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How good will Tannehill be in 2017?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by zatrex99, Jun 11, 2017.

  1. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    He's the 14th highest paid QB in the league.
     
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  2. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    No he isn't, especially when you consider what guys will be getting as they come of rookie contracts.

    Again, an argument that has been disproved many times, but gets brought back up and spouted as fact, as if it's never been discussed.
     
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  3. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Brady and Wilson are two most recent examples of needing a top 5 defense to win the big game.
     
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  4. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    We were #10 in YPC, #16 in TD's and #23 in YPG in 2015.

    YPG is influenced by W/L record because rushing attempts are higher when you're ahead, so given that we were 6-10 the lower YPG ranking is at least partially understandable.

    Either way, those numbers scream "average" more than "bad". So no 2015 isn't an exception.
     
  5. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    It's a good example of something that could be judged in different ways. So the idea we should just trust Fahey or think anyone for that matter is truly an authoritative source (think pff that tries this stuff) has to be pushed down a notch.
     
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  6. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    You know I really hate all of the threads questioning Tannehill but I'll pose this in this particular thread...How good will Tannehill be?

    Hmmmm, well the NFL just released numbers 21-30 on the NFL's Top 100 players...and Tannehill STILL hasn't come up on the list yet..
    Roethlisburger at 22
    Wilson at 24
    Stafford at 31
    Newton at 44
    Mariota at 50
    Suck for Luck at 51
    Winston at 57
    Cousins at 70
    Rivers at 73
    Smith at 81

    There's some quarterbacks on that list that are Super Bowl champions or played in the Super Bowl and then there's some quarterbacks on that list that are flat out SCRUBS.

    How good will Tannehill be? I'm wagering he's going to be #16.
     
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  7. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Appreciate the sentiment, but Thill isn't going to be on that list.
     
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  8. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Don't agree with you Tony...I just can't see how some of those scrub quarterbacks could make this list and Tannehill doesn't.
     
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  9. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Friendly wager only hopefully. Don't wager money on Tannehill making the list this year.

    If Tannehill plays like he did the last 8 games of 2016, he'll be on the top 100 list for sure next year.
     
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  10. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Don't get me wrong, he should be on there and starting next year, he'll be on there every year. I just don;t think it happens this year.

    It would be **** if you right though.
     
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  11. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Like I said...we'll see but I already said where I think he'll be.
     
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  12. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    True, most teams that win the SB have good D's, but the 2000 Ravens is beyond generational, probably the best ever, and they also had a dominant run game as well.

    Practically any starting QB in the league at that time could have won the SB with the Ravens that year, a lot of backs ups too for that matter, so I think that Dilfer isn't a good example, that's all I'm trying to say.
     
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  13. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You're not gonna let the clock hit double digits are ya ;)
     
  14. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I clocked it in at 2.7 and 3, but again, that's with me trying to operate on an iphone and the NFL's terrible video system. So I was being conservative lest someone say I was biased.
     
  15. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't have an issue with him being a Dolphins fan. He hates Landry, for example. Okay he doesn't hate him, but think he's replaceable, expendable. Tavon Austin 2.0.

    Fahey latches onto an idea, and that idea won't change no matter what. He's got a serious case of confirmation bias, and he has admitted he doesn't like to debate his views.
     
  16. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    The 1985 Bears, any of the 1970's Steelers SB teams, 1962 Packers, early 2000's Bucs, 2013-2014 Seahawks, Dolphins "No Name", 2000 Ravens, 2015 Broncos, most of NE's defenses of the 2000's, and a few others, all had generational type defenses and would give the 2000 Ravens a run for their money. And nearly any starting QB on any of those teams could have won the SB.
     
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  17. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The NE defenses were good but they were not generational. That's silly. The Ravens allowed 10.3 ppg. The 2001 Pats defense allowed 17 ppg. They ranked 6th, in first place was the Bears at 12.7 ppg. In 2003 and 2004 they were better. These were top defense, but not generational.

    2015 Broncos defense was suffocating as well. Early bucs were good but not Ravens good.
     
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  18. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    Seriously though. How logical is it to ask someone to tell you what QB's have thrived when NOT having full audible power? (he had limited options but could change the dynamics of a play)

    Not one person on here is privy to that info for 32 teams the past 25 years. So Columbo I ask you, how is that a valid question to ask someone? Then have the lack of awareness to call it a "fact".

    Serious question.
     
  19. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    In 14 out of 16 seasons they were ranked top 10. In 7 out of those 14 they were ranked top 5. In 4 out of those 7 they were ranked top 2.

    The Pats of the 2000's have had generational defenses for, most likely, the longest stretch in NFL history. In 2003 they gave up 14ppg. In 2004, 16ppg. In 2006, 14ppg. In 2016, 15ppg.
     
  20. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    I wasn't talking about audibles. I was talking about sacks.
     
  21. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I'll give you three reasons he won't be on that list. And unfortunately, none of them have to do with what we saw RT do in 2016.

    1) The Tannehill I saw in the 2nd half of that NE loss early in the season is a certified, HOF quarterback with UNLIMITED POTENTIAL. I was blown away. Belichek was blown away and outright scared while standing on the sideline. All he could do was pout and glance at the clock every few seconds...the man was terrified because he had no answers. I think that marked the changing of the guard in the AFC East...no baloney. But guess what...I saw those 2nd half drives, you saw them and so did the Patriots.....but nobody else did. People don't pay attention to the Dolphins or Tannehill because they see us as 2nd class to New England.

    Side note- it's a shame Tannehill didn't suit up for round two against the Pats. I was really looking forward to that match-up and how Belichek reacted.

    2) For me, the story of 2016 was comebacks....we had so many amazing wins with last second drives. Tannehill was a massive part of that and deserves loads of credit. Yet, we were fighting back in the game against teams like Cleveland, San Fran and other bottom feeders. Anyone who knows football is going to say we should have dominated those games and won by 30 if our offense is legit...so they're not giving Tannehill credit for last-minute heroics against bums.

    3) Tannehill is still not a proven commodity outside Miami. I heard two newscasts this week asking if he should even be the starter or if we should have drafted a QB in round 1 as an eventual heir. And while I think that's bull****, the national media has a big impact on perception in the NFL....including with the players themselves. Folks just don't see him as a franchise QB...even though most of us do.
     
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  22. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    I know, Im just asking your opinion on someone claiming something is a "fact" when they have ZERO evidence of who can and can't audible?

    Im not disagreeing with the premise, hell I brought that to these discussions that not being able to audible is a handicap for ANY QB.
     
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  23. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You can't have three generational defenses in one decade. That defeats the purpose of the word, generational.

    Every year there is a number one defense. Every year there is a top-five defense. Actually five of them.

    Nobody considers any individual New England patriot defense as being generational or all-time best. Except you.
     
  24. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    Really?

    Are you speaking of how he will be in 2017 or are you talking about him being on this list based on 2016?
     
  25. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    that is just silly.
     
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  26. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Not even the Seahawks defense of the past few years is considered one of the all-time great's. Those were better than any individual New England defense
     
  27. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You think it's silly that I don't consider the NE defenses to be a generational?

    If so I think we all just have a different interpretation of what the word generational means
     
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  28. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I think it is silly to get into that aspect of the argument. it helps no one and just wastes everyone's time.
     
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  29. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    True. But farm discussions Always devolve that way.

    I just can't help myself when somebody names three generational defenses in one decade.

    New England's defense is whenever even great. They were good. They ranked in the top four points scored but there yardage number sucked. The best defenses of all time were suffocating yardage and points per game giving their offense football a lot more. Into thousand one and 2003 I believe they were ranked in the bottom in yards allowed
     
  30. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    That's why I said the Pats of the 2000's ...I used a few of their years to reinforce the point that you missed. Kind of like how I used the "Steelers of the 1970's" and the Dolphins "No Names" (which spanned roughly 6 seasons).

    Anyone who thinks the Pats defenses of the 2000's haven't been some of the best the NFL has ever seen isn't paying attention or doesn't know what they're watching.
     
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  31. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I have zero interest in discussing farming. I don't care how much you like corn.
     
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  32. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    lol...Wrong
     
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  33. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Lol. Forum. Typing and driving is always full of mistakes
     
  34. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I highly disagree with this statement. I have seen a few people put them up with one of the all time greats. They have lead the league in points against in 4 seasons and last year they were 3rd.
     
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  35. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End Club Member

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    I think most of the media is lazy when it comes to this stuff. They have made their judgement back in his second year and thats all they have to say. They have been living off that perception since then and spouting it by rote. It will take Tannehill to play a full season like he did that 8 game stretch to change perceptions and opinions and maybe he'll squeak in next year. Until they have to sit back and reevaluate their position, they wont.
     
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  36. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Yeah I agree 2013 Seahawks defense has to be up there. My reason is because they destroyed that record setting offense by Peyton Manning in the SB. Peyton threw a record 55 TD's in the 2013 season and if you remember (wasn't long ago) people were talking about which was better: best passing offense or best passing defense.

    Yeah.. Seahawks destroyed them 43-8. For me that was the best passing defense ever.

    So personally, I'd say 4 really stand out: 70's Steel Curtain, '85 Bears, 2000 Ravens, and 2013 Seahawks.

    btw.. the one team I'd put up there even without winning the SB is the '76 Steelers. Guys check these stats out:
    http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/pit/1976.htm

    They lose Bradshaw after starting 1-4, then proceed to have the most shutouts in an NFL season (5) including 3 in a row, and over a 9 game period gave up an average of 3.1 ppg!!
     
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  37. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Fair. I have 2013 hovering ~4-6. Usually when we talk about greats we talk about them taking to and winning the super bowl. They've got to stymy everyone they face that year to and through the Bowl. So 2013 counts.

    I just disagree with the loosey-goosey definition of generational. Heck, our defense under Johnson and Wanny were pretty good too. Top 5 several times. Top overall in 1998. Outshined by Balt in 2000 and Tampa in 2001 those defenses were tops.

    We didn't even sniff a SB.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2017
  38. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    You're exactly right and I can't tell you how much it pisses me off when they bash us all season, then say something like, "Well Bill, they've won 8 out of the last 9 and I really like what I'm seeing from their offense (meaning the 30 second clip they caught on Sports Center). Jay Ajayi is a superstar and he's put the entire team on his back to carry them into the postseason."

    And I'm sitting there like, "Really? WTF?" No mention of the line turnaround, Tannehill's crazy comebacks, Landry dragging 3 and 4 people for TD's, Stills smoking everyone deep, Moore coming off the bench after 5 years and looking like Johnny Unitas? All they can talk about is Ajayi? But again, that's all that was on ESPN so that's the only thing they have a clue about.
     
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  39. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Don't get pissed off bro. They're just talking and they have to find something to talk about. It has zero effect of how the team plays each day. Just dismiss it
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2017
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  40. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    One team in NFL history have lead the league in points scored 4 years in a row.
    The "generational" Baltimore Ravens defense was only top 10 three years in a row and #1 once. There is a great argument that this Seahawks defense is the best of all-time. They have been top 10 in points scored 6 years in a row and twice during the time they were #1 points, they were #1 yards as well.

    IMO, Current Seahawks defense blows the Ravens defense out of the water and it is not even close.

    EDIT: I do not say that lightly. I am sick of the Seahawks being good and look forward to people of this area no longer giving a ****
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2017
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