1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

The reality behind the run defense .....

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Rock Sexton, Nov 10, 2015.

  1. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    I wanted Kuechly back then. But I also wanted Jordan lol


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  2. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

    9,660
    8,971
    113
    Sep 28, 2015
    I was skeptical of Dion due to his odd percentage of time in plays. When healthy he was playing like 33% of the defensive snaps. Thats strange.

    Luke was a sure fire top player but to be fair it was simply time we drafted a QB, too bad we didnt know what to do with him.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  3. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    96,142
    48,844
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    kuechly.. then wilson for me....boom
     
  4. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    96,142
    48,844
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    also loved dion jordan...blahhh
     
  5. Pandarilla

    Pandarilla Purist Emeritus

    14,269
    4,979
    113
    Sep 10, 2009
    Boone, NC
    Ervybody knows they should have stuck him at LB from day one.
     
  6. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

    10,182
    3,751
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    It's not Suh's fault. He's doing what he's supposed to do. Our 'Backers.... not so much.
     
  7. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

    3,075
    2,921
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    I disagree. LBs need to more situationally aware than DEs. So far Dion Jordan has shown about 0% ability to diagnose plays. He's fine when you give him a 1 dimensional assignment, but he's a liability when he has to make decision, I've seen him run himself out of positions on too many plays to ever want him playing LB for the phins.

    From a physical toolset perspective he's a great OLB, but from a mental perspective he makes Jason Allen look like Zach Thomas.
     
    Finster likes this.
  8. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    Although, in hindsight, it seems crazy to say now, I never felt like Dion had a chance to succeed. He was a 3-4 OLB in college and was able to cover extremely well. Even in the pros he covered Gronk well when given the chance, from what I remember.

    He was brought in, told to bulk up and become a 4-3 DE. Made zero sense to me. His agility and covering skills were ignored. It's no wonder he gave up. It's like Tomsula trying to make Kaepernick a pocket passer.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Fin-O and djphinfan like this.
  9. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    I have a buddy that told me about Wilson then. Both of us disliked Tannehill and felt he was being hyped up too much. There's always that one guy that all of a sudden their stocks rise because of speculation.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Finster likes this.
  10. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    That's what I'm saying. But of course Ireland and Philbin were a heck of a duo. Couple of brainiacs right there.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  11. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

    3,087
    2,038
    113
    Jul 27, 2013
    He showed that in college too, he has a low football IQ, and also is really lacking in the strength dept, I thought he was more of a 4th or 5th round project, and we've had 2 guys drafted way behind him that have become better than him in Shelby and Fede.
     
  12. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

    3,075
    2,921
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    hypothesis 1: DJ is a natural OLB whose talents were wasted by professional football coaches who've been coaching football all their adult lives and whose jobs depended on making sure DJ is not a bust.

    hypothesis 2: DJ has low football IQ and cannot be trusted to make good decisions in space in the NFL.

    Hypothesis 2 is backed up by plenty of game tape both in college and for the phins. Yes he can do amazing things like cover gronk i th epassing game, but in the same game gronk destroyed him in run blocking and DJ made no impact as a pash rusher. Hypothesis 1 is backed up by what ?
     
  13. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    What position did he play for us, what was he in college, who coached him when he did well and who coached him when he did poorly?

    He didn't have a low football IQ. He wasn't cut out to be a 4-3 DE. By your own admission he made no impact as a pass rusher. So why was he put in that position? Was that helping him succeed? Who did we have at OLB then and now instead of him? Exactly.

    Literally everything you mentioned was negative about Jordan the converted 4-3 DE. We've got a converted QB that was a WR. That's Ireland for you.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  14. NorFlaFin

    NorFlaFin Active Member

    The last couple of games the announcers have mentioned that Kelvin Shepherd is liked by the staff as knows how to play behind Suh. To me this is a head scratcher, but I've heard this before when Suh was in Detroit. Finding a top shelf MLB or finding a guy that playoff a guy like Suh

    Strange comment but it's been repeated the last couple of games.
     
  15. Colmax

    Colmax Well-Known Member

    5,126
    3,241
    113
    Dec 12, 2007
    I don't think it's strange. He has been solid as of recent.

    I'm a fan of Sheppard. Not a stat freak, just see an athletic guy who has the ability to make good tackles. He missed a bunch earlier in the year, but I think he was more or less 'overthinking' things. Took wrong angles. Missed openings.

    You see that he stepped up last game. Had a bunch of good tackles. He did admirably in the middle last game given who else he had playing to the sides of him. Looked like he had good control of the defense. Of course, he can't really cover a TE (much less an Escobar who is 6'8" or so), but not many LBs can do that with any real frequency. I like him. Yes, he makes mistakes. But I think we are seeing a guy who is getting better each week. That's better than some on this team.
     
  16. Rocky Raccoon

    Rocky Raccoon Greasepaint Ghost Staff Member

    27,710
    27,684
    113
    Dec 2, 2007
    Jersey
    The run defense is frustrating because it's all or nothing. We'll stuff them 5 straight times for no or little gain, then they'll break out a 30 yarder. Tells me the linebackers aren't doing a good enough job plugging their holes consistently.
     
    Puka-head and Colmax like this.
  17. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    96,142
    48,844
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    Well Pauly, I have them as making a huge mistake on where to play him and at what size..There is no question in my past prof opinion, that his body should of been kept at 250..no question, so I chalk the mistake up between the coaches not seeing the position that he would of excelled at and the streghth staff for not advising the coaches that their plan to make him add weight was a mistake...movement was key relative to his unique body type, he was long and tall, no way you add weight to that frame, keep it lean and quick was the way to go..and we all saw the evidence of what that weight did to his movement and explosiveness...pure lethargy..

    but, who knows, he still may of ended up in the same place..
     
  18. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    Do we need Jones to make every tackle?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Puka-head likes this.
  19. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

    10,182
    3,751
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    Seems like it
     
  20. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

    3,075
    2,921
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    I think the disparity in our opinions comes down to the discrepancy between DJ's physical attributes (Perfect 3-4 OLB) and his mental attributes (Dumb as a sack of hammers). My opinion is that if you have a DASH player, the DE is safer than OLB. Your opinion is that we should have applied his physical attributes in a way that minimized the effects of being DASH.
     
  21. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

    6,120
    7,916
    113
    Nov 1, 2009
    Yeah, I'd say the four most responsible for the defense playing poorly is Lazor, Tannehill, Ross and Hickey. Because what PFF doesn't tell you is that when our offense has single digit first downs over a three game stretch COMBINED, the defense is getting worked like third-world labor in a sneaker factory. I don't care what team it is in the NFL- if they're playing 85-100 snaps per game, they're going to give up some points in the late quarters.

    But hey....go Tannehill!
     
    mlb1399 and Agua like this.
  22. Jaj

    Jaj Registered

    6,361
    1,671
    0
    Mar 23, 2008
    Los Angeles
    If you want to run the 4-3 OVER you have to have some really good LBs. Just saying. Oh ya and good CBs...
     
  23. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    Which is hilarious because we got rid of Dansby, Davis and Smith. Philbin and Ireland together is like mixing Indian food with laxatives. Pure ****.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  24. Jaj

    Jaj Registered

    6,361
    1,671
    0
    Mar 23, 2008
    Los Angeles
    It's absolutely ridiculous. Truly idiotic even.

    They have a perfect model to look at from the early 00s as to what this defense is supposed to look like and yet somehow they thought that Mitchell and Misi would work? Have they ever seen just how fast that early 00s defense was? Thomas would be in the backfield while the handoff was going on. That's how instinctive a 4-3 over is. It works based off of speed, power relative to speed, and instincts. On what planet has Sheppard ever shown instincts? Scooby Wright at MLB, Jaylon Smith at OLB? Then maybe we're talking about the NFL's best and yes, I'm saying it. Possibly the NFL's best front seven next year.
     
  25. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    Anybody else see Dansby's pick six last night? Hartline did well too. Every time I watch our old Dolphins they always seem to be doing okay to good. Carroll was kicking butt earlier this year, I don't know about now.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  26. Itsdahumidity

    Itsdahumidity X gonna take it from ya

    2,073
    1,194
    113
    Dec 10, 2007
    I don't miss Hartline but Dansby seems like he's found a second wind. Carroll was having a good season until he got injured & put on IR I believe. But he did get torched for 3 TDs his last game.
     
  27. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    Against Megatron in one on one coverage, right?

    I don't miss Hartline but he was Tannehill's favorite target at a good price.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  28. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

    3,087
    2,038
    113
    Jul 27, 2013
    I didn't mind Hartline as a WR, but I did think 6 mil per was too much, he was worth about half that imo.
     
  29. Itsdahumidity

    Itsdahumidity X gonna take it from ya

    2,073
    1,194
    113
    Dec 10, 2007
    Was it Megatron? That's crazy if they didn't give Carroll help. Chip is trying to make sure no other college coach gets full control in the pros.
     
  30. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    We could've resigned him for less but instead we let him go to the Browns. Pretty sure he said he hoped he'd return one day, so that's my basis.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  31. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

    2,547
    600
    113
    Dec 14, 2014
    Yup. Megatron single handedly destroyed the Lions.

    Chip went way too far. He got rid of a bunch of talent. He's treating the NFL like college.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  32. Puka-head

    Puka-head My2nd Fav team:___vs Jets Club Member

    6,423
    2,630
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    Slightly left of center
    By far the most aggravating example is Rob Nincovich. We sure could use that guy now.
     

Share This Page