-a

Among the elite traits that some self indicting dum asses can’t see is the ability to now look one way to move defenders and throw in another direction without changing to much of the footwork involved to get square to the target

This is incredibly nuanced Qb’ing that the national pundits can’t see because they don’t have a clue on how to evaluate the position