Fully agree, saw him pick up some steam after his pro day, checked out his games and saw nothing remarkable.
I don't even have that high a grade on him. When I watched his tape I thought he's a guy I'd like to invite to camp because there's a possibility that his technical skills keep improving to such a degree that you have a nice, reliable player...but not a guy I'm investing in.
All I got from that video is that Mike Hull (#43 for Penn State) looks exactly like Zach Thomas. (Not necessarily the way he plays, but just the way he moves and in uniform)
Demarcus Lawrence 223 snaps, 11 hurries, 10 sacks, 2 knockdowns, 0 PDs PRR = 9.69, PRR+= 9.69 Alright, I've heard some people talk about Lawrence as one of the best pure pass rushers in the draft. I'm not so sure about that, but he was solid. He came out in between Gayle/Martin and the 1st round group. His 223 snaps is the lowest of the group as Boise State used some weird rotations at times. He did rack up 11 hurries, but 44% of his production came from sacks rather than hurries and knockdowns. Realistically I think you'd want to find a guy who was getting more hurries consistently rather than racking up a ton of sacks, but still solid. He split his snaps pretty evenly from LDE and RDE, 122 and 101 snaps respectively. PRR of 10.17 at LDE and 9.18 at RDE. Pretty much a wash. Deciding between Marcus Smith, Crichton, and Attaochu for next.
Quick question. With guys that are racking up a higher percentage of sacks as opposed to hurries, are you finding that most of their pressures look a bit unearned? Sometimes those edge rushers end up with nobody really blocking them. But guys like Kareem Martin, James Gayle and Jadaveon Clowney will almost never have someone failing to block them on a pass rush (perhaps a zone stretch run play but not a pass play unless it's a naked boot).
I would say that's a true statement in particular for Barr and Lawrence. But Barr definitely moreso than any of the others because he had a few hurries where he just came off the edge and hurried the QB while unblocked. Of course, I can't discount that play. Lawrence a little less because he lined over the B gap in Boise St's alignment more than a few times and he didn't get as many free rushes off the edge. However he did still get a few freebies. Martin had 2-3 hurries I would say that he got while lined up wide with no blockers, but that's less in the grand scheme of things when you have 23 hurries in total.
I suppose now that I think about it, I should've qualified Dee Ford as more of a guy who ends up picked up and blocked like a defensive end. I think Barr and Lawrence were moved around more. I'm just wondering how many of these guys pressures were kind of created versus earned. Personally I don't think you'd be unjustified tossing out blockless pressures.
At 6'2 215, really well built athlete, strong hands and body, great vertical ability, very good in traffic, a true hand catcher,and a good aggressive nature on the field, he's been running a lot specific scheme routes in that offense, much better prospect that Tandon Ross coming out..imo a late 2nd round pick.
One nice positive Greg about all the Tom Savage love of late is new videos are coming out of him which means new video on Devin Street. It's not that I feel like Devin Street is forgotten, this is just a pretty good receiver class. However, sometimes I do feel like people need a little nudge.
Yeah I still think Street can carve himself a nice role. Personally, if we're talking Cody Latimer - I see no reason why you would take him over Devin Street. Latimer went a little faster in his 40 at his pro-day where he was anywhere between 4.38 and 4.44 where Street posted between a 4.46 and 4.50 at his. I think Street has an advantage in his versatility, and a lot of experience getting deep for a taller WR - moreso than Latimer I would guess. In one thread (could have been in Club or here) there was talk about the Dolphins looking for big guys in the slot. Again, Street has that experience and also...was a captain. Curious to see if the Dolphins would give him a look in the mid to late rounds.
Devin Street was used in the slot a lot and he was a big play guy with like a 17 yard per catch average, as many TDs as Tyler Boyd (who is going to be a 1st rounder one day).
To me Latimer is like a bigger James Jones type with slightly better speed. I say that b/c, even though he might not possess one eye-popping trait, he doesn't have any weaknesses either from a talent standpoint, has the requisite size, hands, and movement ability to eventually line up at all 3 positions which adds to his value, and even though he's not quite Allen Robinson after the catch, he offers more than enough athleticism and playmaking ability to do damage against single coverage, in a spread offense, and inside the redzone. Whereas Robinson wows you more with individual plays, I feel Latimer offers the greater level of play per play consistency which I personally would rather have. Plus he has big hands, has a natural feel for mixing up speeds, and should be an asset as a blocker. He's not a #1 WR, but IMO he could end up producing like one in the right system [like Green Bay or similar that can spread the field and fully utilize his impressive combination of burst, lateral speed/agility off the line, and stop/start/redirect ability for a guy his size] or in an offense with a #1 WR affording him single coverage to exploit. If you can put him in either of those 2 situations I think the production potential is enough to warrant a top 45 pick. IMO he actually does have a dynamic aspect to his game, and that's running quick in-breaking routes [like 0:58 below] where he has the burst off the line to command respect, which sets up his size, suddenness, COD ability, and lateral speed to gain favorable inside position, and then the burst again after the catch to split the defenders. That's money. Very Keenan Allen-esque in that regard. That aspect of his game will become difficult to defend once he becomes more comfortable and more consistent with his out breaking routes to where corners have to play him more honestly. Actually I think Keenan Allen is a fairly close comparison, however as their trade goes I'd say Latimer is developmentally behind Allen and doesn't have the same feel for the game. [video=youtube;fYO2qhgXD6s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYO2qhgXD6s[/video]
Nobody probably remembers Alejandro Villanueva of Army back from 2010 but I do because I watched him up close in Shrine practice for a week. He just finished four tours of duty in Afghanistan. He was 6'9" & 280 lbs coming out of Army. Saw enough at Shrine practice that I have no interest in him as a tight end (at least not a real one) or a wide receiver even though he played those at Army. But as a tackle? I'd invite him to camp. Can't hurt. He can replace Will Yeatman. Maybe his apartment won't be known among teammates as a den for pot smokers. Bengals work with a guy like this by the name of Dennis Roland as a 3rd offensive tackle/tight end. He's like 6'10" & 309 lbs. Bring Ali onto the field as that kind of player and hey at least you know he CAN go out and catch if you want to be tricksome hobbitses. [video=youtube;nsgYKIt9flk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsgYKIt9flk[/video]
I agree, I have Allen as the better prospect, but this kids strength, hands and excellent athleticism is a nice combination, and just adds to a very deep class.
Since we are on receivers, thoughts on Donte Moncrief vs Allen Robinson? I watched several videos on Street the other day. Interesting prospect. Good hands - kind of lanky and spindly. But, seems smooth.
Kelcy Quarles wanted for questioning about an incident at a night club. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...lina-prospects-wanted-for-police-questioning/
What I think Devin Street represents is a nice array of competencies. He works the slot as well as the outside, he catches the football on drag routes and short breaking routes and transitions decently into run-after-catch, even breaking some tackles every now and then, he presents a valid end zone threat hence his higher ratio of touchdowns to catches, and he also is able to get a step on players vertically and make big plays. There might not be anything he does that stands out as elite level but there's also nothing doesn't do really well. I consider him sort of a rich man's Cody Latimer, that way. As for Donte Moncrief versus Allen Robinson, give me Allen Robinson all day. And I like Moncrief. Robinson is unphased by physical coverage. It doesn't even disrupt his speed as he gets through his stem. He shows that same power and strength after the catch as he can be an absolute bully against smaller defensive backs. He can run any route from any starting position on the field and knows what it's like to be featured and to have your offensive coaches get the ball into your hands over and over again, depending on you to win the game rather than waiting for you to pop open deep for a big play. In addition to strength, he also shows pure elusiveness and brilliant vision/instincts in his run after catch that allows him to make plays that make your jaw drop. It's not quite Cordarrelle Patterson but only because the frequency of the jaw-dropping plays isn't quite at Cordarrelle's level. Some of the plays themselves are clearly plays that would look identical to any in Cordarrelle Patterson's library. Robinson has decently reliable hands and doesn't drop too many easy ones (he's not immune to it though, like many receivers) but perhaps more importantly he is capable of going up with STRONG hands and finishing the physically contested catch. This is the highest compliment that I can give a player in this regard with respect to his hands: he can catch the football through blatant pass interference. I've seen him do it at least three or four times. When I see a player do that ONCE I get excited. To see a guy do it multiple times is fantastic. Physically, Allen Robinson also is a very compelling athlete. His explosiveness and speed show up in the performance metrics. If he's up to 220 lbs he's going to be a stronger player but might not necessarily show the 4.40 to 4.45 speed you want to take guys deep all day. If he's down to 208 as he was at his pro day he can do that more. It's up to you where you want him to play. He's physically compelling. The downside to Allen Robinson is really that I see him lose focus at times during games. He might be one of those guys where if he's not involved in the game he starts to tune out a little bit. That's true of a LOT of receivers, Donte Moncrief included.
So, I had some impressions of C.J. Mosley from watching most of the Alabama games last year (probably all but 2 or 3). Went back and watched him against two of the better teams - LSU and A&M. My impressions remain the same, pretty much. First, Alabama's front 7 is just very dominant (though they gave up a lot against A&M). Their scheme is solid and their players love to dominate. I think Mosley is a solid player on that team but not nearly a star. The thing I love the most about Mosley is that rarely does anyone ever break a tackle against him. He is a superb, sure-fire tackler, imo. If he gets his hands on you, you are going down. However, I really did not see him take on blockers exceptionally well. He was very well protected. And, he didn't show a great deal of explosiveness. In some ways he's hard to scout because the D is so good around him. Ultimately, I'm just not seeing him as a dominant Keuchly or Willis type in the middle on which I'd spend a first round pick. If he can bulk up and not lose speed, he may become a very good ILB. I actually think the DL players will be very good - Stinson and Pagan (though most think Pagan is coming out a year early - probably so - he has a lot of power and will ultimately anchor pretty well but is a year early; Stinson is viewed as a tweener - I think he could be a decent 3-4 DE). Clinton-Dix is all over the place on the 'Bama D and it shows up a lot in the Mosley videos. I really like a soph on that team: Denzell Devall. Listed at OLB, played a lot of DE. Will need to show he can play in space. Not a super explosive kid but is very strong and seems to know how to dominate players a lot bigger than him. There's something about "will" in that kid that shows up on his getting through blockers pretty well. In my views on Mosley I'm not saying he'll be a bad player but he would be a good complementary player on a really good D (he'd fit in well with the Seattle LBs, for example).
He's not a Luke Kuechly for sure. The scheme did protect him. I think the getting off blocks thing is a little overrated because I'm not sure many LBs actually do that. I think where it comes into play is looking at someone like Shazier and then Mosley. Shazier had bodies on him pretty constantly because it seemed like Ohio State's scheme always put them a man down in the box relative to how many blockers the offense had. Additionally, the DL didn't really do a good job flowing to the ball and closing up gaps. Shazier has his nits but he had bodies on him all the damn time. Mosley didn't, and actually his DLs would often disrupt the integrity of the play enough that it would be easy for him to flow in and finish off the runner. I think part of the criticism of Shazier is probably that a lot of his tackles come well beyond the line of scrimmage...but that was true of Kuechly as well. Thing is, he was also making tackles at, behind or just beyond the line of scrimmage too. He was making all kinds of tackles. He averaged 16 a game. Shazier doesn't average that and I think there's some validity to him racking up tackles well beyond the line of scrimmage, but he really does get a lot of bodies put on him, and he averages 1.7 TFLs per game as part of that 10.3 tackles per game. The speed with which he reads the play does need to improve though, and so does his coverage.
Haven't watched a ton of Moncrief, but because of where I live I see Allen Robinson every week. What strikes me about Robinson is that he's very very light on his feet for a guy of his size, and he plays strong for a guy of his size. Those are great signs. He plays faster than he timed at the combine because he's so light on his feet, imo; it allows him to be fast through cuts and gives him that great acceleration, that 'football speed'. And I think some of the comparisons to the great YAC guys sell Robinson a bit short. His route running is quite good and he has lots of experience doing it at PSU, he's very good working the sidelines, working deep sidelines in particular, and he's a legit jump-ball guy because he's so strong. I also see Street every week because of where I am. He's definitely smooth, has a nice array of routes that he runs well, especially from the slot. I'd like to see a little more choppiness in his feet, little more quickness there. He can play soft at times, and that's the concern. He needs to get bigger, I think, though he has the frame for it. His freshman teammate Tyler Boyd is another story...look out. Total stud.
If We could guarantee getting Robinson in the 2nd I would be all over getting Shazier. I would also hope that Coyle has seen that Jordan belongs at SAM, Put Shazier at Will and our defense takes the next step. But of the talk earlier. I really like a player like Lee. I think he is so much better than the 19th pick. His 4.52 40 doesn't seem right. He was always behind guys or running away from them with the ball in hand. He runs a 4.52 in gear. Seriously love his ability as a receiver. A year ago he would have been top 5 pick.
1. zack martin, og, nd, 6'4, 308, 29 reps, 4.59 shuttle, 5.22 dash (best guard in draft) 2. juwuan james, rt, tenn, 6'6, 311, 22 reps, 4.56 shuttle, 5.34 dash (anthony collins clone) 3. jordan matthews, wr, vandy, 6'3, 212, 4.46 dash, 21 reps (jerry rice's cousin) 4. jordan tripp, olb, montana, 6'3, 234, 4.67 dash, 22 reps, 3.96 shuttle (fcs all american) 5. max bullough, mlb, michst., 6'4, 249, 4.76 dash, 30 reps, 4.3 shuttle (all american) 6. blake annen, te, cincy, 6'4, 247, 4.42 dash, 25 reps, 34" vert (awesome athlete) 7. tyler larsen, c, utahst., 6'4, 313, 36 reps, 4.7 shuttle, 5.17 dash (plays center & guard)
I still have big concerns about Allen Robinson's hand-eye coordination on throws where he can't line his eyes & hands up with the ball which leads to a minimized catch-radius, and because of it I think he'll continue to be a poor bad-ball receiver and possibly even have it impact his ability as a perimeter target to the extent it makes me wonder if he's not best suited for the slot. To be clear, I don't include 50-50 balls or fades in with the bad-ball category b/c the receiver can still line those throws up and track them in. Because of this stuff he's the epitome of a boom-bust WR. From a talent standpoint he's got top 10 talent, but he won't get drafted anywhere near it. There's a reason for that, and it's b/c of his hands. When you look at Odell Beckham by comparison, they share a similar overall talent level, however the 3 inch shorter Beckham could conceivably sneak into the top 12 where as Robinson is trying to break the top 40.... and the reason for that is the difference in their hands, namely their catch radii. Robinson is 6'3 and Beckham is 6'0, but you'd think their heights were reversed by the way they catch the ball. This is the same knock I have on Moncrief, but between those two I'd rather have Robinson.
I really really like that mock draft. One of my favorites so far that has any semblance of realism. But, it is spelled Ja'Wuan. Also, I don't see him as a Collins clone. James is a RTO, IMO, though a very solid one.
Tiny had been terribly overrated but folks seem to have come down to earth on him, and see him more now as a 3rd day guy. As for James IMO, it is guilt by association. The difference between the 2 tackles is like night and day. Fulton and Stone cannot be considered overrated when both are rated no better than 7th round which is where they should be. Started watching the Vols OL to look at Tiny and have my eyes keep drifting over to James.
thanks. i only compared james with collins because they are both underrated and overlooked. it took me a while to warm up to james but after actually watching some of his film, he seems pretty solid at right tackle.
Wow, fast. Know nothing about him. http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=91361&draftyear=2014&genpos=TE
To me if Luke Wilson can end up making an impact for Seattle as a rookie then Blake Annen probably can as well. Wilson is a good inch taller but basically they're the same athletically and what little catch footage there is of Annen makes it appear he's at least competent catching the football which is all Wilson ever was at Rice. Wilson wasn't especially quick-hipped or anything and he'd fall apart trying to catch the ball if someone is physically coming through his back over the middle while he's trying to catch the ball as a for instance. But in the end the dude was 6'5" & 250 lbs and ran in the 4.50 range with good explosive burst and Seattle had him run some routes and Russell Wilson found him open a lot.
yep. cincy used him as a blocking tight end. probably why his bench reps are so high. i would definitely use a pick on him.
True story we did a football pool this year and on August 1st we had to predict which teams would make the playoffs, which would win the conferences and divisions, which appear in the Super Bowl and which would win it. I had Denver winning the AFC and Seattle winning the NFC, and Seattle winning the Super Bowl.
For those who haven't been following along with each individual update...here's my writeup on the first group of pass rushers which is Barr, Clowney, James Gayle, Kareem Martin and Demarcus Lawrence: http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/cfb/46928/349/peshek-edge-rushers-10
Did you win anything for it..... besides bragging rights? So which playoff spot did you have Jacksonville in?
OG Spencer Long really has my attention. He really explodes into his pulls and has such great ability in zone plays as well. Particularly his first two steps off the pull are very explosive and it's what allows him to show such great range. He's so good on the pull they commonly had him pull to his left on pass plays and pick up the RDE like he's basically the team's left tackle. On zone plays he's so explosive and mobile he makes cut-off blocks he shouldn't be able to make. I caught myself losing him on a play because he was way further ahead of the zone play than I thought he'd be, far quicker than he had any right to be there. That's Mike Pouncey syndrome. He uses the explosive burst and movement ability well in his straight ahead blocking as he explodes into contact. You see some knockdowns and the like because of that. When he gets out into space he's got a unique ability to redirect in reaction to where the threats are coming from. Honestly I'm not sure why he shouldn't be considered the best guard prospect in the draft aside from perhaps Greg Robinson. The only thing I need to see more tape on with Spencer Long is his straight up anchor. He may have a little bit too much Shelley Smith in him to justify the premium grade but it's something I would just need to see a lot more film on to discover. He's RG #61: [video=youtube;CoE-WGhP8y8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoE-WGhP8y8&feature=player_detailpage[/video] [video=youtube;3NKzUpp7ln4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NKzUpp7ln4&feature=player_detailpage[/video] [video=youtube;CIDWhPaS2Sc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIDWhPaS2Sc&feature=player_detailpage[/video] [video=youtube;U-QpcfhPKb0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-QpcfhPKb0&feature=player_embedded[/video]
Two more videos for those Spencer Long fans out there. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=DMC8xJa2Cj0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NRNoNtv424&feature=player_embedded
