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the John Beck story

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by padre31, May 10, 2011.

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  1. DolfanJake

    DolfanJake Banned

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    There are some here that say its unfair to judge Henne on his small sample of games (20 + games actually), yet are willing to trash Beck on 3 or 4 games started with the Dolphins, and yes on one of the worst teams ever in the NFL.

    Where is the sense of fairness ?
     
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  2. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    That is how badly people overrated the draft Aqua.

    As for Beck, keep in mind folks he was the #1 rated Qb that yr, Cleveland traded up for Quinn, and the Eagles took Kolb ahead of Beck.

    His tools were the best in class, he had the "x number of passes in the NCAA means NFL success" metric as well.

    Lights came on, he vanished, to bad as I really liked him as a prospect.
     
  3. DolfanJake

    DolfanJake Banned

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    I am not doing that, I am just amazed at some here who keep wanting to give Henne chance after chance, yet have totally dismissed Beck given the fact that Beck never had the opportunities that Henne has had.

    Yet they are some of the same people that tell me I am wrong for not liking Henne and that I haven't given him a fair chance.

    Duplicitous indeed !
     
  4. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    So your answer is "I should have looked at the people drafted after them before I said that"?
     
  5. DolfanJake

    DolfanJake Banned

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    You're not taking into the account that had we stuck with Beck, and not gotten Penny, our whole draft & history would have been different. Its actually impossible to tell what would have happened, but they is a chance we could have been better off in that scenario.
     
  6. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    I mean people act as if good college play means great NFL transition.

    Matt Ryan was not amazing at BC. Neither was Brady at Michigan. Graham Harrell was beyond great at Texas Tech and Colt Brennan was great at Hawaii. just because Beck looked good at BYU, doesn't mean he was destined to be good in the NFL. Henne has looked downright incredible at times in the NFL though, which counts for more:

    2009 Jets, 2010 Jets, 2010 Raiders, 2010 Packers, 2010 Lions first half (whole game if you blame INT's on falling receivers, 2010 Titans, 2010 Bills (second game) before we got into the redzone.
     
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  7. DolfanJake

    DolfanJake Banned

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    This goes back to a discussion yesterday we had......are you satisfied with being in the playoffs and a very good team, or are you in this to win it all ?

    I think 2008 hurt our long range development into becoming an elite team. If we had stunk again in 2008, our draft would have been totally different because our placement in the draft would have been different.
     
  8. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Incredible?

    He has looked downright credible
     
  9. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    Happy to see John Beck love is still alive and well on the Phins.com

    But let's not forget this is the guy who couldn't handle a snap.

    [video=youtube;rDIqcHBkyJs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDIqcHBkyJs[/video]

    If the Skins start John Beck, it won't last long and we'll see Rex Grossman in no time.
     
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  10. DOLFANMIKE

    DOLFANMIKE FOOTBALL COACH 32 YEARS Luxury Box

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    No, my answer is if you want to look up an entire draft full of players and pull out the many picks that were better, then go ahead and do it. I'm not obligated to appease you buddy. :no:
     
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  11. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Beck played pretty awful that first year. Reality is probably Henne and Beck both suck. But it'll be fun to see if John outperforms Henne this year, or if neither is given the chance because John gets ousted by Vince Young and Chad gets ousted by Kyle Orton.
     
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  12. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    The thought of Miami trading for Orton grossly upsets me.....
     
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  13. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Someone wake me when John Beck starts taking snaps from center in a real game. I'm happy he got out of Miami and may get an opportunity, but he's done absolutely nothing in the NFL to this point.
     
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  14. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Beck didn't get any reps until 2-3 days before his first start. It is completely unfair to judge him based on those 4 games. If we can judge him based on those four games, then we can judge Henne based on his 3 years and so if Beck sucks then Henne sucks. Selective criticism going on here. Henne has had two offseasons, and a year under Pennington before his first start, he has zero excuse.

    Beck may be ruined forever. He just might be. Or maybe these few years in the background have helped him. Who knows. We'll see sooner rather than later. Henne to me has no excuse. He has time, another year perhaps, to prove us wrong. I don't want to hear anything about him losing receivers, blocking, etc. in a thread where we say Beck sucks because he won zero games that won zero games with Trent Green.
     
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  15. PhinsRDbest

    PhinsRDbest Transform and Transcend

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    Isn't he the catcher for the Marlins?
     
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  16. JimToss

    JimToss Thank You Chad Pennington

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    I hope he get his chance and plays well. But from what I saw I highly doubt it.
     
  17. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    [​IMG]

    A John Beck thread has exceeded 50 posts!! Stop the presses!! Nearly 3 years later and John Beck still haunts our message boards!
     
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  18. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    Please. I literally everywhere limited to anyone in the second round after they got picked. If you don't want to look at the second round after White and Henne got picked, that's because there was no one there. It's not about appeasing me. It's about supporting your own statement with a fact or two.
     
  19. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    What would be the point in even responding when we both know you would prefer a player John Elway doesn't like in Denver over a guy who has actually played in the NFL beyond 2-3 games?
     
  20. Killerphins

    Killerphins The Finger

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    :lol:

    Not a chance. :wink2:
     
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  21. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    I have never seen more hate of a player in your own franchise in my life. Oh that Dolphins pride. Drink it in. And we "deserve" home wins.
     
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  22. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    Like who, Jeff Ireland?
     
  23. Killerphins

    Killerphins The Finger

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    There are people here that hope Beck has a better season than Henne.
    That is some pure hatred.
     
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  24. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    Relax KM, it's not hate. Its ignorance.
     
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  25. CrunchTime

    CrunchTime Administrator Retired Administrator

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    The NFL can be cruel at times and it helps to be lucky which John Beck was not. .Beck lost his mentor when Cam was fired and the new regime was looking for other options of their choice .You cant argue that Pennington was the better bet.

    Maybe Beck's luck will turn this time around.I wish him well.
     
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  26. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    It happens a lot. Look at Harrington and Carr.
     
  27. rdhstlr23

    rdhstlr23 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I was all about the Ginn/Beck connection. I thought it was brilliant by Mueller. It didn't work out in Miami, but I hope he does well in Washington. He's a real good guy.

    As for the story...can you blame either side really?

    John Beck wanted a shot and asked for his release-rightfully so.
    Chad Pennington was available, so Parcells went out and got him. We drafted a QB that we liked to compete with John Beck & Josh McCown. That seems like a solid move. Our QB situation was very unstable, so why not?
     
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  28. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    Actual John Beck game day picture:

    [​IMG]
     
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  29. Killerphins

    Killerphins The Finger

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    I would love to know the "We" list Travis.
    The organization chose not to reach for QB's in this draft.
    I'm giving Henne another shot under Daboll.
     
  30. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    hate or disappointment?
    hate or frustration?
    hate or disillusionment?
    hate or indignation?
    hate or disgust?
    hate or disagreement?


    hate is an often ill-used & provocative word

    GoFish!:dolphin: &

    may the hen spread his wings becoming an eagle in 2011 :yes: or be traded to them in 2012
     
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  31. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Well, here is some food for thought, "what if"

    -John Beck had not been released, and had remained our #3 qb?

    Would we have drafted Pat White? Would folks have rather have had:

    Beck+the #44 pick and a 5th rd pick (which became Cam Sheffield who injured his neck in the 2010 preseason and has not played a down)

    or

    Tom Brandstater+Tyler Thigpen?

    In that sense, this was a poor football decision, it would have made far more sense to let Beck play clipboard holder and to have not drafted P White, and I liked the White pick at the time but just goes to show why I am a fan and not a GM.
     
  32. JMHPhin

    JMHPhin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Thats your opinion on one hand you say Henne sucks but Beck got a bad rap. (I agree) but because there are some that believe not everything was Hennes fault and that we didnt have the greatest options at a clear upgrade so we might as well see if the changes made allow Henne to show the potential we thought he had in 09 doesnt make us any more biased than you. If you think you are anymore objective than say me who supports henn getting a shot at competing then sorry but that baffles me.

    tell me is it the 550k that Henne is making that prohibits us from getting someone else? he isnt costing ius anything.
    what was our best option that clearly undebateably upgrades teh position over Henne? VY? please. Hasselback? Maybe if he is able to play, how long ago was that? McNabb? he didnt look any better than Henne yet you think he is going to revert back to mid decade MCNabb? considering the regression has been over longer than 1 year I say not so fast. Kolb? again AJ feeley looked like a star how did that turn out? I fear giving a 1 for a guy from that system that has started 4 games. Palmer? I like that gamble if he is a FA but cinci isnt cutting him. Who else was a sure upgrade? That says dont keep Henne and let him compete? I see noone, those that do are ones that hate Henne so much that any scenario in theri head is better option and cant go wrong.

    The objective analysis says the draft didnt give us a sure upgrade where teh risk was worth it, FA class and trade options with lockout are nil. so again whayt were the options? SZo Henne gets a shot and yes some think when he has a coach coach him to his strengths and he gets confidence back may develop into what we thought he could be. We also know he may not. But under teh circumstances we will give it time and see what happens
     
  33. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    Miami has had some god awful QB's since Marino retired and Beck is squarely pegged at #2. Ray Lucas gets #1 because of his awesome 6 turnover, (4 interceptions and 2 fumbles) game where he completed only 13 passes to our WR's. Nate Clements actually caught the most passes from Lucas that day.
     
  34. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Pittsburgh drafted Big Ben, after coming off a rare down year for them that had them picking like 11th though.
    Indy probably had more 1st overall picks and top 5 overall picks throughout the 90s than any other team. Otherwise they don't have Manning and would be a team that wallowed in mediocrity over the last decade.
     
  35. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    I would also include:
    hate or ignorance?
     
  36. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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  37. Hobiesailor

    Hobiesailor Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    I guess you forgot Eddie "F***in" Moore
     
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  38. DolfanJake

    DolfanJake Banned

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    He would be my most hated PICK of the 2000's, but I don't hate the man.
     
  39. jetssuck

    jetssuck I hear Mandich's voice...

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    Beck had some decent touch on his passes but I have never in my life seen a QB so thoroughly **** himself upon the snap of the ball.

    I don't think he has the sack to get it done
     
  40. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    miami cut-bust
    raven backup-not bust

    will be the starting QB in Washington

    interesting
     

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