POLL about Henne's performance IF he completed 12 yards on the final drive

So the rough definition of an average NFL QB game is 120 QBR, 76% completions, 10.2 avg, and no INTs?

I don't need hypotheticals; football has been played long enough and stats have been available long enough for us to be able to guess within reason what this type of performance could be classified as.

 

WHEN IT MATTERS? So ONLY the last minute of a game matters? The other 59 minutes DONT? Does that mean it doesn't matter that we had 3 drives yesterday where Henne was getting it done in those other 59 minutes, but those 3 drives resulted in a missed first down b/c of Bess's lapse in judgement, a missed TD b/c Marshall couldn't make the play, and a Bush fumble in the redzone? All that apparently matters is that, after Henne plays a great game, he was unable to make up for these 3 killed drives, another missed FG, and the defense yet again failing to hold a team at the end of a game. It doesn't matter what the TEAM does for 60 minutes; it doesn't matter what the QB does for 59 minutes; all that matters in football is how your QB plays in the last 60 seconds of every game. lol.

At what point can we quit blaming a QB for our team's sloppy play to where Henne can actually have a solid game that ENDS solid b/c he's NOT forced to carry the team on his shoulders late in every game? Has his redzone play been stellar? No. So what! He's played well enough as a developing QB in a new scheme for us to win 3 games to where it shouldn't be resting on his shoulders on a weekly basis for the 2nd year in a row. Our TEAM is playing sloppy subpar football as a whole, yet fans expect a young QB to play perfect football to make up for it. He's not a veteran Tom Brady. He's not Dan Marino. He's not Peyton Manning. He's a guy that's given us a chance to win, and we're not winning.

 

lol.

Yes, I would like him. I like him b/c of the QB he is, not the name on his jersey.


Just for kicks and giggles:

Let's say either Reggie doesn't fumble at the 19, our D holds Cleveland, a ref calls the offensive PI call during Cleveland's final drive, or Carpenter doesn't miss a FG so that Henne does not have to attempt a pass on our last drive after he already played a great game......
and let's also say that Marshall catches one of his 2 missed TD pass.......
and let's say we remove one of Henne's 2 INTs (either the last play INT vs NE or the Houston where his arm was hit).


What's Henne's rating become?
Answer: 99.17

That's 62/103, 5 TDs, 1 INT, 60.19%, 8.35 avg, 4.85 TD%, 0.97 INT%.

That's pretty conceivable and not asking for a lot IMO. 1 FG here, a caught TD there, and 1 less INT. That's it... and we're 2-1 and Henne's few missed redzone opportunities look more like extra reps toward his growth and development in a new offense rather blown chances to win a game.

 

I understand that, and I'm not trying to change anyone's mind. I'm merely asking for genuine, objective opinions about how they'd label our QB's play if he went 21/27, 76%, 269 yards, 10.2 avg, 1 TD, and 0 INT while under lots of defensive pressure AND he put us in position to kick a last second game winning FG. I don't see why this is so difficult to answer.

If Brady posts the above stats in a game where his Oline is terrible, Benjarvis fumbles in the redzone, Welker misses a TD opportunity, and Goskowski missed a FG..... and Brady, despite his team's sloppy play, puts his team in position to kick a game winning FG, I doubt posters would have a difficult time assessing his level of his performance during the game.

 

You mean---- he's not winning games ON HIS OWN on a weekly basis. Big difference. There's not one game so far that Henne has actually lost for us. We're losing as a team, and Henne, in a new offense, has been unable to overcome that ON HIS OWN.... and his teammates aren't making that task any easier for him.

 

What's to notice? It's no big deal when your defense allows a 104.0 QBR with 8 TDs and an 8.3 avg.

Great points btw. Completely agree.

 

lol at a QB having 3 Super Bowl rings when his team is playing sloppy as hell.

That had nothing to do with coaching, sound TEAM football, and outstanding defensive play, while holding opposing QBs to a 68.6, 56.2, and 75.3 Ratings.
It was ALLLLLL Brady, which is why Brady has won the SB every year since then b/c he's better now than he was when NE won 3 SBs.

And there's no "see". I'm simply asking for objective opinions on what Henne's performance would've been considered if the name on his jersey said anyone else's name but Henne.

 

I agree with some of what you're saying and I definitely understand and respect where you're coming from my friend. My gripe is---- why does the bold part have to come to this on a weekly basis regardless of how well Henne plays leading up to it?
When can we actually win games as a team?
When can we take a kneel at the end of a game where Henne played well in? Would the Steelers, Ravens, or super bowl Patriots of 2001, 2003, & 2004 have needed their QBs to play for a last second win there? I seriously doubt it b/c those teams played solid team football.

If Chad has a bad game leading up the 4th qtr and was one of the reasons his team was in the come from behind position to begin with (like McCoy was in yesterday), then I can understand the criticism for a guy not constantly being able to make up for his poor play and carry his team to a last minute victory. But that's not been the case. He's had 2 great games where his solid play still left him fighting to win in the closing minutes. That's garbage IMO. Great teams don't play like that.

All I'm saying is--- how about we knock off the sloppy team play to where Henne is only asked to win 1 of every 3 games during the final minutes rather than every darn game in the final minute. He's not Brady; he's still developing; and just like the other 1st to 5th year QBs in the league, I don't think he can handle either the stress of having to play mistake free so often or the pressure of having to win every game in the closing minutes.

At some point this team has to step up as a team and take some pressure off its QB for once. The only way we're 2-1 or 3-0 with this sloppy of a team is if Henne were playing like a top 5 QB. With a new OC, new offense, and Oline that's struggling to protect, I don't see how that type of expectation is fair.

 

And the missed FG? That's 3 points. Henne's fault?
Bush's fumble on the 19 after Henne was hot for 3 straight drives and already threw a TD? That's 3 to 7 more pts that couldn't happen. Henne's fault, too?
That's 25-29 points right there.

How about the opening drive where Henne started 3/3 and Bess killed the drive by not keeping the first down? Is that Henne's fault also?

Marshall letting a well thrown TD pass sneak through his hands? That's 7 points that instead resulted in a FG. Again Henne's fault?

There are 11 guys on offense.... plus a kicker. Henne doesn't play every position.

 

there is no set definition for average; that's why it's a poll rather than me dictating what I believe.

The point for me was to see how others would rate that specific type of performance based on each poster's own belief of what good/outstanding/average etc is without me assessing any type of definitions or baseline.

 

Winning football teams do NOT make mistakes in numerous facets of the virtually every game.

Winning teams play great overall TEAM football, and during the occasional times they don't, other players (including the QB, but not limited to him) step up to weather mistakes.

Winning teams do NOT play poorly and sloppily every week and ask the same player to weather the storm for them, especially when that player is young, still developing, and in a new system despite a shortened offseason.


What's your reason for #1 pick Sam Bradford who is also 0-3, is also in a new offense, has scored even less points than Henne, and is playing worse than Henne?

 

Great points Bick, and I appreciate your input as always.

Question: Did you give an "outstanding" for the poll or an "average"? I'd consider his overall play for the game to be "good"..... but for the poll, I was only asking how you'd rate his performance "if" he put Miami in FG range during that last drive?

 

Clearly they don't have a WR like Marshall; their WRs catch passes in the endzone. lol.

And McCoy wouldn't have led anything if the refs didn't miss an obvious defensive pass interference where our defensive back was being held hostage in the endzone while a pass was completed underneath him.

Cmon man.
McCoy sucks all game, yet his team plays solid overall football for Colt to actually have a chance to redeem himself at the end.
Henne plays like a top 10 QB for 59 minutes of the game, but his team plays so sloppy that he's forced to try and win in the final minute despite his solid play.

If the Dolphins played as well as the Browns did as a TEAM, then we're instead talking about how great Henne looked and how awesome the TEAM victory looked.

Honestly, do you enjoy having to root for ONE player to win games for us every week? Are we playing golf here? lol. If Henne happened to win these games for us, would you have credited Henne solely for these wins, or would you have then shifted it toward how well the "Dolphins" are playing?

Blame needs to be placed properly. Henne's certainly not perfect; he's obviously left a few plays on the field; it's obvious he's still young and developing; but he is NOT the reason we're not 2-1 right now. Our team is playing sloppy; that's why we're losing.... and during 2 games, we've lost IN SPITE OF our QBs excellent performance. The ENTIRE TEAM is at fault right now. EVERYBODY. That's painfully obvious. If you want to blame the player who is actually playing good compared to the rest, then I guess that's your prerogative.

If we reach the point where we're playing well AS A TEAM yet losing b/c our QB is holding us back, or we're winning in spite of our QB, or we're playing great TEAM ball and winning consistently yet our QB isn't stepping up during the periodic games we show up flat, then I'll become heavily critical of our QB. We're not even close to that right now, and we haven't been for the past few years.

 

I'm tired of watching our wins and losses come down to ONE GUY no matter how great or mediocre he may or may not have played in the game. Aren't you guys?

I want to see a Dolphin team that plays well enough AS A TEAM, so that when we finally win games, I can take pleasure in crediting our ENTIRE TEAM for wins rather than the same one person over and over (no matter how much I support Henne). I'd MUCH rather watch us win 10 games AS A TEAM than play like crap as a team and win 10 games b/c Henne carried us.

 

IIRC, didn't Dallas have the lead when Romo choked?... and he's choked even when the Cowboys are playing well.

I'm not saying Henne doesn't "have to have" that quality. I'm saying that you can't keep playing sloppy football for a 3rd year in a row and expect a young QB to win it for you in the 4th qtr or last minute of every game no matter how well he may have played up to that point.

If Henne plays great (like the Jets game last year, Pitt, NE, Detroit) he's inevitably forced to try and win it in the end with a sloppy team whose sloppy play is the reason he's in that position in the first place. If Henne plays poor to average, he's forced to win the game in the final minutes. If Miami plays great, our past conservative coaching allowed most opponents to stay in a game, Hence Henne was still typically forced to win it in the 4th quarter or final minutes. That's a lot of pressure to put on any QB. At what point does Miami play well enough as a team (like how the Jets did for 2 straight years) to where every game isn't put on the QB's shoulders?


He has 4th quarter and last minute wins. He had a handful in 2009 alone when we actually had a ground game that could score and before this regime tried to make him into a puppet. IMO, it "seems" like he's not good during this situation b/c he's in this situation every game, so it stands out like a sore thumb.

What people aren't mentioning is how many late comebacks our DEFENSE is allowing. That number might be higher than the number of times our QB hasn't been able to pull out a last minute win. Some of these late opponent comebacks actually nullified some comebacks that Henne already orchestrated.