I'm no hunter, but

"Several factors have led to a low wolf take this winter, so we're going to step up our efforts to meet the annual objectives in this important program," Commissioner Denby Lloyd with the Alaska Department of Fish and Game said in a statement Wednesday.

The program, now in its fourth year and operating in five areas of the state, is designed to increase moose and caribou numbers by reducing the number of predators.

The Board of Game recently urged Palin to let state staff shoot wolves from helicopters.

Shooting from helicopters that hover close to packs would be more deadly and humane than from the airplanes that are currently allowed, board members have said.

Palin has asked Fish and Game officials to charter helicopters only as a last resort.

Alaska puts bounty on wolves - Environment - MSNBC.com

"Celtkin wrote:

Alaska puts bounty on wolves - Environment - MSNBC.com

Thank you.

Weak. Wolves, when they are get out of control, can have a devastating affect on a state's animal populations. Would people rather they catch them in traps?

When you're hunting for food, i.e., deer, moose, etc, people say that hunting takes skill. However, when you're elminating predators, like wolves that are a danger, that is when you don't depend on skill or cunning. I was actually watching a program on the History Channel a couple weeks ago about Alaska. They were following this one guy around who had at least one dog, it might have been 3 dogs killed by wolves. All the wolves left of his dog was the collar. Anyway, he was trying to hunt the wolves down, and he was using all sorts of stuff, even night vision goggles, and he couldn't find them to shoot them. So, the point is, to really make a difference in the wolf population, it may take going to the air.

"schmolioot wrote:

isn't it supposed to be a sport that takes skill, cunning, etc.?

If you WERE a hunter, perhaps you'd know the difference between hunters going after game for sport and the government culling populations of certain animals to regulate their numbers.

Wow. Love the part about a $150 bounty for a severed wolf foreleg.

"ckparrothead wrote:

Wow. Love the part about a $150 bounty for a severed wolf foreleg.

What's wrong with a bounty on animals that are a problem? My grandfather used to do that when he was a kid, growing up during the Depression. They had bounties on porcupines, coyotes, all sorts of animals here in NH.

"Rick 1966 wrote:

If you WERE a hunter, perhaps you'd know the difference between hunters going after game for sport and the government culling populations of certain animals to regulate their numbers.

This is one thing I never understood. Doesn't nature have its own way of culling populations? Seems man only does more damage when he attempts to balance the equation. JMO though.

"Rick 1966 wrote:

If you WERE a hunter, perhaps you'd know the difference between hunters going after game for sport and the government culling populations of certain animals to regulate their numbers.

I merely posed the question. Celt posted an article, I read it and thanked him.

If this were merely for hunting, I would stand by the point.

"HardKoreXXX wrote:

This is one thing I never understood. Doesn't nature have its own way of culling populations? Seems man only does more damage when he attempts to balance the equation. JMO though.

Even if it's necessary, it is a pretty brutal practice.

"schmolioot wrote:

Even if it's necessary, it is a pretty brutal practice.

Ever been to a sausage factory?

"schmolioot wrote:

isn't it supposed to be a sport that takes skill, cunning, etc.?

Ben Smith's Blog: Defenders of Wildlife vs. Palin: 'Brutal' -

Politico.com

I thought that wolves, or at least most species of them were on the federal endangered protected list. Or were anyway. If that is the case, state laws can only make a federal law more restrictive but not more lenient. Even if they were taken off the pretocted list, i would think it to be a bit much to post bounties on them now.

"resnor wrote:

What's wrong with a bounty on animals that are a problem? My grandfather used to do that when he was a kid, growing up during the Depression. They had bounties on porcupines, coyotes, all sorts of animals here in NH.

Typically, in the past, bounties were put on animals that affected domestic livestock. But to protect wild herds of moose, caribou, etc, is another matter. It is the natural order of things. Usually, wolves cull out the weak, sick animals, ensuring the strong ones survive, etc.

"HardKoreXXX wrote:

This is one thing I never understood. Doesn't nature have its own way of culling populations? Seems man only does more damage when he attempts to balance the equation. JMO though.

Yellowstone park was devastated by the fact they killed off the wolf population in it. They had to import wolves from Canada to re-seed the park with a wolf population. Wolf kills have always been and will always be stupid. Any hunter worth their salt knows wolves are part of the ecosystem. If there's too many wolves, their food supply drops and they starve off to a reasonable number. It's called nature.

"Darkoak wrote:

Yellowstone park was devastated by the fact they killed off the wolf population in it. They had to import wolves from Canada to re-seed the park with a wolf population. Wolf kills have always been and will always be stupid. Any hunter worth their salt knows wolves are part of the ecosystem. If there's too many wolves, their food supply drops and they starve off to a reasonable number. It's called nature.

Before that happens the wolves will kill a lot of livestock and pets in whatever communities are nearby.

If wolves are getting in to human things, and killing pets and stuff like that, then they don't necessariliy just die off when the herds get thinned out.

"DeDolfan wrote:

I thought that wolves, or at least most species of them were on the federal endangered protected list. Or were anyway. If that is the case, state laws can only make a federal law more restrictive but not more lenient. Even if they were taken off the pretocted list, i would think it to be a bit much to post bounties on them now.

I know this is kind of off-topic, but this reminds me of the famous Libertarian magicians episode on the Endangered Species Act.

YouTube - P&T Bull**** Endangered Species Part 1

YouTube - P&T Bull**** Endangered Species Part 2

"Zach13 wrote:

Before that happens the wolves will kill a lot of livestock and pets in whatever communities are nearby.

That's the price for living in an area with wildlife. I mean here there have been some bear attacks lately in Vancouver. Well the urban sprawl is putting houses right into their territories, what do you think is going to happen? If you are going to live across the street from bear habitat you are going to confront bears, common sense would dictate that I believe.

My take is wolf populations affecting hunters ability to find game is more the reason for the wolf kill in Alaska. There are still some people that see wolves as vermin of all things. Sickening really.

"resnor wrote:

If wolves are getting in to human things, and killing pets and stuff like that, then they don't necessariliy just die off when the herds get thinned out.

This is the exception not the rule.

"Zach13 wrote:

Before that happens the wolves will kill a lot of livestock and pets in whatever communities are nearby.

But, question is, is that what is happening now in Alaska to prompt these bounties?

"Darkoak wrote:

That's the price for living in an area with wildlife. I mean here there have been some bear attacks lately in Vancouver. Well the urban sprawl is putting houses right into their territories, what do you think is going to happen? If you are going to live across the street from bear habitat you are going to confront bears, common sense would dictate that I believe.

My take is wolf populations affecting hunters ability to find game is more the reason for the wolf kill in Alaska. There are still some people that see wolves as vermin of all things. Sickening really.

Along these same lines, this county I live in supposedly raises more broilers than any other in the US. We also have several operating dairy farms left in the area as well and we're in probably one of the fastes growing areas in the mid atlantic region. I find it quite amusing when some hot shot developer comes in and build a huge fancy subdivision which homes sell for >half mil alot of times and after these ppl move in, they bitch about the smell and sometimes go to court to have the farmers, smetimes 4th and 5th generation farmers to cease operations and the odor. So far, no suits have been sucessful yet.

"HardKoreXXX wrote:

This is one thing I never understood. Doesn't nature have its own way of culling populations? Seems man only does more damage when he attempts to balance the equation. JMO though.

The problem is, man has already changed the equation. When nature "culls the herd," it frequently leads to entire populations disappearing. We don't want the entire populations to disappear since there aren't enough numbers elsewhere to replace them, so we have to cull them this way.

"Rick 1966 wrote:

The problem is, man has already changed the equation. When nature "culls the herd," it frequently leads to entire populations disappearing. We don't want the entire populations to disappear since there aren't enough numbers elsewhere to replace them, so we have to cull them this way.

Typically in nature, one year is better than another in that some years the "food chain" flourishes more than others, do to weather, less droughts, etc. During the good years, populations thrive and grow but during lean years, the food supply is down, animals dor not reproduce as prolifically so as to protect the "seed stock". predators then die off usually by starvation or whatever. it is a cruel way to die but it is nature, just the same.

"Darkoak wrote:

My take is wolf populations affecting hunters ability to find game is more the reason for the wolf kill in Alaska. There are still some people that see wolves as vermin of all things. Sickening really.

That right there was my first thought. Basically, they're so worried about the wolves killing off the caribou and moose, because hunters (Sarah Palin included) want to kill them instead. The answer? Kill the bears and wolves. Then hunters get to kill wolves, collect bounties, and kill more caribou and moose, too. Everyone wins! (except the ecosystem).

"ckparrothead wrote:

That right there was my first thought. Basically, they're so worried about the wolves killing off the caribou and moose, because hunters (Sarah Palin included) want to kill them instead. The answer? Kill the bears and wolves. Then hunters get to kill wolves, collect bounties, and kill more caribou and moose, too. Everyone wins! (except the ecosystem).

Come on CK. Her ability to kill a moose is one of her chief qualifications for VP.