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Players not sold on Tua

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by pumpdogs, Jan 13, 2021.

  1. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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  2. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    True, but this is concerning... Guess this off-season is going to be more interesting then anticipated.
     
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  3. tirty8

    tirty8 Well-Known Member

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    You are forgetting that football is a business. Odds are, the players that are most likely to be complaining are WRs. I do not question their sincerity. In fact, some performed better under Fitz, and they probably think that they would be doing much better with someone else (like Watson).

    In their world, the optimum outcome is a new QB. The more we give in terms of draft picks, the more it helps them. Suppose one of those guys was someone like Grant. If it costs a fortune to draft Watson, he likely keeps his part time gig as a WR. Suppose, we do squeeze Houston, and manage to keep that 3rd pick. Let's say we use that pick to grab Smith or another top WR, Grant could be relegated to punt returns. That could also mean the jobs of guys further down on the depth chart.
     
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  4. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    I want watson but noway we keep 3rd pick.
     
  5. thetylernator

    thetylernator You're as cold as ice, Officer Friendly.

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    On one hand, the original report is courtesy of Armando, and we all know how he loves to stir up drama for clicks. This is likely, at the very least, exaggerated.

    But on the other, the report (if accurate) is not only a sign of strains in morale, but also an indictment on Flores for going against his own culture by playing an inferior player.

    However, biggest concern to me is how this affects trade value. The FO could very well have been in discussions with Houston through the last few days, but after hearing this news, no doubt that Houston will be asking for more. Just a braindead decision to come forward with this information to the media--it only hurts the franchise. I hope they're outed and Flores sends them packing.
     
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  6. Ronnie Bass

    Ronnie Bass Luxury Box Luxury Box

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    Our WRs should be the last ones complaining just like they were last in so many offensive categories.
     
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  7. The Guy

    The Guy Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Wonder what some of the Colts players felt about Peyton Manning after his rookie season.
     
  8. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    One of the players quoted was a defensive player.He was quoted, Tua does not have any elite traits,like arm strength or off schedule play making ability.He wondered how we will be able to beat the chiefs or the bills in the playoffs without these elite traits.
     
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  9. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    Did you hear anything like that about Josh Allen after his Rookie season? This is bad news all over, bad for Tua, bad for Flores and bad for the Dolphins. Really interested what’s going to happen until next season. If we keep Tua, I hope this puts a chip on his shoulder. Hope Flores finds out who that was, don’t need anything like that in the locker room.
     
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  10. Striking

    Striking Junior Member

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    I would check who is still there from his rookie season...
     
  11. Striking

    Striking Junior Member

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    Garbage click bait report.
     
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  12. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    Tua was working with undrafted free agent and practice squad talent.

    Sorry he couldn't be "outstanding" with that!

    In the same article the player says that Tua doesn't have any "elite" traits. Then says he has elite accuracy which is the most important for a quarterback. What?

    This article stinks.
     
  13. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    He's not wrong, the only elite trait tua shows is accuracy, everywhere else he is underwhelming.
     
  14. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    Fitzpatrick was working with the same and outplayed him.
     
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  15. Striking

    Striking Junior Member

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    Fitz 13 tds: 8 ints. Veteran of 15 years vs a raw rookie. BTW he was 5:2 vs the Jests which leaves 8:6 vs everyone else. Tua? 11:5. Both had a 3 int game.
    Attempts: 267:290.
     
  16. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I mean, it's not like Fitz is trash. I'm not happy with Tua, but I also don't think it's reasonable to expect Tua to come in and outplay a 16 year veteran.

    What is fair, is to argue that Tua was not pushing the ball downfield like Fitz. The offense just didn't have any energy with Tua. So, in many ways, I feel like the similarity in rating really didn't tell the story, because Fitz was taking chances and throwing more difficult throws, and scoring TDs, while Tua played super conservative, and didn't score TDs, even when playing with the same players.
     
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  17. Ronnie Bass

    Ronnie Bass Luxury Box Luxury Box

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    It's not but when people are set to hate on someone, it will go out their one ear and out the other.
     
  18. Dolphin Dundee

    Dolphin Dundee Well-Known Member

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    I remember Hill came out and admitted he thought Mahomes was trash before and after he started a few games..
     
  19. Jersey Dolfan

    Jersey Dolfan Active Member

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    The eye test says Tua was not impressive, the commentator eyes test says Tua was not impressive, and now the players are saying Tua wasn't impressive.

    It could all be a crazy made up conspiracy or Tua could really be amazing, or, well, Tua just wasn't that impressive. No matter how you slice it, Tua may develop into a nice QB, but he's no superstar as advertised. Accept it now or you'll be in total anguish eventually.
     
  20. The Guy

    The Guy Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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  21. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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    The reality is, we're in a good position right now. We took Tua last year. We've got the #3 pick this year. If Grier and Flores aren't convinced by Tua they can roll the dice again this year.

    The bigger question in my mind is Flores and the culture he seemed to be building in Miami. In the article it states the players spoke on the condition of anonymity because Flores has a rule that they don't talk about the team outside of the team. Well... it looks like at least a few don't want to follow the rules, because not talking is not talking. Flores won't be happy about this. All through the season the talk was that the team were all united and loved playing together. This article calls that into question somewhat. So how will Flores respond?

    And then of course it brings back the question of why Tua got the start as QB1. Was it truly Flores' decision to play the best - as he repeatedly preached - or was it a front office decision? If it was the FO then hopefully it was because they wanted to see what they had in Tua before the offseason - and not because of some reason like hype and ticket sales in a down year. Either way, hopefully Flores was really onboard, because having the FO interfere in who you put on the field and break your word about putting the best players on the field isn't good.

    We're just going to have to wait and see.
     
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  22. Phil Hutchings

    Phil Hutchings Active Member

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    But was that down to Gailey's play-calling?

    I read somewhere that Chan was calling more conservative plays for Tua than he was for Fitz.
     
  23. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    If that were true, it still doesn't bode well for Tua, not does it back up the claims by Flores that he was starting the guy who gave them the best chance to win.

    And announcers were always talking about Tua not seeing open guys down field.
     
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  24. Fishhead

    Fishhead Active Member

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    Pretty bush league to throw your (rookie) teammate under the bus like that, IMO. Im sure Flores is PO’d.
     
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  25. The Guy

    The Guy Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree, and I suspect it may have been motivated by these players' awareness that the team is in a position to draft another QB this year or trade for Watson.
     
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  26. Rick 1966

    Rick 1966 Professional Hipshooter

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    I have nothing against Tua. He seems like a nice guy and I hope, eventually, he'll be a good quarterback. But I don't think he'll ever be great. That's just my judgement, but it's what I see. That's why I'd rather not pass up the chance to draft a QB at three overall.
     
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  27. The Guy

    The Guy Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I wouldn't take Just Fields there, however. I'm an Ohio State fan and I'm less sold on him than I am on Tua.
     
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  28. Rick 1966

    Rick 1966 Professional Hipshooter

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    It's always a mistake to take an Ohio State QB. I will believe this until one of them proves me wrong.
     
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  29. The Guy

    The Guy Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The problem is that if the Jets take Wilson at #2, that leaves Fields and (theoretically) a big drop-off thereafter. If they want to go after another QB I think trading for Watson may be the better bet. Go ahead and give the Texans back a lot of what we've taken from them already, in addition to Tua.
     
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  30. Rick 1966

    Rick 1966 Professional Hipshooter

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    If the Jets take Wilson at 2, I may change my mind. They're the Jets, though, I hold out hope they'll do the wrong thing.
     
  31. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    This is the part that has really been nagging at me since they started him. After the Arizona game, it seemed maybe Flo knew something we didn't and had made the right move. Now, not so much.

    If he did this because of the FO, he just lost a lot of credibility in my book. He ALWAYS says we'll play the players that give us the best chance to win. He HAS to be consistent with that or else the players won't be fully bought-in.

    But what's really interesting is who wanted which QB at the draft. Did Flo want Herbert? Did Grier? Somebody has egg on their face. I'm 100% of the opinion Flo didn't want to name Tua starter for the rest of the season based on "who gives us a better chance to win"...it just goes against his mantra. We'll never know...but there's a rift in there somewhere.
     
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  32. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Fitz also had those really tough first few weeks as all the rookies adjusted. No way Tua (or any rookie QB) finishes those early games upright. This is not an apples to apples comparison that people are trying to make.
     
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  33. Fishhead

    Fishhead Active Member

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    If recent history is any indicator, then the Jets will find a way to mess up this pick. They already managed to play themselves out of the first pick and Trevor Lawrence, for starters.
     
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  34. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't trust anything from un-named sources.
     
  35. RevRick

    RevRick Long Haired Leaping Gnome Club Member

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    AMEN! Plus the fact that we do not know 'How Many' of the {["Dolphin"]} players constitute this alleged disgruntled group. It could be 3 people, each one talking to the other 2 persons, which leads to 6 more in the {group}, etc., etc., etc. Sounds more like the newspaper equivalent of 'click bait..'
    Matter of fact, there might be a lot of bovine scatology involved, as well.
     
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  36. Two Tacos

    Two Tacos Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Tyreek Hill owes a lot his recent success to quarterback Patrick Mahomes, but the Chiefs wide receiver revealed that he initially didn’t think much of the player his team traded up for in the 2017 NFL Draft.

    While appearing on Tuesday’s episode of Showtime’s “Inside the NFL,” Hill was blunt about what he thought of the then-rookie Mahomes during his first training camp.

    “I thought he was trash,” he said. “I ain’t gonna cap.

    “I was like, ‘This is who y’all drafted?'”

    Hill, the Chiefs’ fifth-round pick in 2016, has more touchdown catches this season (13) than he has had at any other point in his career. He has led all Chiefs receiver in yards and touchdowns each season in which Mahomes has been the starting QB.

    “That second year his quarterback mechanics were different,” Hill said. “He was spending more time with the quarterbacks coach, coach [Andy] Reid learning the offense. Dude was just different.”
     
  37. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    Tua doesnt even have abilities to build on. With other passers you could see they had some sort of ability. With Tua it's like watching Cleo Lemon.
     
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  38. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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    Flores responds:

    https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...brian-flores-reaffirms-support-tua-tagovailoa

    "A lot of attention gets paid to Tua, but I thought he made a lot of improvement over the course of the season. I'm excited about the future with him," Flores told ESPN. "He's a young player, talented player, bounced back from the hip. I think this is a big offseason for him. That Year 1 to Year 2 jump will be important, like it is for all rookies."

    "Criticism comes with the territory in the NFL across the board. Our team did a good job ignoring that stuff. Anyone who saw the Dolphins this year saw we were a tight-knit group and I think that's still the case," Flores said. "The idea that there is any kind of fracture is overblown. I thought there was a lot of support throughout the locker room.

    "My message to the team has been to ignore the noise and the people inside the building are going to tell the truth to you. Without all the information, how do you make any determination about what's going on?"

    "We learned that he's healthy. He still has a lot of his mobility. He's accurate. In the Arizona game, he brings us back in the fourth quarter. He brought us back in the Kansas City game. He also didn't play as well in other games. He had some bright spots and not-so-bright spots. That's the life of a rookie," Flores said. "If he continues to learn, study, stay healthy, get stronger, work on his footwork and his eye progression and pick up where he left off, then I think we're going to be happy with his improvement."

    FULL STORY via link above.
     
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  39. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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    PFF talking about the piece. Starts at 7:15

     

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