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My thoughts on year 2 of rebuild!

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by pumpdogs, Oct 5, 2020.

  1. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    1.Offensive line seems like we are heading in the right direction.I feel the line is playing amazing well without a preseason with 4 new starters with 2 promising rookies .
    2 Wr core is average at best with Parker being our only consistent weapon but concerns about him staying on field are real.Williams has been a complete disappointment considering his strong training camp and grant is invisible.Ford has been decent but as a whole we need a serious upgrade for 2021!
    3.Rb is another position we will need to upgrade.Gaskins has looked decent but that's only because Howard and Bredia have been major disappointments..
    4.Te has been better than I thought if you include Geseki who is really a slot Wr.This is group is not screaming to me upgrade like Wr and Rb.
    5.QB is NA until Tua plays.
    Bottom line offence needs more playmakers!
    6.DL is ****ing terrible!!!I don"t see one player that stands out.Nobody can take up blockers for the run game or pressure the Qb.
    We need help everywhere!
    7.I have to give the LBs a pass because the line flat out sucks!
    8.We.will see how the secondary looks when we finally have jones in lineup but without him they have been terrible.I am not a fan of mcain at safety and this needs to be upgraded in 2021.
    What our your thoughts on year 2 so far?
     
  2. ripper1961

    ripper1961 Active Member

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    Offensive line looks good. Defense can't make stops when we need them to. If we kick 10 field goals a game maybe we will be good. I think we have gone as far as we can with Fitz. One big difference from last year is we aren't getting hammered keeping the games relatively close.
     
  3. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    My biggest concern is whether we have the right HC, and I just don't know. I see both positives and negatives. Aside from that I'm waiting to see if Tua was the right pick. So in conclusion: don't know yet, but we HAVE to know by year 3.
     
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  4. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    Flores blew a non challenge and played scared by kicking FGS against the highest scoring team in the league!Anybody with half a brain knew how that was going to turn out.And yes we need to see Tua!
     
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  5. FishOutOfWater

    FishOutOfWater Member

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    I’m a believer in Flores. Does he make head scratching decisions every now and then? Sure, but he’s only in his 2nd year as a Head Coach, so that’s going to happen. The team plays hard for him and we’ve kept games against 2 Top Five teams and another playoff contender all close.
    Do I want Miami to win every? Of course, but I’m not going to ***** and moan with every loss and claim this rebuild isn’t working, especially since this team is competitive. Anyone remember the first few weeks of the season last year?
    Also, it was always going to be a tough season with such a young team and a bunch of newcomers with a very abbreviated offseason. I’m just as optimistic today as I was when the Dolphins won at New England in Week 17 last year.
     
  6. The Guy

    The Guy Well-Known Member

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    The team to me looks like a scrappy bunch of youngsters who come to play every week and give it their all, which is a testament to the coaching, but who are easily outplayed when opposing teams simply want to turn on the juice. And that indicates a significant talent deficit.
     
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  7. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. Let’s not forget that we took the least talented roster heading into last season and jettisoned our only remaining talent for draft picks.

    I think it’s clear we need to draft for WR, RB, S and defensive front 7.

    I’m seeing some progress with our OL, Gesicki and we have a lot of youth playing on both sides of the ball.

    it’s also easy to forget that we’re going through our 2nd toughest 4 game stretch of the season. We faced 3 playoff teams and a lousy team. It’s really hard to gauge where this team is. This next 4 game stretch will be very telling. Catching SF with major injuries means we should be winning 2-3 games if we’re around a .500 team.

    But honestly I had 0 expectations in year 2 besides progress and seeing our drafts start paying off.
     
  8. firedan

    firedan Well-Known Member

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    It's a slow and painful process that seems to have gone on for twenty years.Still need to find an identity and consistency.
     
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  9. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    I agree but I thought the defence would be our strength considering the money we spent but hey the NFL has 9 teams giving up 400 ypg and the 10th is 399
    The NFL has no defence.
     
  10. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That "pass across the line of scrimmage" call killed an early drive that could have changed the entire game for us. Huge big-effort play by Fitz that got negated and it was head-scratching why we didn't challenge. Who knows- if that drive leads to a TD, maybe the rest of the day goes different and we score a few more TD's later on those field goal drives. At worst, that was another 3 points that we completely gave away.

    I'm not sold on Flores either. He has the team playing tough and I do realize everyone is super young. There hasn't been enough to say either way whether he's the one or not. Blown calls like the one above don't play into his favor though, and we've had at least one in every loss.
     
  11. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I've gone on record as saying I'm unimpressed with Flores even after our hot finish.

    I dont give us extra points for being so bad early on. The falls partly on coaching despite our talent issues.

    I think Flores is a decent "get the guys to play hard" coach, but I've been underwhelmed with our game plans and strategy in his tenure.
     
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  12. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I mean, I UNDERSTAND that he had very little talent to work with last season, but I also realize that he was a part of the front office's plans and agreed to take that role. So I don't count the mini win-streak at the end as a pro or a con...you can't factor in one side of the argument without also factoring in that we started the first few games as the worst team in modern football history.

    In other words, it wasn't specifically Flores fault for those early failures (especially with last minute trades), but I can't fully credit him for finally becoming competitive either. A lot of that was simply Fitzpatrick and the team coming together despite the talent gap....we saw the same thing the other night with the Miami Heat. It wasn't the strategy as much as it was a few guys really stepping up and playing on an entirely different level.

    I also realize that we're early in season two and there was a huge roster churn...so I'm not handing out big-time pros and cons this season yet either. But going into week 5, I really need to start seeing some consistency in receivers getting open, rookie CB's not getting completely torched, etc....that stuff is 100% coaching. The line is a massive plus on the season and I have to give credit there, but it's hard to say it's been positive overall since Flores is supposed to be a defensive mastermind and we brought in several NE veterans to build the D around.

    So I don't know- I'm still neutral on Flores but paying bigger attention to the little stuff I handed out automatic passes on last season. For me, the goal here is playoff team in year 3. I really don't have an expectation for this season other than guys playing hard & not quitting, which I'm already seeing. But I also expect to see some pass rush pressure this season, some 3 & outs by the D, establishing a running game and some clear separation by our receivers...stuff like that is what I'm judging by since they're all clear problems.

    I see both positives and negatives in those areas, but I think I'm still critical of Flores overall because I haven't see enough upside YET.
     
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  13. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    Do teams really take their foot off the pedal then decide to turn on the juice?

    I'm not sure I buy that.. I think their defense is statistically average defensively when looking at points per game.... We still have a long way to go - Your statement may be true but I believe you are making an assumption that isn't true.
     
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  14. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    It was pretty clear whenever we put Seattle into any sort of situation where they needed to do something, they did it with ease.

    I dont know what you personally want to attribute that to but it is what happened at the end of the day.
     
  15. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    I can't assume that Seattle didn't try to score on their previous drives.

    That's all I am saying.
     
  16. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I dont necessarily think they werent trying, I just think every time they actually needed to do something they did.

    It also helped that their WR were dropping barely contested passes l, especially early on.
     
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  17. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    Agreed.
    However, after being adamant about how poor the defense has performed early on (Adam Gase level), I think we need to give them credit. NFL defenses this year look like arena-league level defenses, so you have to take that in to account.

    You also have to look at the poor play of Noah, he alone has been a major liability and impediment to Miami beating Buffalo, Seattle or both.
     
  18. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    Like on that 4th down when they got sacked?
     
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  19. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    They didnt NEED to make a play at that point. They actually chose to go for it because they had confidence in their ability to put up points as the game progressed if they failed.

    If youre asking me if they made any plays defensively sure, but just about every time Seattle actually felt threatened in any way they basically had their way with us.
     
  20. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    ummm, O.K.
     
  21. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    What is in the back of my mind also is I can't name one coach that has succeded after leaving new england.The pats win on scheme but the for whatever reason the scheme never works anywhere else.
     
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  22. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    My thoughts right now is that Flores is not a good NFL head coach.
     
  23. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    We can disagree, but it was very basic strategy IMO


    They had an opportunity to put a dagger in us without actually losing anything of value in the long run because they trust their offense against a defense like ours.

    If they were anticipating a low scoring affair where they would struggle with our defense they would have taken the three.

    That play, in my opinion, had very little to no potentialnegative impact on their overall strategy.

    Of course that is just my opinion which is why I prefaced it with the fact that we can disagree.
     
  24. The Guy

    The Guy Well-Known Member

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    I think good teams come into games against the Dolphins with their normal level of effort rather than some special level of effort, and they turn on the juice only when the game takes an unexpected shape -- for example the 17-15 score in the fourth quarter the other day. At those times they crank the juice and dominate easily, and the Dolphins aren't able to overcome that due to a talent deficit.

    In other words the Dolphins' scrappiness keeps them in games against good teams who are playing without any special effort. When those teams crank the juice and increase their effort, however, the Dolphins' scrappiness is easily overcome by the other team's increased emotional energy, due to the talent differential involved.

    The one game that went differently this year was against Jacksonville -- another team with a talent deficit, and which played in an emotionally depleted state after having played a barn burner down the wire just four days prior. In that game the Dolphins' scrappiness was the difference.
     
  25. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    The reason for this is two fold...

    Once upon a time during training camp, defenses trained hard...lots of hits and as a results, points scored we’re pretty low. Enter the union.

    Now defense during training camp is literally a joke. Can’t start in pads until x, can’t use this tackle, can’t use that tackle. Now points are higher than they used to be.

    Now enter this Covid season...with no preseason, defenses are way behind the power curve.

    That’s why some of these offensive stats that some here post, need to have an asterisk by them
     
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  26. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    I agree 100 percent!I think Dak is on pace for 6700 yds.
     
  27. M1NDCRlME

    M1NDCRlME Fear The Spear

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    4500 of those yards will be garbage time yards while the other teams is playing prevent D.

    Maybe the Cowboys should pay him $100 million per season /s
     
  28. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

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    To Dark Knights point, now you can barely touch QB’s or guys going for the ball. Back in Marino’s day, you would get mauled as a QB or going over the middle or leaving your receiver out to dry.
     
  29. xphinfanx

    xphinfanx Stay strong my friends.

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    The effort and score is a blunt realism. We are not in the same ball park atm period.
     
  30. Rick 1966

    Rick 1966 Professional Hipshooter

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    What I am going to say right now is not what I hope for, but what I am seeing. Flores isn't going to last. He was brought in to rebuild the defense and the team spent a buttload of money on that side of the ball and they suck even worse than last year. He's also hesitant to start Tua and since the D isn't going to help us win any games and we aren't going to the playoffs the way the D is underperforming, ownership is going to want to see Tua playing to gin up some enthusiasm for next season, when the owners can start making money from attendance again. If Flores doesn't start Tua by the halfway point, he's going to get pressure from the ownership and if he doesn't give into it, he's going to get fired.
    I don't want this to happen because it's going to set us back a year and Flores deserves at least one more year to try to make his defensive system work, but there's very little patience in the NFL anymore.
     
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  31. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Marino?? Try going back to Griese and Staubach and Bradshaw. Quarterbacks were body slammed to the ground...receivers were held their route.

    Once Marino came, the NFL just had to change the rules. Every quarterback had to be a Marino.
     
  32. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    The 85 bears are from the Marino era
    Watch the highlights of the bears 85 season and count how many sacks that would pentalies today!
    But yea I do get your point.
     
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  33. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    I was just trying to illustrate how BRUTAL defenses truly were back in the 70's...when I grew up on football. Two teams you never wanted to play in the 70's were the Steelers and the Raiders. Their defenses didn't "tackle" you....they ASSAULTED you!

    The league has gotten away from the pureness of the game if you will. Now granted, defenses don't need to be so brutal to the point they are injuring player week after week however, defenses have become so hamstrung anymore that games are becoming offensive scrimmages, which is a shame. The No-Name Defense, The Steel Curtain, The Fearsome Foursome, The Purple People Eaters, The Killer B's, The New York Sack Exchange...you'll never see defensive powerhouses again and it's a shame.

    If the NFL hadn't handcuffed defenses put just as much emphasis on defensive performance as they have on offense, there wouldn't be the household quarterback names that there are today. If you were the modern day equivalent to a Staubach, Bradshaw, Marino, Elway, Montana...you would TRULY be something special. But alas, the NFL has turned into the WWE of football...every team has to have that STAR that shines and has rigged the game like Vince McMahon rigged wrestling.
     
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  34. DolphinGreg

    DolphinGreg Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    When you consider that last year was all about losing games and building up the draft stock and that we're barely a few months beyond the 1st draft I don't thing changes are coming anytime soon in Miami. Flores is safe, particularly given Covid and the fact the season may not even make it to January if teams can't isolate themselves and protect players from testing positive.

    You're going to see Tua at some point this year. You're going to see Byron Jones sometime too most likely. You're probably going to see the same upward trend in overall cohesion that you did last season.

    The team presently has the #2 and #11 picks in the next draft and while those almost certainly won't be as high come April, you're still going to see 4 talented players added to the roster within the top-50 picks which is pretty awesome. Couple that with another offseason and hopefully a preseason next year and I think we'll see the team be more competitive.

    My biggest disappointment this year has really been Ryan Fitzpatrick. I expected him to play better than he has. He's only given us 1 good game and in that game the team rallied and dominated their opponent. But if he continues to play like crap and Tua's not ready to take over, then you're going to see a bunch of sub-par performances that result in losses.

    But this is a joke of a season given what all has transpired. No one in the NFL is playing defense at all and the Dolphins' veteran QB is underperforming.
     
  35. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Member

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    I can understand those who have been frustrated or upset with the 1-3 start. I predicted a slow start thanks to the boatload of FAs and draft picks that we added. Especially with no preseason to evaluate and prepare. Don't forget we had two productive WRs opt out, which affected the entire unit. There are plenty of reasons to be optimistic, especially because of the fight we've shown.

    This was never going to be a quick rebuild. Next season's draft is going to be very productive. I believe with a year observation/experience, Tua's going to play well in 2021 and he's going to probably have at least one of the top offensive weapons in the draft to help him out. I'm no less excited about the team than I was five weeks ago and I'm surely not discouraged about our future.
     
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  36. Rick 1966

    Rick 1966 Professional Hipshooter

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    Yeah, that's not going to happen. They're going to complete the season and if some teams have to forfeit games, then they will. There's way too much money on the line for them not to finish the season. People were saying this crap back in April and I said then that they would play the games even if it was with no one in the stands. And they'll play them even if they have to isolate all the players for the last 8 weeks of the season and play every game in 3 or 4 selected stadiums round-robin.
     
  37. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    They have already talked about moving to a 12 week season.
     
  38. plc001

    plc001 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    y’all calling for Flores job already are crazy. 1) he’s barely had time to do his job 2) no other head coach worth a wooden nickel is going to accept a position for a team who jettisons coaches for little to no reason. 3) y’all forget the pain of last year so easily. 4) what’s starting Tua got to do with anything, COVID has this year all sorts of jacked... I wouldn’t be surprised if we don’t finish the season....why not let tua sit and learn all year. Let this line gel, let everyone else catch up to the new schemes, allowing tua to have his best chance at success. Let him put some more time after the injury behind him.

    I’m not one who has hope after this team has let me down so often, but there is no way in good conscience I could let Flores go with the body of work he’s given us so far. He at the very least deserves 3 years. With a chance to earn more as this season goes forward.
     
  39. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree...it's not a game-changer to have some teams play 16 games and others play 14. That's not what we want to see, of course, but if it has to happen then it's not ruining the season or anything. Besides, we can always delay the playoffs by 2 weeks to have make-up games in January if needed...I think that actually makes things more exciting.

    I don't know if we'll get to full isolation. Some have predicted December will be really bad overall, but others expect COVID to have faded out by then. There's no way to make an educated guess since we're not scientists and we're not looking at the data. What I can tell you is that Australia and other countries opposite us in the world had their lowest flu seasons EVER in their winter, simply because folks have been wearing masks and distancing.

    I think I saw Australia had like 150 cases total...when they usually have tens of thousands? And their COVID numbers rapidly declined as well. Maybe that means nothing...maybe that means everything...all I'm saying is don't believe the hype since it's all politically motivated. Whatever happens will happen and we'll still play football if there's any possible way to do so.
     
  40. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Nobody is saying to fire Flores today- they're saying that he got a pass last year and he needs to produce enough this season to really give us some hope for next year. If we don't see that by week 17, then we're not going to be on his "bandwagon" going into next season and will start some conversations about change.

    As of right now, today, I'm 100% team-Flores...even though I've seen some things that worry me. He has to have this year though to work thru the process and get our guys together on the same page. So I wouldn't say he "gets a pass" this year too....but I'm not going to be critical for another 6-8 weeks. I think that's where a lot are on this forum.
     

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