So when Philbin and Ireland get released where do the Dolphins go?

We weren't even a finalist for Manning here, it was between Tennessee and Denver, and he barely paid a visit to Miami.

The biggest reason Manning didn't come to Miami is because of one name - Tom Brady. Nothing will convince me otherwise, he didn't want to go to a division he knew he had to compete with a guy that has been the king of the AFC East, and honestly I'm not sure Manning would have pushed us over the top. We had already traded Marshall before even getting an answer from Manning, and he wasn't giving us a visit we had to fly to the guy and beg him to give us a few minutes.

 

I don't know you can say this for certain....but I'm inclined at agree. I cant see how it was not a large part of the decision he made. In NFL circles, Jeff Ireland is not held in high regard.

 

So what, they went to the playoffs with Tebow...and won. The team had turned the corner.

Even if all that other stuff didn't exist like you're pretending, the deciding factor would have not been Marino. He has no experience. he has no vision. He has a minimum understanding of the game and all its facets. There is nothing anywhere to suggest manning plays here if Marino is president. There's nothing anywhere that says if Marino was here Ireland wouldn't have been retained last year either.

 

So what experience and vision did Elway have?

BTW. That Denver team won BECAUSE of Tebow, not in spite of him. Let's not forget that this supremely talented team was 1-4 in games Tebow did not start, and 7-4 in games he did start. Let's also not forget that that 2011 Denver team that had apparently turned the corner was -81 in point differential.

 

I don't think Elway was the deciding factor. You do, though I don't know why. Are you actually telling me that manning didn't see a team go 7-4 with Tebow, and think to himself how much better they could be with him as QB? Really KB? C'mon man.

 

Only Peyton knows why Peyton never seriously considered Miami. Your reasons for him choosing Denver are as much speculation as mine. Peyton was surely smart enough to realize that Denver was simply an 8-8 team in a crappy division that caught lightning in a bottle for a few games. Tebow basically won Denver a handful of games the same way the Wildcat won Sparano a few in Miami. I don't think it's ridiculous to think we would have had a better shot with Marino running football operations in Miami. I don't think that's ridiculous at all. You go from Peyton considering going to a franchise run by a GM with a not so stellar reputation to a franchise run by a friend and former player he grew up admiring. How could you say it wouldn't have made any difference? I'll agree to disagree that Denver had some vastly superior squad.

 

Tebow won those games by doing things that are drastically different than what Peyton does. The talent level of most of Peyton's suitors was comparable. I don't know what's with this claim that Denver was some supremely talented team. Miami had a lot of good players on the team then too.

 

You're passing this on nothing more than being a Marino fan. There are plenty of things to point to what I'm saying, because all of them are true. The Denver team was better than ours. That had more money then we did. They had an established coach who would not interfere with Manning, we didn't. That had better WRs than we did. They were in a weaker division then we are. You guys are the ones that are taking speculation too far.

Marino has no business being an executive in charge of football decisions. Manning, being the most cerebral and studious of QBs knows this about Marino, as does the rest of the league.

 

Sure. Ok. I thought the way we judged a team was by wins and losses, playoffs and play off wins. I guess there's some nebulous magic formula I'm not privy too. My bad.

 

I don't think there is a lot of doubt that Stephen Ross is going to go hard after Lovie Smith. He seems like the best choice, and the most sellable.

 

Here's a formula for you:

2008-2011 W/L record for Denver and Miami:

Denver: 28-36 1-1 playoffs

Miami: 31-33 0-1 playoffs

As you can see QUITE a difference there clearly in talent. Miami plays in a division where you could NEVER get into the postseason with an 8-8 record. But yet Denver doing just that in a crap division with victories that nobody could actually believe happened and surprising Pittsburgh in the wildcard round clearly indicates they're a juggernaut and that was the only reason Peyton chose them. What happened to Denver in that divisional round anyway? Bill Bellichick handed them their ***es.

 

lol, what difference does 2008-2010 make? You're trying too hard.

2011 is all that mattered. Better teams didn't need Manning. Denver went to the playoffs with Tebow. They should absolutely go farther with Manning. That plus the money, the non interfering coach, the better receivers and the weaker division are all part of the equation.

You have yet to address any of the other pros in Denver's column nor Marino's lack of experience or knowledge of running a team.

 

Ok...I'll bite...lay it out there.....

 

Lovie Smith, Head Coach, Chicago Bears

Tenure: 9 years
Super Bowl Wins: 0
Overall Championships: 0
Conference Championships: 1
Division Championships: 3

Wins: 81
Winning percentage: .560

In 2011, the Bears went 7–3, then lost five straight games, and finished 8–8.

The Bears started the 2012 season on a promising note with a 7-1 record. The team's defense ranked first in takeaways, third in points allowed, and fifth in yard allowed. However, the team again lost five of their next eight games. The Bears finished the season with a 10-6 record.

On December 31, 2012 Smith was fired as head coach of the Chicago Bears after 9 years of service.
_________________________________________________________________________________________

My impressions of Smith was that, like Dungy, he was very good defensively, and could never get an offense in place. Have we forgotten how horrendous their OLine was, or that he is/was another run first coach who only wants a game manager at QB?

People think Philbin had no control over the locker room, but Smith's team was investigated by the FBI after an incident in which his Center broke a fellow lineman's jaw in a fight... http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2226518

I wouldn't be upset with the selection, as coaches often are better in their second tenure with a different team, but I'm just not that impressed with his record and would rather give Philbin another season once we're past the Cogs/Martin drama.

 

Stephen Ross is going to want the coach that is going to get people excited, and sell tickets. He's going to want a "proven" commodity. I think Lovie Smith represents a better version of Jeff Fisher. He's a guy who I think overcame a lot of issues with a bad GM in Jerry Angelo.

 

I don't think anyone will be excited by Lovie Smith.

 

Lovie Smith is basically Wade Phillips. I think he'll get serious consideration, but he's probably a better fit for a team like Tampa. We don't have parts he can use, or likes to use.

 

Where is this Aponte as GM stuff coming from? I mean this is a terrible idea. We need to house cleaned from top to bottom not just Ireland gone. This reminds me of when Parcells left, we needed a complete make over not just to move a few pieces around. I like Phlibin but if getting a new President and a new GM means he's gone so be it. Philbin isn't the second coming of Lombardi or Bill Walsh, he's a guy that I think can be a good coach but if we move in another direction I'm not going to lose any sleep.

 

I think you've got to separate coaching and personnel decisions with the Bears. Jerry Angelo had control over that.

I don't know that you'd consider Smith all that conservative either, considering he hired Mike Martz.

 

I think he's a better head coach than Wade Phillips, Phillips is a terrible head coach. I'd put Lovie Smith more in the same area as Marvin Lewis, he's not great but if you give him the talent to win he'll win games. He's not going to get guys to overachieve he's not a great coach but he's solid and won't get outcoached every week.

 

I think defensively, he's got loads of parts he can use. Not everyone would fit, but I'm not sure you're really sacrificing anyone that amazing either.

 

would be a good choice depending on who is the offensive coordinator.

 

I would say Lovie Smith will get serious consideration because he is a respected, known commodity. With the circus that Miami has been for a long time know, that may be what Ross seeks out rather than trying to go after some hot name.

I personally wouldn't be blown away by a Lovie Smith hire, I think he is a solid coach, though certainly he seems below the elite level, but Miami may be looking for stability and respect in their next hire.

 

I'm not suggesting the gold course incident isn't extremely serious, but I have a difficult time seeing it as a new factor -- not only did the team take action, the league was aware of the action and Incognito met with the league shortly afterwards.

It seems unlikely that the league now punishes Miami for it.

 

A disastrous decision near the end of his tenure that seemed more desperation than anything else. Kudos to him for trying though I guess...

 

I don't know why you can paint him as inherently conservative, when your situation I think is best managed by that. When you have an elite defense and no quarterback to speak of and a run game, it's really the right thing to be doing.

 

I thought Ross wanted offensive minded guys? During the last time, didn't Ireland want a defensive guy (or was it Mike McCoy, i don't remember truthfully) and Ross wanted Philbin?

 

Of coaches who already have NFL Head Coach on their resume, I'd be more inclined to investigate Ken Whisenhunt than Lovie Smith, but I'd be okay with either.

David Shaw would be my top choice, though I think that's a tough get and then a tough sell to the fanbase. Rex Ryan would be my next choice, but I don't see him being available. I'd go Whisenhunt and Smith as three and four.

Wasn't Dave Toub (currently KC's special teams coach, and at the time the Bears special teams coach) the other main candidate with McCoy and Philbin?

 

John Gruden I think would be a great fit.

he has spent his time on MNF wisely and has learned plenty about the game.

His second go around will be more successful. I also LOVE his concepts and his thinking toward the game today.

 

I dunno, I think it's a pretty bad idea to look at it in that context. I don't know why we'd still be barking up that tree as fans after the last three head coaches had been offense guys.

 

Not if we've got a young quarterback you're trying to develop. Maybe he could turn Matt Moore into the next big veteran turnaround?

 

I think his time spent on all those college campuses and working with young QB's for his ESPN show has helped.

Those Gruden QB camps he does are not made for TV BS....

He actually spends two entire days with these guys and works them out with Scouts in attendance. he has had more access than NFL teams to these young guys.

I am intrigued. I like people that improve themselves.

 

The whole notion of "offensive-minded" and "defensive-minded" coaches is silly. Every coach knows they are both important and the head coach usually isn't coordinating the offense or the defense. Among head coaches, most of the great former coordinators won more because of the other side of the ball than the side they coached as coordinators. Belichick's Pats have been much better offensive teams than defensive teams during his tenure there. Dungy's Colts won because of their offense and Gruden's Bucs won because fo their defense. Billick's Ravens won because of their defense. Shula's background was on defense, but for most of his tenure here the defense was mediocre (at best) and the offense was great. Etc. Our last 3 head coaches were all supposedly "offensive-minded" guys but none was able to make our offense any better than mediocre.

 

Judging from his comments when I've seen him cover us or just talk about young Qbs, I think he really likes Tannehill. I think this job would hold some interest for him. Its just a matter of whether he wants to leave a cushy gig for the stress of an NFL sideline. Hes certainly young enough and the job could probably be his if he wants it. I think he'd have to hire his own GM and pick the personnel which could be great or could be terrible.

 

No thanks to Gruden, or any other coach that has been out of the league for three years or more.

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