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Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by bkbuffet, May 22, 2008.
Haha that sounds about right. Having balls and being stupid is a fine line. But if we're going by that then Id say that diving head-first into the endzone for a preseason TD indicates a yes. Not to say that I didnt go "O ****! Dont do it!" when I watched that play.
I think JB will be a great QB for us and am hoping he succeeds. But a few more of those phantom fumbles returned for a TD and I will start getting visions of Ray Lucas.
Agreed, I think he is swinging a pretty heavy sack of em. That particular play indicated to me his willingness to lay it on the line for the good of the team. He was looking for the goal line, not the sideline. Taking a physical beating is one way to show you have the balls to succeed. Mental toughness in the heat of battle is the other. JB mishandling the snap from center so often could possibly cast doubt in Tuna's mind on the mental side though. IMO, JB, has both and should prove to be a good field general in Henning's offense.
It looks like Parcells didnt review the highlights from last year.
JB didnt take care of the ball well enough perhaps because because he was trying too hard or because the game has not slowed down for him yet...he was only a rookie .....playing behind an OL that was mediocre
He bounced right up soon after a hit and he did not act gunshy.
IMO toughness was not one of his problems.
I believe that is exactly what he was trying to do Crunch. I think his quick release has served him well in the past and he was determined to get the ball into play before the blocking broke down on him. The pass rush was coming fast and furious because there was absolutely no threat of a running game for him to rely on.
We'll see, I don't believe Tuna was speaking about balls as in toughness, hell, anyone can take a beating, that is not a talent.
I think Tuna was speaking about playmaking gutsyness, throwing down the field into coverage and thinking he can pull out off, or taking off and scrambling when he thinks he can make the first down or TD or whatever and believing he will make it the whole time.
Cam had Beck on such a short leash last year that Beck maybe is a bit to much into risk avoidance rather then playmaking or trying to make a play. JB's problem isn't the typical rookie one of trying to force the ball, the thought of forcing the ball never occurs to him because he won't even try it.
Beck was on a short leash, as you say, because Cameron didn't even want Beck out there. If it had been up to Cam, Beck wouldn't have taken a single snap in 2007. Huizenga is responsible for Beck seeing playing time.
Where do you see evidence of that. Most rookies listen to their coach. If as you say Cameron had him on a short leash then that answers your question. Beck IMHO showed he has large brass shiney ones.
Cam should have adjusted IMO, Beck's footwork is still at the leaving BYU stage, you've read the thread with the video about Beck's release, his footwork is improved by leaps and bounds over last year.
Beck had the #2 arm and was the 3rd fastest Qb at the Combine last year, we saw none of it during his 4 games stint because Cam wouldn't "let" him, that has got to have made him a bit gunshy about actually playing, I'm sure he has the plays down even with chicken mcnuggets and french fries, now he just has to be let loose to make some plays.
That is one of the things that gives me a spark of confidence in John Beck, during the preseason last year, he played great, that pass against KC threaded the needle, and during the garbage time with the Bengals, the pressure was off and he played great then too.
Just a little insight from a BYU fan who followed Beck during his BYU career:
He had several significant injuries during his career and played through them. He also never seemed to be too bothered by a pressure rush - particularly during his junior year, I can remember him standing in the pocket and delivering an on-target pass moments before being crushed by a defender on a number of occasions.
His senior year, he had two severely sprained ankles suffered in the first game of the year. They bothered him most of the season, and in fact his practice was limited by the injuries during the season. Yet, the team went 11-2 and he was one of the most efficient QB's in the country.
Between his junior and senior year, the BYU boards had a lot of discussion about whether he had "it" (whatever "it" is - I'd think it's probably pretty comparable to Bill Parcells "balls" - not his in particular, but you get the point, I'm sure). Very persuasive were statistics showing that Beck's numbers (even before his senior season) were better in the 4th quarter - IIRC even better than those of BYU's Heisman winner, Ty Detmer, who nobody ever accused of not having balls (but who did not have anything close to Beck's physical talent).
I'll have to see if I can track down those posts, but Beck had an impressive number of 4th quarter TD drives in close games, which I think are a pretty good indication of whether a QB has "balls" or not.
I don't think I'm trying to convince anyone of anything with this. All I'm saying if all Parcells is questioning at this point about Beck is whether he has balls, I think he's going to be pretty pleasantly surprised.
Don't let the "deer in the headlights" look confuse you - he had that early in his BYU career, too. But when things clicked for him, that was quickly forgotten.
No, that I disagree with phinphever, in the Bills game he was a deer in the headlights and overmatched.
It wasn't until Lemon was hurt against Cinci that JB showed that he can do some things and that was a prevent defense, he played great, but still, that wasn't prime time as in against the real Cinci "D".
Keep in mind Beck received no coaching or snaps in the regular season until about a week or two before he started.
How does a professional football coach knowingly go into the season with his #1 QB having a history of concussions and NOT factor that in with preparation time for his backups?
Because he had his head up his ***.
I think it's been pretty well documented and discussed that Cam made some very poor coaching decisions.
From the time he drafted Beck, I don't think Cam planned to have him play, let alone start, a game until he carried a clip board for a year.
Also, I think it is a bit unfair to label Green with a 'history of concussions'. He had one. It was a pretty nasty one, but it was only one, until he took a knee to the head last year making a chop block. Green did however have a history of consistent play and not missing many games due to injury, so I can't really blame him for trusting in Green and only worrying about Lemon as a backup. Compare Green's concussion history to that of Zach Thomas. I didn't here many people worrying about Zach's concussion history they way they did about Green's before last year, and Zach had several before then compared to Green's one.
Anyway, my point is Beck was literally thrown to the wolves with very little in the way of coaching or preparation last year. Now, from the sound of it, he has done nothing but prepare and train with coaches the whole off season. I think we will see a very different and confident John Beck take the field and end up being a very competent QB for the Dolphin's this year. If the new OL can give him some protection and a little time, he is going to surprise a lot of people.
Try and breathe through your mouth.
Here is JB in preseason.Very raw as you can see but with flashes of brilliance
Willl have the regular season highlights in a few minutes
I was under the impression he had a string of them. I stand corrected.
I feel the same way toward John Beck. I think he's gonna be sharp and take advantage of a potentially dominate rushing attack provided everyone concerned comes back healthy and the OL gels.
Regular season highlights and lowlights
Thanks Derek, you rock brother.
I think the key here is not courage to throw the ball a certain place; I think it's about leadership in the huddle and the ability to come back and make big plays when you've made a bad play. It's about mental toughness that lets you keep making plays after something bad happens.
The other factor that relates to this - and I saw problems with Beck last year - is having the poise to keep great mechanics consistently on every throw. On some of the highlights for JB you see a lot of bad footwork when he throws the ball and his motion changes as a result. Part of that is getting consistent mechanics. However, a player can have very good mechanics and then he gets into a game and they leave him completely. I think we've all experienced that if we've played a sport. You feel like you can do it until you get on the field in a pressure situation and your head is swimming a bit; you don't have that mental toughness (I think that's what Parcells is getting at) to do what you are supposed to do consistently.
A QB's head is his biggest problem - unless he's really inaccurate. It will be interesting to see if the work that Lee has done with him translates on the field in pressure circumstances.
Reminds me of a postcard I just saw at Target.
Caption said: Cam Cameron's Coaching Philosophy
I don't really care who's "fault" it was that Beck was given time.
That struggle, the experience and the awakening Beck got from it will only help him readying for his 2nd year. I still to this day think it was a great move to put him in seeing how far gone our season was. He got the butterflies out and got to see the NFL at full gametime speed. Nothing but a benefit to his growth.
Either Beck has the balls, and gets the nod, then shows us he can play, or he hasn't got them and we need Henne or Josh, I hope Beck has the balls, I really do (sorry Josh, I just like Beck and think he can do it). We'll see, at least it looks as though he's going to get the chance to find out.
Open competition is all we can ask for. It will only make the team better. My only beef has been with those that have declared JB was history because he wasn't a Parcells guy. Attitude goes a long way in how management feels about you in any business.
Well, I can see this to some point, because Parcells definitely likes 'his guys'.
But, he also knows how to evaluate talent, and so does Ireland.