Evan Silva's free agent list suggested that the Dolphins might yet sign Jake Long after he tests the waters of free agency and finds there's less $ than he thought - and we'd get a deal in the 5 yr, 37.5M range. Made me wonder - if we did retain Long eventually - what are the thoughts of moving him to RT and developing Martin at LT? Seems like Martin has potential if he works hard enough to get stronger and in better condition - along with continuing to develop his skill set. I just don't think Long will work - long term - at LT and think he'd be better suited as a RT, ultimately. Thoughts?
I've mentioned this a couple times DF, but from rewatching the games, imo, Martins coordination is far better on the left, everything just looked a bit better to me,mbut here's the thing, it was still really bad..I guess I might be bias on this one because I didnt like him in the draft at all, I thought he would of got Andrew Luck killed if it wasn't for Lucks incredible ability to step up and maneuver in the pocket, this particular skill by Luck literally saved his *** dozens of times, and it was directly related to Martins deficiencies.. I would love Jake back, if he's healthy and has the morals to understand that he shouldn't and doesn't deserve an elite contract, that he understands that he was paid as an elite tackle for the past two years without the performance of one , understands that he should be grateful for that and that this new contract should reflect that, I would love to give him 8 mill a year and forget about it.. Therein lies another dilemma, you then have to move Martin back to a position that he clearly isn't comfortable with, I don't think Jake would make a move for an inferior payer, it just doesn't make sense for him if healthy, I mentioned when we first drafted Martin, after a lot of study, that I see a body and better skillset for a guard, people scoffed at the notion and I understand that, it was jmo on how he's put together, if he was to get in great shape, with proper musculature, I would project your looking at a 6'5 300 lb man as getting optimum performance from that body, so for me the ideal scenarios are those two things..signing Jake, and moving Martin to guard.. He's recently come out and said that he wants to play left tackle, which confirms what I was thinking, his functionality, his coordination just operates better on that left side, so if one wants to take on two risks, which is losing Jake because you believe Martin can do the job, and Martin actually being able to do the job, it could quite possibly be disastrous from an oline perspective, and at this point and time, with a rookie raw Qb developing, too risky for my blood.. Obviously if Jake departs, a free agent offensive tackle takes priority, or a tackle at 12 that you know you can plug and play.
The good thing about taking a tackle at 12 is this year you probably can get one as good as jake without having to pay the ridiculous prices anymore because of the rookie salary cap, so it could help you long term as far as the cap.
Problem is Deej, we are once again compounding the errors/trading holes Take a Cb to replace SS24? Back to square 1 at Cb Take a LT to replace Jake? Back to square 1 at LT We did use a #40 on Martin, and what a #72 on Jerry, it should not be to much to ask to play them.
So they were on the bench rather than playing? I must have been mistaken when I thought I saw them starting every game in 2012.
I understand, I mean if we lose jake and Martins busts, someone *** better be on the line..I mean what could be the thought process here, he thinks that Martin actually can be a serviceable replacement or he wants to use that rookie salary cap luxury and draft Jakes replacement with a talented player at a much lower price, I think I can understand that philosophy.
I have no problem with that scenario and using the #12 to upgrade the playmaking ability on the O or the D, this situation is purely on Ireland, he'd best solve it or probably should be looking for a new place to collect a paycheck as his compounding of errors is getting tiresome.
Do they keep Jerry at RG, or move him to RT? If RT, then why oh why would we bother with a LT at #12?
I don't think many people are suggesting using #12 on a LT. If Long is willing to come back for 7.5 million/year, you find a way to make it work and hope that Martin keeps developing. If another team offers Long more than that, you let him walk and go with what seems to be Ireland's original plan - replace Long with Martin and go out and get a FA RT (I know that spells FART) and save a lot of cap space. Personally, I'd prefer the latter scenario.
Good thoughts. I think it is a problem that Long values himself as a LT (the phrase, "a man's got to know his limitations" comes to mind for some reason). OF - I think your scenario may be the best, especially if we are to upgrade at other positions in FA - WR, TE, DE or DB. A lower priced RT through FA would be of value (and I'd still draft a RT in the mid to late rounds (4-6) depending on whether we got good upgrades elsewhere. Still a lineman at 12 (or a trade down into the teens and get one) would be a positive scenario (I'd want one of the guards like Cooper - as discussed in another thread). And, if we landed a top WR in free agency (if there are any available - I wonder if the Steelers aren't doing cap maneuvers to retain Wallace) and a couple of other spots (RT, DB or DE) then we would be free to go OL in the 1st and use our other picks in the 2nd and 3rd for TE, a young WR, and DB spots.
I hope we keep Jake, and feel the same. He should feel lucky to have landed such a HUGE contract, and now its all icing... Just sign and stay with the same team, and play your face off. Now, I am sooooooooooooooooooo tired of everyone complaining about Ireland. I think he has gotten better each year, has a great staff, and the Dolphins are in this position with pics and money because of Jeff. Quit all the second guessing. I could go to any fans job and second guess anything thing they've done as well! Hind sight is always 20/20... Some is just ego as well. Every fan thinks they could do better, which I find HILLARIOUS! Jeff grew up in this league and was groomed for this through his whole life!
IMO I cannot see Martin as a starting LT in the NFL. Lets see what he does this offseason and how much he has developed. I still say we get Jake back, healthy and for about 5 years 35 million. IF we do not get Jake back its a good draft for OTs, very good. If it goes that way, yeah, I would put Martin back at RT. Although he looked better, for a few games, at LT he was basically beaten like an egg the last few games. I would rather see him beaten like a rug on the right side, not Tannehills blind side. John Jerry ? Personally have no faith in this kid at all. Would rather tage a Guard and start over. If he comes in over weight again they should give him a bus ticket and a box lunch.
Will Beatty just resigned with the Giants for 5 yrs, 38.75 mil, 19 mil guaranteed. Jake will want more than that. I'm guessing it will take 42-45 mil over 5 yrs with 25 mil guaranteed, if Beatty's contract sets any sort of parameter.
Beaty is healthy though. Thats why I said 35 million. I do not believe Jake will even be able to lift anything substantial until after the draft. I love Jake, want him back IF he can handle things. I seriously doubt any team would be willing to guarantee 19 million until he can prove he can handle himself even decent. One of my other favorite Oline ever is Orlando Pace. The big man went thru the same scenario as Jake his final years in the NFL. Tweaked his knee, the next season tore his shoulder up, the season after that he tore his tricep. Rams released him before the next season started. He went to Chicago supposedly fully recovered and he did nothing there but get run over and around. It was really sad watching him try to play the game. Now, Pace was 33 when he had his torn tricep after having his shoulder stapled together when he was 32. Jake is a lot younger but the injuries are scarily alike. A LT needs his feet and uses his shoulders and arms to push off and out on almost every play. Sorry to say but right now neither Jake or his agent could possibibly even compare him to Beaty who is a healthy offensive tackle. Thats going to be the hold up of teams giving him anything close to 8 million a year. If he was healthy? We would not be even having this conversation.
