In Hindsight do you still trade Marshall for Eggnew and a 3rd rounder?

You don't keep nut case me only players... Period!

 

I cant believe that some people think that trading Marshall was a good idea. You're all nuts. He was by farrrrrrrrr the best player we had and easily a top 3 receiver in the NFL. You dont get rid of guys like that, period.

 

He wasn't performing like a top 3 receiver here. He was unlikely to start.

Also referring to other people as nuts when we're talking about Brandon Marshall is pretty ironic.

 

You serious about this?

 

Unlikely to start? He is better than any receiver we have with one hand tied behind his back

 

I was unclear, I meant to say he was unlikely to start performing like a top 3 receiver here.

 

Still was better than what we got for him which is tje root of thhe problem, talent acquisition

 

In hindsight I wouldn't have drafted Egnew.

Still the draft is a lot easier if I had a time machine, where I was allowed to watch 13 games and then draft accordingly.

As of right now the trade does not look great, however in 4 years if Egnew is a top pass catching tight end, people will not be caring as much. Especially if Marshall is let go of the Bears for being a jerk.

Basically it is too early to make such a judgement overall. Still I am not a fan of not even trying to find an upgrade on wide receiver. They had chances.

 

Well, to be fair, and I know that Disgustipate has clarified his position, but with everything surrounding the whole bar incident, there might have been a chance he wouldn't start.

*runs out of the thread*

 

That's not how that works.

 

not a theory. It's been bad.

 

Trading Marshall was a big mistake. This team currently lacks anyone to sufficiently berate the rookie QB and/or coaches.

 

He also opened up the field for our RBs and other WRs. He actually also commanded double teams and respects from opposing defenses. Brandon Marshall being on the field benefited every other offensive player on the field as well.

 

Yes, it's pretty much totally how it works. We're almost to the point of addition by subtraction.

It also illustrates how much Brandon Marshall has to be the focus of your offense.

 

No, it's not. He drew double teams and opened things up.

 

That's why Davone Bess and Brian Hartline were so much more productive when Marshall was here than they are now?

 

I forget the exact number, but its reaching Randy-Ratio levels in Chicago.

 

it doesn't.

Good WR play benefits the TE's and RB's. Not to mention the QB. It is not a 1 +1 production metric. Nevermind that even if you do it 1 +1, it still doesn't come close. I noticed that TD's was not a stat you cited.

 

Yeah but in this case, for the most part, it is exactly what teams are doing. Giving one of the safeties the freedom to see the play and react while standing 4 to 5 yards closer to the LOS than normal.

 

That's exactly the kind of Wr I want on my team. One that's good enough to be the focal point of an offense.

 

Do you really think Hartline and Bess are better off having to face the #1 & #2 opposing CBs as opposed to the #2 and nickel CB?

Defenses don't respect our WRs. Defenses respected Brandon Marshall. He made a difference just lining up each down.

 

Which is fine if its working.

 

Dropping TD passes always benefits an offense.

 

How exactly do you define working? The Bears' offense isn't any more efficient than it was last season. Marshall is very productive, but its been at the expense of other players. You've rearranged the furniture, but you haven't improved the layout. I don't think his attitude is very conducive to winning in a team sport.

 

That's not how that works.

Here ya go:

Davone Bess w/ Marshall in 11': 6.46 YPT, 3 TD's.
without/ Marshall in 12': 7.48 YPT 1 TD

Brian Hartline w/ Marshall in 11': 8.19 YPT, 1 TD
without/ Marshall in 12': 8.40 YPT 1 TD

Marshall in 11': 8.37 YPT. 6 TD's

Now the trio in 11': 295 Targets, 2300 yards, 7.79 YPT 10 TD's

The Duo in 12': 214 Targets, 1703, 7.95 YPT 2 TD's

That is how it is done. They did not replace his production, and the DUO is nowhere near as productive as the Trio was. The only thing you can say is that Davone Bess improved with Marshall gone, and even then, it was a mild improvement.

 

No, I don't*

I do however thing they are better off without Brandon Marshall, though. The positives do not outweigh the negatives.

There needs to be evidence of this.

This is the most Section126-est post ever.

You managed to compare Brian Hartline and Davone Bess through 13 games to Brandon Marshall, Brian Hartline, and Davone Bess through 16 games, and still not come up with a compelling argument.

They're more efficient on a per-target basis, they're more productive individually(despite higher levels of opposition), and the only aspect that you actually posted in any sort of context that is favorable is touchdowns.

Except for, you know, Brandon Marshall was a horrifyingly bad red zone target last year dropping nearly as passes in the end zone as he caught, and the Dolphins overall red zone success is better this year than it was last year. I'd post the Picard facepalm, but that wouldn't be strong enough.

 

We wish we could have him dropping Td's here right now. Because our Wr's are not even close to getting them thrown their way.


But look what happens when you have solid Qb play. He is tearing it up this season and his 9 Td's....

 

Jesus H. Marino.

There is no way that it's this hard to understand.

If you have THREE...it is harder to have a collective average number better than TWO, if they are producing at the same rate.

So therefore...they WEREN'T more productive. You are talking about less than 6 inches per target improvement in 12'. 2 versus 3.

SO 6 inches more per target between TWO guys means that trading Marshall was a good idea?

That is patently ridiculous.

 

Notice that nobody mentions how Fasano's production fell off as well, when Marshall left. It's as if he doesn't exist.

 

It's very easy to understand, it's just an absolute train wreck of an argument.

There's no reason why three players should have a worse average than two players when the basic point of your argument is that three players is better.

 

I take a more holistic definition of something like 'working', so I'd include everything you said. If it's hurting the team, it's not working. Bottom line, are we winning because of this. If we are, keep doing it.

 

this is ***-backwards. The opposite is true.

 

So what exactly reflects this, then ?

 

Same principle as a hitters 1-9 collectively hitting or just hitters 3-5. 3-5 are gonna be better.

For the collective group to be on par and surpass the production, especially when you throw in Fasano (it gets uglier for the current group) then that really tells you something.

that's before we talk about the run game.

3 players producing at the same clip as 2 is better, because it is much more difficult to do so.

 

I know you watched the games last year. Tell me which one of our receivers is ever double teamed by opposing defenses? Which receiver do we have that can stretch the field. What receiver do we have that defenses actually have to respect in our passing game? What receiver do we have that might make defenses think twice about leaving their CBs alone in man to man coverage?

I'll answer it for you- none. I'm not dissing Bess or Hartline. I think they are good receivers in their own right but in no way, shape, or form should they be a #1 & #2 tandem in the NFL.

 

Here is where it gets interesting...

had they replaced Marshall with a high YPC guy that produces TD's....

they would have easily replaced him and surpassed his production. They didn't do that.

They could have made the trade work for them. They didn't.

 

How is this at all supported? And what does it have to do with the rest of that word salad?

 

Designed double teams? None. 95% of the wide receivers in the league don't draw designed double teams with any regularity. Brandon Marshall does, but again, tell me how that meant sweet **** all to the offense last year?

It certainly didn't help Brian Hartline and Davone Bess be more productive.

Brian Hartline does, factually regardless of whatever feelings people might have about his speed.

"Respect" is a really stupid concept in the context of football.

Teams don't line up man to man, cover-0 with the Dolphins. That's not what happens. We're drawing the same kind of coverage most of the rest of the league does.

But somehow they are, and are quite productive?

 

It's hard to see how Disgustipate's position makes any sense here, I think Section126 is clearly winning this argument.

 

Excellent, then you'll almost certainly have no problems explaining this: