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J. Allen, Wilford look in trouble

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by ATVZ400, Jun 5, 2009.

  1. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Im quite content with both of these guys being left off the final roster. I'd hate to take the cap hit on Wilford, and im surprised how much our FO goofed up last year when bringing him in, but at the end of the day, I'm just tired of hearing both names, and knowing they've contributed almost nothing to this team. Its time to look elsewhere.
     
  2. SCall13

    SCall13 ThePhins QB

    I completely agree.
     
  3. PHINANALYST

    PHINANALYST Well-Known Member

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    insurance signing last year or not, Wilford has been a huge mistake $$$$ wise ... we see that the FO is trying everything to see if they can get 'some' of their investment out of him, we'll see in about 60 days how that works out ... doubtful it does right now.

    as far a J.Allen goes ... well not much new to say -- it has been said over and over again, he has a wealth of physical talent, but the 'light' still hasn't come on ... too bad really.
     
    gunn34 likes this.
  4. Tone_E

    Tone_E Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Agreed. Granted, our FO did goof on the Wilford signing, but at least we know they operate under a true competition. Many other teams would've tried to force the issue with Wilford just because of the amount of money that was spend, and we didn't. This regime doesn't care about public opinion. So what, they messed up, they aren't going to swallow their pride and play a $5M player just because they picked him.

    About J. Allen, I really feel for the guy. Sparano said he was moved around a lot himself, and I think all the coaching changes and position changes are going to eventually force him out of Miami, and maybe the NFL. Sad really, he has potential.
     
  5. PhinsRock

    PhinsRock Premium Member Luxury Box

    Seems like a shame but looks like it is time to cut ties with both. Though Jason Allen certainly has shown flashes on the field, I just don't see him as a fit for us. Shall we say it once and for all: bust!?!
     
  6. dirtywhiteboy

    dirtywhiteboy Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    anyone else think that once wilford is sent packing he will never play another down in the nfl?
     
  7. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    Jason Allen will make the cut
    the CB's will be: Will Allen, Smith, Green, V. Davis, Jason Allen, N. Jones
    the safeties Wilson & Bell will be the Hammer & Anvil of the secondary
    & Jason Allen can be a back-up safety, as well as play CB & Special teams
    He's not what we hoped & are still hoping for on the football field & this may well be his defining year as a Dolphin
    However, Jason Allen is not going anywhere (unless he really screws up big time) in 2009
     
  8. Mile High Fin

    Mile High Fin New Member

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    I tend to think Jason Allen will stick this year at least.
    He'll be the dime corner, and special teams.

    He also has some flexibility to backup at safety in a pinch which helps him (remember when we had like 5 safeties injured a couple years ago)????
     
    gunn34 likes this.
  9. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I think it will come down to J. Allen vs. Nate Jones. I'd give the early nod to Allen b/c of his versatility (S and STs) but I don't think he'll be the third S. I really liked the Clemons pick and he impressed in shorts. If he continues to impress when the pads go on then I think he sticks.
     
  10. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    Clemons was drafted as a safty (has played CB)
    & will probably be carried as such along with Culver to backup the Anvil & Hammer
    they should carry four safties on the roster.

    Jason Allen will be carried as one of the six (possibly 8)CB's
    and emergency backup to safety, along with Special Teams
     
  11. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    I wonder how much of Jason Allen's issues are flip-flopping of the position and his ability to pick up the scheme/playbook. He's at cornerback now and in the Quarters coverage, he's not asked to do much. Really simple in my opinion. You sit back eight to twelve yards off the line of scrimmage and you attack down hill or you stay in the hip pocket of the wide receiver down field. When playing the run, your not asked to do much, that's more of the safeties job. If he's having trouble picking that up then that's just disappointing. However, I do think one issue that bugs him is falling for double-moves because he's been beaten by them before if I remember correctly. That could be an issue but it is also a issue that can be fixed. I would imagine that his issue would be the flip-flopping of positions numerous times because he didn't really get a grasp of one position. Didn't he even move from CB to S at Tennessee?

    Re: Special Teams - I liked him last year at special teams. I thought in some parts of the year, he did a good job of getting down field and making a play or at least taking on a block to free up his teammate to make the play.

    I think a team will eventually pick him up. He may sit on the market a while (or he may not) and when an injury happens, they'll call him.
     
  12. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    the Wilford decision is about money
    he gets' the reprieve because it costs too much to not give him a second chance
    I think he'll wind up on SpecialTeams before it's over, then he'll be cut

    he definitely is between a rock & a hard place (of his own making)
    can he dig himself out?
    we'll have to wait & see but it doesn't look good for Wilford

    the good news:
    Bess was the steal that balanced the ledger against the Wilford fiasco
    & we may have drafted his replacement in the red zone

    WR's: GinnJr., Bess & Turner :up:
     
  13. m ino

    m ino New Member

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    you are correct. he also flip-flopped at tenn due to a poor,injury riddled secondary and unfortunately for us he shined. all the stats in the world doesn't equal first rnd pick but he was a saban guy(recruited by saban to go to lsu but chose tenn).even with the stats if it weren't for saban he would'nt have gone in the first but thats just my opinion.
     
  14. TiP54

    TiP54 Bad Reputation

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    Im going with FO.
    They keep both, they let go both, or they keep either one...i trust them like a kid trusts his mom.
     
    AquaBlitz likes this.
  15. AquaBlitz

    AquaBlitz Active Member

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    I think he'll muddle around the arena league or the CFL until he retires. He's 30 years old and has only had one productive season(at least touchdown wise) in his five year career, and that came back in 2005. If you as a receiver can't make it in Jacksonville that is usually an indicator that you aren't in at least the top half of the league when it comes to receiving talent, because Jacksoville has had no one on that roster for years to catch the football.

    Besides, I'd rather see our young guys catch the rock and get some burn on the field opposed to a 30 year old vet who was inactive for half the season last year.
     
  16. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    flip flopped 5 times under three different coaching philosophies
    this is a be-muddled start to any NFL career
    he has the ability & tangibles to make it in the NFL
    I believe Jason Allen will survive & thrive in 2009
     
  17. m ino

    m ino New Member

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    we can't use the flip-flop excuse with him anymore. the guy has been playing both positions for atleast 6 yrs if you include his time at tennesee. he is just not smart enough to grasp it. nor can we use the different coaching philosophies because they weent all complex schemes..he shouldve picked atleast one of the positions up by now and he hasn't. he doesn't have the mental capacity and is mentally lazy.

    i just can't get the picture of ronnie brown flat running him over out of my head when people bring up his physicallity.
     
  18. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    brown could run over anybody in an open field with a full head of steam unless he was hit just right. as for Allen, we'll have to wait & see. nothing is ever resoved in conversation. he must resolve the issues on the playing field or bust. I do believe this is his last chance to do so as a Miami Dolphin.
    having said that, I think he will do well in 2009.
     
  19. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    The only reason why I think Miami should get rid of J. Allen is if Miami is a better team without him.

    Right now I see Miami has better with him. He has not lived up to expectations of his draft slot and it really is looking slim that he is going to. It is really unfortunate since he is an amazingly athletic man.

    Still last year he was one of the best special team performers and isn't bad depth at the corner position.

    So due to Miami not really needing .6 million dollars in cap space, I think he makes the team. He is too athletic to give up on and he contributes on special teams really well.
     
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  20. m ino

    m ino New Member

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    thats what the good safety/corners do. they make a living off of being in position to hit just right. the nighttrains,the ed reeds,the ronnie lots all make a living bieng in position to hit just right. if they don't it could mean 6 as they are usually the last line of defense.

    i hope you are right and will be one of the first in line for crow. with the current line up he doesn't have much room for error and is slowly losing his chances to show he can learn to play great.
     
  21. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I am a huge fan of Ed Reed and Ronnie Lott and even Troy, still they all have been ran over.

    It is football, looking for perfection is ridiciulous.
     
  22. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    dont' let the smile fool you
    :)
    Ronnie Brown@ 6'& 235 lbs is a serious item to encounter running full-tilt & down hill
     
  23. Onehondo

    Onehondo Senior Member Club Member

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    I feel confident that this staff has the ability and smarts to bring out the best in Allen and Wilford. If they don't make it, it will be because they just didn't have what the staff were expecting or looking for. Neither one will have any excuses as unlike the past, this staff is competent and able to see talent in a player and to make the most of it.
     
  24. anlgp

    anlgp ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A

    sometimes a kid might not trust his mom very much
     
  25. GridIronKing34

    GridIronKing34 Silently Judging You

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    College ball and NFL ball is a whole different atmosphere.

    He has the disadvantage of being a tweener so one defense coordinator pictures him as a cornerback, the other a safety.

    It's hard to excel at something when you flip-flopped back and forth every year. Having to learn a new playbook each year is not an easy task either. Year one, Saban. Year two, Cameron. Year three, Sparano. Luckily he has the same staff as last year. Year four under Sparano again will be a make or break year for him.
     
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  26. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    you framed it perfectly
     
  27. AquaBlitz

    AquaBlitz Active Member

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    A lot of people underestimate the transition between the college and the pro game. College is more just go out there and play, the NFL is a full time job. Seven days a week you are training, practicing and studying film. Some guys just can't grasp the concept of that and fail to live up to the hype. Of course, coaching changes don't help, a guy like Jason Campbell has been beaten down relentless with new playbook, after new playbook and that can kill a kids career.
     
  28. Panther7

    Panther7 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I used to think this way until I ran across the article below (see link). Yes he played two basic football positions - safety and cornerback. I'm pretty sure the technique he used at Tenn at both safety and corner was extremely simple (much less complex than NFL techniques) which allowed him to get by on his incredible athleticism. However, every time he has switched, he has had to play a different set of techniques. Two different techniques at the same position in the NFL is like two different positions. An extreme is a DT in a 3-4 is totally different technique than DT in a 4-3. How about a QB in a West Coast off vs. Norv Turner deep pass offense or a bump and run corner vs tampa-2 corner. Same position requiring two different sets of techniques which in turn requires totally different skill sets to succeed. Usually, one player's skill set doesn't allow them to excell in two different techniques.

    In the NFL, Jason has played Saban-Safety & Corner techniques in 2006 and the Don Capers-Safety & Corner techniques in 2007. After dedicating the entire last offseason to safety techique, Sparano had him switch in 2008 training camp to learn the Bowles-Corner technique. So we can look at him, a notoriously slow learner, having to learn 5 different techniques in three years!! That's the same as 5 different positions. No wonder he's confused.

    Eye-opening Jason Allen Article

    I'm excited that this year, he is going into training camp to attempt to solidify what he first started learning in the 2008 season. In the NFL, this is going to be the longest he has been using one technique (position)! I believe he deserves this season to see if he's mentally capable of excelling in an NFL technique. I think he will be able to showcase his incredible athleticism, especially at corner. Just what we need for the T.O.s and Moss's of the division.
     

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