What type of answer are you looking for? That question is absurd. I believe that homefield advantage is a factor.. So my answer would be obvious. If you were the Phins, would you rather play the Super Bowl in Miami or in Pasadena?
My point is that we have a sub 500 record on the road....... so that leads me to believe that the opponents home field advantage has at least something to do with a few of those losses. Yes, we have been a good home team over history, which is all the more reason to take every measure to reap all the benefits of being the home team. The OB clearly had an advantage to Sun Life.
The product on the field absolutely was more electric and exciting than the what has been fielded post the Marino "peak" seasons. Nobody will argue that the OB didn't have amazing energy or acoustics.. But we are not comparing apples to apples.. Look no further than the Atlanta Braves, that post 1989 had less than 500 fans at some games.. Only to draw sellout after sellout as the Braves built a winning organization. Winning and winning in style brings energy..
I don't need to bother with a poll. I'll give it to you. The OB was louder. Who cares? And you're obviously arguing that our home record would be better in the OB than JRS otherwise we would'nt be having this discussion. All I'm saying is that there is no evidence that changing stadiums had any effect, one way or another on our home record. I don't know why you're taking this personally.
Holey moley...... I not once said the stadium is the reason for our success or failures, so PLEASE stop trying to contort that into your argument. I have ONLY stated that it can make "a" difference, and that a slight difference during a 16 game season may have a meaningful impact. Is this NOT why teams fight for home field advantage during the playoffs? Are they making too big a deal out of it also? Is it merely propaganda? So there's no reason the Super Bowl is played at a neutral site? Gheesh, I must be losing it then to buy into all this.
Section has been in the construction business, so I'll take his word on this.. So even if the lower bowl seating was brought in, it probably won't make much of a difference from a noise perspective, correct?
But they don;t make stadiums like the OB anymore. Teams don't want the criminal charges. They make them with concrete CBS construction. Do they need to move the stands closer? yes..and they will eventually. But the loudness of the stadium is fine for a modern stadium. The product is what is important. the better the team, the better the home field advantage. Look, Clemson is the perfect example. They are 14-10 on the road since 2005. 25-11 at home. For a college team, where home filed advantage is a huge deal, that is just "normal". Yet, Clemson has one of the best home field advantages in sports. The product makes the home field.
Please refer to ONE post in this thread where someone stated that homefield advantage was meaningless. In every single professional sport, playing on your homefield is a major advantage, and playing on the road is a major disadvantage. You are claiming that the Dolphins may or may not have won additional games if our stadium was more like the OB.. That is unfounded.. Even our recent history at the OB proves that theory incorrect.. In fact we got smoked by NE in our last playoff game at the Orange Bowl, where bad weather caused sloppy football to be played.. And the Patriots adjusted to it better than we could.. Thanks for making me recall one of the first times I've actually cried in the middle of a football game
Were these the same Canes that dominated college football at the OB? Again, it's just my opinion, but a few scattered games of loudness is not equal to an entire season of energy, loudness, the fans being right on top of the action, etc.
No difference whatsoever. The difference is for the fans. To be able to be closer to the field. But noise? no difference really, or very little as to not matter. Now, want to tear up the concrete and replace it with Steel stands? go ahead.
Well the fans need to suck it up and bring more energy.. Can't blame the stadium.. It's like having a 400 horsepower car, driving 30 miles per hour and blaming the car for not being fast enough.. We have the tailgating experience, a good team on the field, and a stadium that is just fine if people actually acted like the gave a damn.. And when they do give a damn, like the Patriots game from 2008, or the Colts and the Saints in 2009, that stadium was as loud as any I've ever been to.
Is this the same Orange Bowl the Phins saw a 31 game home win streak in...... and the same stadium the Canes won 58 straight in? Just saying. Mightily coincidental there. Are you saying that this wouldn't have changed at all if it were at Sun Life?
Too true Sec. People way overestimate how loud some other stadiums are. I've told this story before but I was at the "Fins-Pittsburgh game at Heinz after Pitt won the super Bowl. Heinz was great, but it wasn't overwhelmingly loud. When the fins were winning in the first half it was quiet.
Rush, what are you talking about, I grew up in west palm beach florida, lived in miami, been to both stadiums more times than I can remember.... The rebuttals in this forum are so far from what iam trying to convey its not even funny..I apologize for not being able to show proof of something that is a complete opinion based on experience..
The teams were better. The stadium didn't have some kind of magical quality that JRS doesn't. The Phins and Canes were amongst the best teams in their respective sports during those time frames and they likely would have had similar streaks had their home games been played in JRS or anywhere else. And the OB magic sure didn't help the Canes when the streak was snapped by a vastly inferior Washington tream travelling to the east coast for an early game.
Yep..the same orange bowl where the canes played their last game versus Virginia and lost 48-0. point is..those streaks had to do much more with those teams, than it did with our decrepit stadium with the urine troths and wonderful 4 inch urine pools in the bathrooms with the occasional floating turd.
well..... something about NE makes them play better at home. And it's not just the weather. Does their talent level miraculously spike during home games? The point still remains that there is an advantage in playing at home, and we do NOT have the stadium set up in a way to fully capitalize.
Historically speaking, every single professional league has teams that perform better at home than on the road.. A variety of well established factors plays in to that.. You are claiming that the Dolphins have not capitalized. You CANNOT prove that theory, nor can you use statistics to prove that Miami is better on the road than at home. Miami is a better home team.
The OB had to be the only Stadium in history that had a overflowed toilet in every game. it was a tradition. if there wasn't a floating turd on the floor of the OB bathroom, it just wasn't home. I guess the home field advantage we had was also that the visiting team would need tetanus shots before playing there and that weakened them.
damn Rush, we are on different planets on this subject, if you think the decibel meter is the same than I dont know what to say..except you know I luv ya... I appreciate all the opinions in this thread, It is not my intention to bring anyone down.... Todd said it best in its most simplest form....The players are isolated from us, and imo, the stadium itself creates consistent passive behavior, which results in sitting on your *** because you dont feel like your making a difference, and, not showing up early because there is no 12th man to be proud of.
More nostalgia... There where times when the bathrooms were so packed because there were so few of them, that fans would just line up along the side of the concourse, where there was a fence keeping you from plummeting to your death and just urinated onto the parking lot below. yes, a row of weiners urinating out the side of the stadium. The OB is the only stadium that induced vomiting from patrons trying to go to the bathroom. AH...home sweet home.
it would still put the fans right on top of the players and action...... so that they would feel one together, a sense of unity.... and not isolated from each other.
This.. we stand at the bottom of the totem pole in this dept..our reputation speaks for itself...and that reputation is not because of us..That's my point, and I hope our exec's dont feel the same as some folks here on this subject....Recent conversations indicate someone agrees with me and other's.. Energy is real, positive or negative, and can tangibly affect a players emotion 's to tilt in either direction.. Coming out of a tunnel, or, how bout playing defense to start the third quarter...at our place?, both are pathetic.. I applaud what Ross our owner and Mike Dee are trying to do, I believe they recognize something is different and wrong, why else would moving the stands be part of the conversation...isn't that proof enough.
It's a fact that we have a worse record at home at Sun Life than at the OB. It's a fact that we had a 31 game and 58 game winning streak at the OB. The stadium a team plays in does make a difference. You've agreed that there is such a thing as home field advantage..... and since the stadium is part of the home field, then IE: the stadium is part of the home field advantage. We don't have to rebuild a rickety OB, but we CAN improve upon what we currently have to make it more involved and electric.
no Rush, that is exactly my point, its not us fan's imo, its the construction that makes us passive and lazy.. Why are we different than the fans that were in the orange bowl?..were not. You think 58 strait wins has everything to do with talent and not an intimidation effect? You think the canes didn't have a higher confidence level when the played at home?..do you think confidence can make an athlete perform at a higher level?
I'm all for imprving the stadium experience for the fans. Anything that makes my ticket more valuable is good for me. I just see no evidence, nor do I believe, that moving the seats closer will make any difference in the performance of the team
I'm sure you'll agree that being equally as loud as the OB and "having the motivation the be equally as loud" are not reflexive by any standards.
When the Canes were on probation and suddenly weren't as talented as other teams, the OB became less and less intimidating to the point that the Canes started losing there regularly. You put the Canes of the 80's in JRS playing the same schedules and I guarantee you they win the same amount of home games in a row.
of course it had to do with the teams.... but there's a little extra magic involved to get to 31 straight..... and especially 58 straight, so please don't try to downplay that. When road games are involved too, teams are rarely capable of squeezing off 12 in a row during a season. 31 & 58 in row??? cmon now. That's equivalent to almost 2 straight perfect pro seasons and 5 straight perfect college seasons. Saying that there wasn't a home field advantage is insulting to the OB.
I for one applauded when they tore down that dump. the Ob was an embarrassment. Again..watch as how the team gets better, our home field becomes "known" for being a tough place to play. Look, the Dallas Cowboys have done alot of winning. beating them in Dallas was a HUGE deal for a long time. that stadium was not loud, or intimidating. Then you have the 49ers. Same thing. Unbeatable at home. When did candlestick become death valley? if we are arguing that the fan experience could be much better...I agree. But the stadium has little to no effect on the team's wins and losses.
Just as you can NOT prove that we wouldn't be any better at home if the stadium were improved. It cuts both ways. We SHOULD have one of the best home records in football considering our environmental factors- humidity & heat that most teams are unaccustomed to. So there's absolutely no reason that we shouldn't fully capitalize on our advantage.
That's it shmoot, iam gonna tackle your *** when I see you one day, hopefully at our superbowl party..lol your last statement is mindboggling to me.. To think that those cane team's were not affected by our crowd, to think that their home crowd had nothing to do with their swagger, to think that teams were not intimidated walking into that freakin stadium, to think that the games itself were not affected by the crowd, I vehimently disagree and dont know where to go from here in this discussion.
Watch Hines Ward and tell me it doesn't amp up his play when he's at home. He kicks it in an extra gear when he knows his fans are right there with him and feet away from the action....... watch him score a TD and you'll see for yourself. Watch the players turn around and wave their hands to get the fans pumped up...... then tell me that the players being a mile away from the fans doesn't affect this at all.... that it doesn't affect the players motivation to incite the fans when they can barely make out faces.
You said has "litte to no effect" which implies that there is an effect. No matter how tiny it may be, an effect is an effect.... and I'll take a small effect over less effect. I agree that it will not play a significant role in wins and losses, but that doesn't mean it doesn't matter. The fans and team still need a vessel to facilitate better unity and energy. The stadium is that vessel. This desired effect should be more effortless than it is right now. That's all I'm saying.
Look, dj, I get your point and I respect your view. You and I want the same thing, which is for the 'fins to win. If I really thought a new/renovated stadium would make a real difference I would be right there with you. Those Canes teams were so dominant talent wise that yes, I believe they could've played anywhere and beaten those teams. The intimidation came not from the stadium, but from the fact the visitors were playing a monstrously talented opponent. But hey, tackle me at the Jets game this year. I'd tell you to yell for me but I won't be able to hear you.
Very true. But I think you would agree that the Canes were so dominant during that time period that the results likely would've been similar playing in any stadium.
