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Ireland is the Man for Ross (and therefore the fans)

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Da 'Fins, Jan 13, 2012.

  1. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The bottom line for Fisher not coming (Schefter):

    Ross has put all his marbles in Jeff Ireland's corner. We'll see. Personally, I don't have confidence in Ireland but sometimes patience pays off. I'm not saying Fisher was the best option for Miami. But, the unwillingness to let go of Ireland's power is something Ross - and unfortunately the fans - will have to live with. Three thoughts come to mind off the cuff:

    1) Keeping Ireland in total control limits the coaching options for the Dolphins. A coach has to believe in Ireland - his career and reputation is basically in his hands. This is very different from a coach going to an organization like Green Bay or Pittsburgh where coaches have come and gone and the organization has remained stable. Obviously a young coach who may not have many chances may leap at this. But, those that see themselves with great potential (like a Harbaugh) may pass for future options.

    2) We fans will have to hope Ireland is the next Ron Wolf or Bill Polian. That's what Ross has done. This is simply discouraging (not that we lost Fisher but that Ross does not want to relinquish Ireland's authority).

    3) What will Ross do if the Dolphins flop this next year? Will he continue to retain Ireland? If so, then he will have lost on opportunities to revamp the team this year. This is two years in a row Ross had an opportunity to reorganize the team and ostensibly chose not to.
     
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  2. Jimmy James

    Jimmy James Ron Swanson

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    My take on it is that Ireland is to the Dolphins what Vinny Ceratto was for the Redskins for a long while. I do think it pretty likely that this only goes one more coaching cycle, though. Ireland won't likely last through another 3-4 year losing/breakeven tenure of a coach. At that point, Ross will probably try to get his Shanahan. We see how well that worked for the Redskins.
     
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  3. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    We are so royally ****ed its funny.
     
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  4. quelonio

    quelonio Season Ticket Holder

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    Ireland is faaaar better than Vinny Cerrato was. At least Ireland is sort of a football guy, Cerrato was just a Snyder buddy.
     
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  5. Jimmy James

    Jimmy James Ron Swanson

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    Well, yeah. Ross is also not Snyder, and I wish people would remember that. I understand frustration at Ross, but he's not in the bottom third of league owners much less Snyder. I still think Ross has an allegiance to Ireland that is similar to the one Snyder had to Vinny.
     
  6. PhinsRDbest

    PhinsRDbest Transform and Transcend Club Member

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    the next dimension
    It's a cruel joke.
     
  7. quelonio

    quelonio Season Ticket Holder

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    You might be right. I don't hate Ireland, I think he has collected some talent (this is not a terrible team, or so the homer in me thinks). Sucks to not get Fisher (I've always really liked him as a coach) but I don't think we are in a hole that we cant get out of. As in I dont think the team is on its way down, its more like I dont see a clear path forward. Which makes me nervous
     
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  8. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    Yeah, what he said !!

    Seriously, you put very dynamically (and diplomatically) what I have been ragging on about this whole Fisher thing. Every time I see or hear something that Ross has done, I flip out again...sorry for the rants, but this guy just keeps pushing this organization further and further into the ground... Tell me again, how did this guy get his money ?? Arrrrgggghhh !!
     
  9. Aquafin

    Aquafin New Member

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    the poor house
    what talent ? we dont have a qb , we cant score as many points as the marlins we have average players at tightend and wr Marshall might be the exception no one is sacred of our offense and they never were scared of Miami this same ole same ole is sickning . we never seem to change up our offense and year after year we keep having conservative head coaching and that wont attract very many free agents and you watch draft picks will start snubing us . Miami is the hell hole of sports. but Maybe it will all change one day.
     
  10. Ohio Fanatic

    Ohio Fanatic 30 years and counting Club Member

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    Did you even watch this season? Apparently not, the last 8 games, our offense was anything but conservative. Our problem is that we couldn't convert in the redzone and the injuries eventually got to us.
    And "draft picks start snubbing us?". Really? Does that still make sense when you re-read it?
     
  11. Dolphins1Beatles

    Dolphins1Beatles Ziggy Stardust

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    Yeah, and the fans will speak back when they average 50,000 in a 75,000 seat stadium. They had the 2nd largest attendance drop in the NFL in 2011, and the Dolphins' lowest attendance since the 60s...it won't change.
     
  12. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    no its only gonna get worse, but Ross is all in that he has his talent evaluator, and sometimes, it takes really tough decisions, not popular ones with the masses, if you believe in that person, to give them a proper time frame to flouish..
     
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  13. smahtaz

    smahtaz Pimpin Ain't Easy

    I respect Fisher as a coach. But as Mad Dog would say, he really didn’t make my toes tingle. And as you point out, successful franchises maintain their infrastructures and just continue to plug in staff and players. My impression of Ireland is that he is a pompous *** and an elitist, but that doesn’t make him a bad evaluator of NFL talent. Apparently Peterson has signed off on him and Ross trusts Peterson. In reality, what else does he have to go on?

    Just win baby.
     
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  14. smahtaz

    smahtaz Pimpin Ain't Easy

    If you liked that one, your going to love this one.

    http://www.thephins.com/forums/show...-dolphin-fan&p=1674029&highlight=#post1674029
     
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  15. Ohio Fanatic

    Ohio Fanatic 30 years and counting Club Member

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  16. BuckeyeKing

    BuckeyeKing Wolves DYNASTY!!!!

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    What are the chances Miami trades up for RG3?
     
  17. bigbry

    bigbry Huge Member

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    Zero
     
  18. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    maybe Ross worked out a deal with the new Rams GM..
     
  19. cdz12250

    cdz12250 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You can't coach a team day to day and also do a good job keeping up with personnel scouting. That's why I think that what Fisher wanted was not reasonable. He wanted final say, not only over who gets on the field, which is a coach's prerogative, but over who gets brought into the team. Unless he has complete command of what is going on in the college and pro scouting, he really doesn't have all the facts to make that decision.

    He can have input. He can identify a need at this or that position and ask the GM to find him a guy with this or that skill set, like X or Y player, for instance. But the final say on personnel has to go to the guy who's running the scouting day to day, knows the database of available talent, and has command of things like the effect on the cap, prevailing salaries for similar players, the ear of the owner when advising him where to spend his money, and the like. That's the GM, and it's the only structure that makes sense unless you happen to be Lombardi, Shula, Bill Walsh or a young Al Davis. Fisher is none of the above. As much as I hate to say it, I'm with Ross on this one.
     
  20. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    it is official. i must kill ireland. there is simply no other choice
     
  21. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    That's baloney. Cerrato was with the 49ers for 9 years, as Director of College Scouting and then Director of Player Personnel. Let's not try to pretend the man doesn't know football every bit as much as Ireland.
     
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  22. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    What do you indulge in before posting Curly Bill? Acid? Mushrooms? Weed? Moonshine? Definitely not the rants of a sober person.
     
  23. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Link?
     
  24. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    1 in a million...
    [video=youtube;KX5jNnDMfxA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX5jNnDMfxA[/video]
     
  25. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Perhaps you didn't get the memo, but Ireland is still the person making personnel decisions for the Dolphins. So that makes the chances of Miami trading up to select RG3, zero percent.What is more likely is that the Dolphins will once again trade down to select another mediocre player in the first round and the Dolphins will have a backup QB, (Moore), as their starting QB next season.
     
  26. cdz12250

    cdz12250 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Interesting article on Ireland. The author goes through four years of personnel decisions and gives his analysis. Maybe, just maybe, we could be blaming the wrong person, and maybe Ross was right:

    http://www.dolphinshout.com/2011/12/jeff-ireland-is-survivor_19.html

     
  27. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh Club Member

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    Amen.

    I've been told, that Fisher's record is irrelevant, because he had a meddlesome owner. The same people however, blast Sparano who was so "meddled with" he couldn't even pick his own coordinators. They also blast Ireland, who until last year's solid draft, hadn't made all the decisions either.
     
  28. PSG

    PSG Clear Eyes. Full Hearts.

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    My biggest fear is that we are heading into yet another lost season.
    Last year really was over before it began because of the Sparano/Harbaugh fiasco.
    If we crap the bed next season, Ireland will be the only person Ross will be able to turn to cast blame. If that happen and Ross fires Ireland next offseaon, then we just wasted a whole year of cleaning out the Parcells stink and starting over. And maybe losing a couple HC candidates in the process.

    Having said all that, I'd really like to 12-4 next season due Ireland's awesome coach selection, March FA signings and April drafting. That would be the best tasting crow...EVER.
     
  29. AdamC13

    AdamC13 Well-Known Member

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    In Ireland's favor...the talent on the roster has significantly improved since taking over. There are worse GMs in the league.
     
  30. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    all that old school sh^% sounds good right about now..
     
  31. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Or the time frame to ruin this organization for another decade or more.
     
  32. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Some of what the writer claims doesn't make sense. Such as Sparano worked out Justin Smiley before he was signed as a UFA. Since Smiley was signed something like 5 minutes after free agency opened, there was no way Sparano could have worked him out because before the time free agency opens it is illegal to have contact with the players from other teams. He may have watched a lot of game footage, one can hope anyway. But, he could not have talked to or met Smiley in person without risking the team to a penalty from the league for tampering.
    When I see a writer being reckless with the truth about one thing, then the entire article becomes a red flag for me.
     
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  33. cdz12250

    cdz12250 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree, but the reason is that Ireland is obviously following a strategy of building from the interior out, and he's not about to abandon it now. He's Practical Pig building his brick house.
     
  34. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Let's see, Ireland came to the Dolphins as the GM four years ago. The first year the Dolphins went 11-6. The next two years they were 7-9 and this season they were 6-10. Please tell me in what universe this computes to showing that the talent on the Dolphins has improved significantly over the last four years? You are what your record says you are. Based on these won/loss records, the Dolphins obviously have less talented players on their roster right now then at anytime since the Parcells/Ireland regime came to Miami.
     
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  35. PSG

    PSG Clear Eyes. Full Hearts.

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    Unless you believe the fatal flaw was all coaching.
    Which is exactly what Ross believes, or what Ireland has conned Ross into believing.
     
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  36. UCF FINatic

    UCF FINatic The Miami Dolphins select

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    I cannot believe all the flack that Jeff Ireland is taking, he is a top 10 GM in my opinion.

    Look at our last few draft and you could easily see that. Yes, he has missed a few picks in the second round, but they are still young and are coming around. These last two draft by him has been incredible in my opinion. And everyone keeps complaining about how we haven't addressed the QB position, but what should we have done? There were not outstanding prospects that we could have attained recently in FA or in the draft. Should we have traded the farm to get Blaine Gabbert? Pass. Christian Ponder? I would have taken him if he was there at 15, but I wouldn't have traded up from 15 to 12 to get him. Jake Locker? Ehhh. Its not like Ireland has missed outrageously on draft picks. And he consistently finds late round gems. I am telling you all he is a good damn GM and I am tired of hearing otherwise. Remember how bare the cupboards were when he came here.
     
  37. bigbry

    bigbry Huge Member

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    Please do not forget your assumption that Fisher couldn't handle both jobs nor the presumption that Fisher would automatically cast out Irelands decision.

    I can see your point here, but why are you making excuses for Ireland? Why would you need to? The HOPE of things to come? For two years we have tried to land a coach that has the proven ability, we failed. The further Harbaugh goes into the playoffs the more Ross/Ireland look like ego maniacs unwilling to let go and allow the people in todays NFL have a say, maybe even the final say.
     
  38. PSG

    PSG Clear Eyes. Full Hearts.

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    2011
    1.15 OL Mike Pouncey
    2.30 RB Daniel Thomas
    4.14 WR Edmond Gates
    6.09 TE Charles Clay
    7.28 DL Frank Kearse
    7.32 DB Jimmy Wilson

    2010
    1.28 DL Jared Odrick
    2.08 LB Koa Misi
    3.09 OL John Jerry
    4.21 LB A.J. Edds
    5.14 DB Nolan Carroll
    5.32 DB Reshad Jones
    7.05 LB Chris McCoy
    7.45 LB Austin Spitler

    Those are his draft choices in his two seasons running the draft. ( I didn't include 2009 because that was a Parcells draft, I believe)
     
  39. UCF FINatic

    UCF FINatic The Miami Dolphins select

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    2011
    1.15 OL Mike Pouncey - Played Damn well this year, even if the coaching staff put him in at Center instead of his natural LG position. Makings of a future Pro Bowler
    2.30 RB Daniel Thomas - Banged up rookie year, showed flashes. Reminds me of Ryan Mathews first year in the NFL. Give him another year or two.
    4.14 WR Edmond Gates - One of the top return men in the league last year. Has blazing speed and can stretch defenses. Would like to see him in more offense sets. Even still if you can draft a special teams star in the 4th round its a solid pick. Especially when he has the ability to make a difference in the offense down the road.
    6.09 TE Charles Clay - Started to emerge towards the end of last year. He should see a continued role in the Dolphins offense. Very flexible as to where he can line up and a good mismatch player.
    7.28 DL Frank Kearse - Tried to put him on our practice squad, but Carolina stole him from us and he made their final roster. Good pick for a 7th rounder
    7.32 DB Jimmy Wilson - Hell of a pick. He is a great gunner on special teams and should see the playing field more as time goes on. He is always in the right place at the right time.

    2010
    1.28 DL Jared Odrick - Played exceptionally well this season, which was essentially his rookie season. Future Pro Bowler
    2.08 LB Koa Misi - Solid rookie, lost playing time to Jason Taylor interested to see how he does this coming year.
    3.09 OL John Jerry - Had some moments this year, still interested in seeing if he has anything to offer.
    4.21 LB A.J. Edds - Injured, but looked great in coverage before his injury his rookie year.
    5.14 DB Nolan Carroll - He has gotten burnt a lot, but still he made the roster and has seen field time as a 5th round pick.
    5.32 DB Reshad Jones - Starting to see the field more and more often. He could potentially replace Y. Bell in the backfield.
    7.05 LB Chris McCoy - Cut from Pittsburgs practice squad, but its the 7th round.
    7.45 LB Austin Spitler - Still on the dolphins roster, special teams contributor.


    Most of those picks are all contributing to the Miami Dolphins or their respective teams. While there are not many flashy players, there are a lot of solid contributors with on a few real misses. Compare those two drafts to any other NFL team.
     
  40. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I just don't agree with it because I feel Ireland is one of the worst GM's in the entire NFL. What has been incredible about about the last two Dolphin drafts totally escapes me. I see both these drafts as being nothing but average at best. All I know is that the Detroit Lions were 0-16 a year after the Dolphins were 1-15. Based on the talent on the Lions, compared to the talent on the Dolphins, the GM of the Lions has done a far superior job in rebuilding the team in a shorter period of time.

    There are certainly bad GM's in the NFL and Ireland just happens to be one of the worst, based on the teams record since he took over the job four years ago. You can defend Ireland all you want and blame it on Sparano and Parcells, but the fact is that the Dolphins have regressed as a team ever since they made the playoffs in 2008. All you have to do is look at the teams record over this period to see how bad a job Ireland has done in selecting quality talent for the organization.

    It is obvious by the support of Ireland by some on here that they are drinking the juice that Ross and Ireland are supplying them with. Hopefully these individuals will eventually lay off the juice and take a hard look at reality. This reality is that the Dolphins are now nothing but a bottom tier team in the NFL, and will remain at the bottom as long as Ross continues his love affair with Ireland.
     

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