Game of Thrones - Season 6

I'm wondering... What's Dany's endgame with the Dothraki if she wins the throne? I imagine her unsullied will serve as her personal army. She could free them, but I don't see what they would do? But the Dothraki aren't interested in castles... Does she just send them back to Essos?

Gendry! :lol: I was a little surprised even though I expected to see him. Now the whole lets go north of the wall to catch a WW... yeah, that's not good writing there IMO. I mean it's cool and stuff (literally :shifty:).. did they take there dragon glass armory with them? They should just build armor suits spiked with dragon glass, and then they could run thru the enemy :lol: But the real time deal is all on its head. How long should that trip from dragon stone to east watch have taken?

And I'm a little confused by the message that Littlefinger planted in his room to draw Arya into something. What was the message and what it supposed to do, cause a rift between Arya/Sansa/Jon?

***Not sure where the spoiler tag went, but spoilers for most recent episode below***

**SPOILS**
The message I believe was from early in the series - the one Cersei made Sansa write to Robb about bending the knee and Eddard being a traitor and such. It's being set up so that Arya/Sansa go after each other while Littlefinger benefits. It's one of the least interesting or needed things. This episode reflected very badly on the character of Arya. She went from ultra assassin to child spy, easily getting lead around by the nose and not bothering to hide herself. And why the fuck is she going after Sansa for wanting to lead anyway? It's not like Jon has been doing a great job, while Sansa is actually well suited to it. Fuck you Arya! Just kill Littlefinger and have Robin pledge to Sansa while Royce leads the army. Boom, done.

Secondly, Cersei being pregnant ... ugh I guess we should be in no way surprised, but now either we are going to see a pregnant lady get whacked, or not see Cersei get just comeuppance. If the show (or books for that matter) let her off the hook, someone needs to get shanked. I am just tired of her constantly rolling natural 20s on the dice to always come out on top despite being such a horrible person with no clue what she is doing. Jaimie's look at the end though after the 3000th time she said "betrayal" - maybe shit is finally getting through?

Speaking of Jaime, how the fuck did he and Bronn surface so far away from everyone, and how the fuck did they not get immediately captured by Dothraki? Show magic, yeah!

And goddamit Sam, Gilly fucking TOLD YOU ABOUT RHAEGAR and you shut her down. Raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! I guess he is the head of House Tarly now, so maybe he will go home (even though he doesn't yet know).

On the plus side, Drogon knows what's up. Fuck yeah Drogon. I think it would be poetic to have Rhaegal swoop in and be all MY HOMIE, LET"S RIDE! when Jon returns.

And I know some people are bagging on the Suicide Squad and how it all came together, but fuck that noise, that shit is going to be the tits and I love it, even if Jon going north again was the dumbest possible thing a King could have done haha. I am down with Gendry resurfacing and hammering away, but awkward having another King claimant around. Maybe he just eventually restarts the old defunct Baratheon

Big question: Anyone else get the feeling either Jon or Dany will die? Who seems more likely? Why?
Also, I know people still keep bringing up Clegane Bowl, and while Sandor escorting a captured wight to King's Landing may set it up, how would he kill that which is already dead? Mountain is a zombie - remember that fanatic spiking him in the chest to no effect?

"Claymore95 wrote:

Yeah, can't disagree with any of that. The show is still awesome and I'll eagerly watch every remaining episode, but the writing's almost fallen apart since they've not had GRRM's material to fall back on. The plotholes get bigger and bigger, the character writing gets poorer and poorer, and I'm at the stage now where I just ignore them as thinking on them too much would take away from what is still a fantastic show to watch. In a way, it's just as well it's going to finish after the next season, as without the source material I think the show would only get worse to the point where fans would desert it in droves.

Eh, it's partly lack of source material, and partly that they want to blister through the last part in such a rapid fashion. They have to tie up loose ends imperfectly and careen from part to part without stopping. It's lead to the weird time issues (Euron is everywhere!) and such. I don't really know what else they could do aside from not end it so fast, but that didn't seem an option.

"Clark Kent wrote:

I'm wondering... What's Dany's endgame with the Dothraki if she wins the throne? I imagine her unsullied will serve as her personal army. She could free them, but I don't see what they would do? But the Dothraki aren't interested in castles... Does she just send them back to Essos?

Easy answer is to send them back. If they want to stay, put them under a Westerosi lord and let them ride around the Riverlands or Highgarden to watch things. Third answer - killed in large numbers fighting either Cersei's army or more likely the Night King.

The message I believe was from early in the series - the one Cersei made Sansa write to Robb about bending the knee and Eddard being a traitor and such. It's being set up so that Arya/Sansa go after each other while Littlefinger benefits. It's one of the least interesting or needed things.

I disagree, It is needed and interesting! We've watched two little girls grow into powerful women, after overcoming various challenges, hardships, and set backs. We're rooting for both them. Not only them as people, but as two people who can bring justice to Westeros. Despite having every reason to join together, political self interest getting in the way of more noble intentions. Which is a running theme of the entire series. Although this feels more poignant given the characters of Sansa and Arya, as well as the circumstances of the whole Stark family in general.

When Arya started smack talking Sansa, I wish Sansa had pointed out (as she did to Jon), that Robb thought cutting off the heads of his (disloyal) Bannerman was the right thing to do... And it cost him his life and their mothers. Sansa isn't going to repeat those mistakes.

Besides all of that and the cute reunion they had last week, Sansa and Arya have ALWAYS been in conflict with each other. Truthfully, the new struggle between the two is far more congruent with their established relationship. Problem is, the show is moving at light speed and it feels odd to see them quarreling after their reunion.

I love the Littlefinger character. I love that he's a nobody. The embodiment of Machiavellian scheming. He's risen to great heights with more of his ladder still to climb. I'm not ready to see him go. He still needs to meet with Vary's one last time too... Well, he doesn't need to, but I want it to happen. Those two on screen are amazing. And I would point out, this show doesn't exist with LF. He pretty much created the war of 5 Kings himself and all the events that have followed.

edit: The only thing I hate about Littlefingers story atm, is Bran. Bran could easily undo everything LF is trying to achieve, but the show is purposefully ignoring that to create false drama. The stakes are meant to be high, but it's undermined because we know Bran is a massive Dues ex Machina. He shouldn't have come to Winterfell so soon, IMO.

Big question: Anyone else get the feeling either Jon or Dany will die? Who seems more likely? Why?
Also, I know people still keep bringing up Clegane Bowl, and while Sandor escorting a captured wight to King's Landing may set it up, how would he kill that which is already dead? Mountain is a zombie - remember that fanatic spiking him in the chest to no effect?

1. Mixed feelings. The whole Dany/Jon arc doesn't really fit the show or book narratives. ASOIAF isn't a rom-com. The tragic star crossed lovers were Rhaegar and Lyanna (Jon's parents). So finishing the show w/two new star crossed lovers (Dany and Jon) seems weird.

2. At the same time, While Jon fulfills the book saga title with his lineage(Ice and Fire), Dany has significantly more boxes checked off w/the Azor Ahai prophecy. In fact, she checks all of them, while Jon only checks 3-4/7 at the moment. And since Jon died once, I doubt he's going to die again. From a narrative POV, it makes little sense. It's possible the prophecy is (again) lost in translation, and Azor Ahai will be two people. So I could see them ending up together for that reason.

3. But... There's already a ton of incest going on. Including a "pregnancy" with Cersei and Jaime (again). While that likely ends badly (remember, the witch in season 5 told Cersei she would only have 3 children, so whatever is in her belly isn't long for this world IMO). I just don't know if it feels right to do ANOTHER massive storyline involving another incestual couple getting together... Unless Jon never finds out he's Rhaegar's son. He doesn't need to, despite the audiences interest in him knowing.

"Clark Kent wrote:

I disagree, It is needed and interesting! We've watched two little girls grow into powerful women, after overcoming various challenges, hardships, and set backs. We're rooting for both them. Not only them as people, but as two people who can bring justice to Westeros. Despite having every reason to join together, political self interest getting in the way of more noble intentions. Which is a running theme of the entire series. Although this feels more poignant given the characters of Sansa and Arya, as well as the circumstances of the whole Stark family in general.

When Arya started smack talking Sansa, I wish Sansa had pointed out (as she did to Jon), that Robb thought cutting off the heads of his (disloyal) Bannerman was the right thing to do... And it cost him his life and their mothers. Sansa isn't going to repeat those mistakes.

Besides all of that and the cute reunion they had last week, Sansa and Arya have ALWAYS been in conflict with each other. Truthfully, the new struggle between the two is far more congruent with their established relationship. Problem is, the show is moving at light speed and it feels odd to see them quarreling after their reunion.

I love the Littlefinger character. I love that he's a nobody. The embodiment of Machiavellian scheming. He's risen to great heights with more of his ladder still to climb. I'm not ready to see him go. He still needs to meet with Vary's one last time too... Well, he doesn't need to, but I want it to happen. Those two on screen are amazing. And I would point out, this show doesn't exist with LF. He pretty much created the war of 5 Kings himself and all the events that have followed.

edit: The only thing I hate about Littlefingers story atm, is Bran. Bran could easily undo everything LF is trying to achieve, but the show is purposefully ignoring that to create false drama. The stakes are meant to be high, but it's undermined because we know Bran is a massive Dues ex Machina. He shouldn't have come to Winterfell so soon, IMO.

1. Mixed feelings. The whole Dany/Jon arc doesn't really fit the show or book narratives. ASOIAF isn't a rom-com. The tragic star crossed lovers were Rhaegar and Lyanna (Jon's parents). So finishing the show w/two new star crossed lovers (Dany and Jon) seems weird.

2. At the same time, While Jon fulfills the book saga title with his lineage(Ice and Fire), Dany has significantly more boxes checked off w/the Azor Ahai prophecy. In fact, she checks all of them, while Jon only checks 3-4/7 at the moment. And since Jon died once, I doubt he's going to die again. From a narrative POV, it makes little sense. It's possible the prophecy is (again) lost in translation, and Azor Ahai will be two people. So I could see them ending up together for that reason.

3. But... There's already a ton of incest going on. Including a "pregnancy" with Cersei and Jaime (again). While that likely ends badly (remember, the witch in season 5 told Cersei she would only have 3 children, so whatever is in her belly isn't long for this world IMO). I just don't know if it feels right to do ANOTHER massive storyline involving another incestual couple getting together... Unless Jon never finds out he's Rhaegar's son. He doesn't need to, despite the audiences interest in him knowing.

Any Machiavelli cool factor of Littlefinger is overshadowed firstly by his insane creep factor (Hey kids, I wanted to fuck your mom, so I helped kill your dad, but now she's gone, so I want to fuck you and just lurk around!) and secondly by the fact he should be way out of his depth. Aria just murdered the entirety of house Frey ... but she doesn't bother to put on a disguise when going up a master of subterfuge and guile? Really? Meh. He served a purpose, but with things ending, so does he, and asap. Many things I would rather focus on than him with only 8 episodes left. Secondly, his scheming was based in the world of men, but this has become more a world of magic through shapeshifting, dragons, 3 eyed ravens, etc. Just get him off the board. Everyone knows he is shit, they just haven't got around to it.

As for the Arya/Sansa feud, I know they quarreled before, but neither are children anymore. They are both grown, both gone through awful things, Sansa especially. Would it kill Arya to either say "hey good job!" or just fuck off and kill some people rather than hanging around and sniping at the perfectly good and reasonable job her sister is doing running the place? The entire Stark lineage is full of people doing the "right" thing and getting whacked. Robb, Eddard, even Jon! Why a mature Arya reverts to annoying little girl mode is itself annoying.

"texanphinatic wrote:

***Not sure where the spoiler tag went, but spoilers for most recent episode below***

**SPOILS**
The message I believe was from early in the series - the one Cersei made Sansa write to Robb about bending the knee and Eddard being a traitor and such. It's being set up so that Arya/Sansa go after each other while Littlefinger benefits. It's one of the least interesting or needed things. This episode reflected very badly on the character of Arya. She went from ultra assassin to child spy, easily getting lead around by the nose and not bothering to hide herself. And why the **** is she going after Sansa for wanting to lead anyway? It's not like Jon has been doing a great job, while Sansa is actually well suited to it. **** you Arya! Just kill Littlefinger and have Robin pledge to Sansa while Royce leads the army. Boom, done.

Secondly, Cersei being pregnant ... ugh I guess we should be in no way surprised, but now either we are going to see a pregnant lady get whacked, or not see Cersei get just comeuppance. If the show (or books for that matter) let her off the hook, someone needs to get shanked. I am just tired of her constantly rolling natural 20s on the dice to always come out on top despite being such a horrible person with no clue what she is doing. Jaimie's look at the end though after the 3000th time she said "betrayal" - maybe **** is finally getting through?

Speaking of Jaime, how the **** did he and Bronn surface so far away from everyone, and how the **** did they not get immediately captured by Dothraki? Show magic, yeah!

And goddamit Sam, Gilly ****ing TOLD YOU ABOUT RHAEGAR and you shut her down. Raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! I guess he is the head of House Tarly now, so maybe he will go home (even though he doesn't yet know).

On the plus side, Drogon knows what's up. **** yeah Drogon. I think it would be poetic to have Rhaegal swoop in and be all MY HOMIE, LET"S RIDE! when Jon returns.

And I know some people are bagging on the Suicide Squad and how it all came together, but **** that noise, that **** is going to be the **** and I love it, even if Jon going north again was the dumbest possible thing a King could have done haha. I am down with Gendry resurfacing and hammering away, but awkward having another King claimant around. Maybe he just eventually restarts the old defunct Baratheon

Big question: Anyone else get the feeling either Jon or Dany will die? Who seems more likely? Why?
Also, I know people still keep bringing up Clegane Bowl, and while Sandor escorting a captured wight to King's Landing may set it up, how would he kill that which is already dead? Mountain is a zombie - remember that fanatic spiking him in the chest to no effect?

dragon glass!

These are just my guesses... not spoiler, although with the Gendry thing, maybe you don't want to read this yet.

And Jon could be "killed" again and saved again because of who he is with on this little trek beyond the wall. Jon told Melisandre not to bring him back, not any of those that he is with.

And is it just me or does Bran look like a WW at times? In his stature and emotionless face. Deus Ex Machina mmmhhhmmm

and the actor that plays Littlefinger... has anyone seen him in a different role / show / movie? does he sound the same? I know the accent is real (Irish) but the rest of it, the whisper...etc. Creepy one.

"Paul 13 wrote:

and the actor that plays Littlefinger... has anyone seen him in a different role / show / movie? does he sound the same? I know the accent is real (Irish) but the rest of it, the whisper...etc. Creepy one.

He's somewhat close to the same from what I can remember, but he's a bit exaggerated in GoT I think though, to match his character's scheming conniving secretive personality.

"texanphinatic wrote:

***Not sure where the spoiler tag went, but spoilers for most recent episode below***

**SPOILS**
The message I believe was from early in the series - the one Cersei made Sansa write to Robb about bending the knee and Eddard being a traitor and such. It's being set up so that Arya/Sansa go after each other while Littlefinger benefits. It's one of the least interesting or needed things. This episode reflected very badly on the character of Arya. She went from ultra assassin to child spy, easily getting lead around by the nose and not bothering to hide herself. And why the **** is she going after Sansa for wanting to lead anyway? It's not like Jon has been doing a great job, while Sansa is actually well suited to it. **** you Arya! Just kill Littlefinger and have Robin pledge to Sansa while Royce leads the army. Boom, done.

Secondly, Cersei being pregnant ... ugh I guess we should be in no way surprised, but now either we are going to see a pregnant lady get whacked, or not see Cersei get just comeuppance. If the show (or books for that matter) let her off the hook, someone needs to get shanked. I am just tired of her constantly rolling natural 20s on the dice to always come out on top despite being such a horrible person with no clue what she is doing. Jaimie's look at the end though after the 3000th time she said "betrayal" - maybe **** is finally getting through?

Speaking of Jaime, how the **** did he and Bronn surface so far away from everyone, and how the **** did they not get immediately captured by Dothraki? Show magic, yeah!

And goddamit Sam, Gilly ****ing TOLD YOU ABOUT RHAEGAR and you shut her down. Raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! I guess he is the head of House Tarly now, so maybe he will go home (even though he doesn't yet know).

On the plus side, Drogon knows what's up. **** yeah Drogon. I think it would be poetic to have Rhaegal swoop in and be all MY HOMIE, LET"S RIDE! when Jon returns.

And I know some people are bagging on the Suicide Squad and how it all came together, but **** that noise, that **** is going to be the **** and I love it, even if Jon going north again was the dumbest possible thing a King could have done haha. I am down with Gendry resurfacing and hammering away, but awkward having another King claimant around. Maybe he just eventually restarts the old defunct Baratheon

Big question: Anyone else get the feeling either Jon or Dany will die? Who seems more likely? Why?
Also, I know people still keep bringing up Clegane Bowl, and while Sandor escorting a captured wight to King's Landing may set it up, how would he kill that which is already dead? Mountain is a zombie - remember that fanatic spiking him in the chest to no effect?

To be fair to Sam, he has absolutely no inkling that what Gilly is reading has any bearing on the present situation. Even if he has heard her out, there was not likely any information regarding the Tower of Joy and even if there had been, there's nothing that would clue Sam into the fact that it's Jon.

And honestly, his true parentage is cool and all but really has very little to do with the story right now. Even if Jon knew, so what? He has no interest in being King and would rather be a Stark anyway.

Though I do hope that Sam and Gilly survive the series. Just seeing them in charge of a House would be hilarious

A theory posits that Sam is GRRM and he is writing the series as a history. Seems logical enough to me. And yeah I get that Sam didn't really have everything needed to piece it together, it was more intended I think as fan service, but it was as aggravating personally as interesting. :P
They are definitely setting up a Fire and Ice romance. Will it crash (perhaps even before fully taking off)? Possibly. Probably.

So are the dragons cold blooded? All I could think of was fire melts ice. Couldn't Dany simply send the trio over the wall?..... or did the flying ravens provide a glimpse of how Mr Blue Eyes can manipulate things in the sky?

the only way the dragons go to the north is if Dany goes there, and until they can get the armistice with Cersei she isn't leaving Dragonstone.

The Rhaegar reveal is big because now Jon has strongest claim to the Iron Throne. Dany's motivation is claiming her birthright as the last Targaryean, but now that's not the case and she doesn't know it. Westeros does not traditionally recognize female claims (except for Dorne), so now if she wants to be queen she'll need to marry Jon. Luckily for her it's Targ tradition to marry within the family. This is important the whole show starts because of birthrights. Jon Arryn died because he was investigating Robert's bastards in order to verify if Joffrey was the true heir. That lead to Ned Stark being named the Hand of the King, and GoT as we know it.

Littlefinger also plays Carcetti in The Wire.

"Deerless Dice wrote:

the only way the dragons go to the north is if Dany goes there, and until they can get the armistice with Cersei she isn't leaving Dragonstone.

The Rhaegar reveal is big because now Jon has strongest claim to the Iron Throne. Dany's motivation is claiming her birthright as the last Targaryean, but now that's not the case and she doesn't know it. Westeros does not traditionally recognize female claims (except for Dorne), so now if she wants to be queen she'll need to marry Jon. Luckily for her it's Targ tradition to marry within the family. This is important the whole show starts because of birthrights. Jon Arryn died because he was investigating Robert's bastards in order to verify if Joffrey was the true heir. That lead to Ned Stark being named the Hand of the King, and GoT as we know it.

Littlefinger also plays Carcetti in The Wire.

yah I started the wire last year but didn't finish, think I left off in S2 or S3.

"Deerless Dice wrote:

the only way the dragons go to the north is if Dany goes there, and until they can get the armistice with Cersei she isn't leaving Dragonstone.

The Rhaegar reveal is big because now Jon has strongest claim to the Iron Throne. Dany's motivation is claiming her birthright as the last Targaryean, but now that's not the case and she doesn't know it. Westeros does not traditionally recognize female claims (except for Dorne), so now if she wants to be queen she'll need to marry Jon. Luckily for her it's Targ tradition to marry within the family. This is important the whole show starts because of birthrights. Jon Arryn died because he was investigating Robert's bastards in order to verify if Joffrey was the true heir. That lead to Ned Stark being named the Hand of the King, and GoT as we know it.

Littlefinger also plays Carcetti in The Wire.

I expect that if Jon is in trouble she'll jump on her dragon and rush to save him regardless of what Cersie is doing.

"ToddPhin wrote:

So are the dragons cold blooded? All I could think of was fire melts ice. Couldn't Dany simply send the trio over the wall?..... or did the flying ravens provide a glimpse of how Mr Blue Eyes can manipulate things in the sky?

Have to be. They're giant crocodile-bats, basically.

HBO accidentally leaked episode 6. Rough year for HBO and GoT leaks. Only season 3 was worse, with the first 4 episode (screeners for review) leaked.

*** Stay away from Google, Youtube, and Social Media if you wish to remain unspoiled!! ***

I watched early because I didn't want to be spoiled accidentally. I would recommend finding it online and getting it out of the way, tbh. If you're planning to wait till Sunday, avoid social media, google, and youtube. A lot of "reviews" are already up since the leak comes from HBO's screw up and most sites believe that's fair game (unlike episode 4, which was hacked). And since this is the penultimate episode, there's a lot of juicy material to discuss, which is only going to make matters worse for those who want to remain unspoiled.

Just a friendly warning...

"Paul 13 wrote:

yah I started the wire last year but didn't finish, think I left off in S2 or S3.

I love the wire. Greatest TV show of all-time IMO. Did you get busy or were you bored? If the answer is bored, that means you likely left off in season 2, which isn't for everybody. I thought it was good, but a step down from season 1. Good news though, seasons 3 and 4 were two of the greatest seasons EVER. And I don't mean "ever" as in, exclusive to the Wire, but of any TV show in history.

"Clark Kent wrote:

Have to be. They're giant crocodile-bats, basically.

A counter argument:

https://worldbuilding.stackexchange.com/questions/404/are-dragons-cold-or-warm-blooded/405

Dragons as stated with the ability to fly when young and with the ability to produce flammable gas are leading a quite high-energy lifestyle, which would require a large energy input. As they are carnivores, this dictates a certain lifestyle.

Cold-blooded carnivores are ambush predators. They excel at sitting still for long periods waiting for something unwary to happen by that they can catch and eat. Since they don't generate their own body heat, their baseline metabolic requirements are quite low.

Warm blooded carnivores have a higher energy requirement simply due to the fact that they must maintain their body temperature, typically above the ambient air temperature. This means that they must be more proactive in finding food, to the point where they actively hunt for their prey.

For a creature that must expend large amounts of energy flying and generating flammable gas, it seems unlikely that a cold-blooded metabolism could provide the capability to obtain sufficient energy input for their lifestyle.

This means that dragons must be - to some degree - able to regulate their own body temperature independent of the environment so as to be able to hunt in weather conditions that would not favor a cold-blooded animal.

All animals, whether homoeothermic or poikilothermic, require more energy input per unit mass when small than when they are large, and the gradients are identical, i.e. by increasing mass a certain amount, the energy requirement per unit mass goes down proportionally, regardless of whether the creature is homoeothermic or poikilothermic.

In addition, marsupials have lower energy requirements per unit mass than placental mammals of the same mass, but not as little as a poikilothermic creature, so it is not beyond the bounds of possibility for dragons (or dinosaurs) to be homeotherms and still have a lower energy requirement than a placental mammal.

Other strategies employed by mammals to reduce energy expenditure are sleep (practiced by cats) and hibernation (practiced by bears and rodents). The ability to spend long periods sleeping or hibernation would fit well with some popular representations of dragons.

In conclusion, I would suggest that dragons are most likely to be lower-metabolism homeotherms (i.e. warm blooded) than placental mammals with a propensity to long periods of sleep and hibernation.

Ok, so Arya just sucks balls now.

And man, *********SPOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOILER!**********************

Poor dragon. You could guess it was going to happen, but still sucks. :(

This episode was a summation of everything wrong with GoT, season 7. Nonsensical plot, tropes, dues ex machina's, unnecessary scenes, poor character development, disguised with cool set pieces. I wrote a much longer review, but I got annoyed with my complaining. Even with all these flaws, it was oddly entertaining.

"Clark Kent wrote:

This episode was a summation of everything wrong with GoT, season 7. Nonsensical plot, tropes, dues ex machina's, unnecessary scenes, poor character development, disguised with cool set pieces. I wrote a much longer review, but I got annoyed with my complaining. Even with all these flaws, it was oddly entertaining.

when you don't allow your mind to get baited into analyzing everything and trying to identify all the flaws, it's entertaining every week.

Streaming on HBO GO was a crap show this week, since it was a longer episode everyone from the CST timezone logged in to watch around 10:00 pm and the last 15 minutes of the show took longer than the last 5 minutes of a split series game 7 NBA Finals game. Not looking forward to the same happening next week.

Travel banter was great, dragons were great, The Night King extinguishing fire as he walked through it was great. Jon Snow fighting wights til the very end was stupid, Arya and Sansa acting like kids were stupid.

"Clark Kent wrote:

This episode was a summation of everything wrong with GoT, season 7. Nonsensical plot, tropes, dues ex machina's, unnecessary scenes, poor character development, disguised with cool set pieces. I wrote a much longer review, but I got annoyed with my complaining. Even with all these flaws, it was oddly entertaining.

I still enjoyed the episode but it is frustrating that so many of the conflicts only exist because people don't talk to each other.

The Sansa/Arya stuff is so stupid. If they just sat down for an hour and discussed everything that's gone on the last few years there not only wouldn't be any conflict but they'd also immediately know that Littlefinger was behind it. Or you know Bran could take 2 seconds and explain everything.

And Jon is just stupid. This whole plan was dumb. Even now with the Wight, why do they assume this will move Cersei in any way? And why would you trust her?