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Forget Signing Free Agents!

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Captain lou, Dec 14, 2007.

  1. Captain lou

    Captain lou New Member

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    Atleast any high priced ones. They eat up too much cap room and usually give very little production in return. WE need to trade away as many players as we can, and build through the draft.

    A. they are cheaper
    B. They will work harder
    C. They will listen better
    D. They won't give up on our team
    E. We are not a couple free agents away from a playoff team

    We are going to be pretty bad next year too, but not 0-16 bad. Build through the draft and we will have a young team that will grow and become a great team for a long time.
     
  2. emocomputerjock

    emocomputerjock Senior Member

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    We are not a Asante Samuels away from going to the Super Bowl. Now that we've got our cap situation finally fixed from the Wanny days, the last thing we need to do is destroy it all over again by overpaying for the few stars available in FA. Better to spend that money on performance incentives.
     
  3. azfinfanmang

    azfinfanmang Premium Member Luxury Box

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    I do agree NO HIGH PRICED/ HIGH PROFILE FA's...however, we do have SOooooo many issues, that key-role type players would be good to address....Starting with probably WR, and perhaps CB....ohhhh and of course TE
     
  4. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I disagree in this respect, when you have a chance to sign a YYOUNG high proced free agent, and you have the cap space, you should do it.

    Asante Samuel (or someone else, Trufant, Haynesworth, whoever) are Pro Bowl caliber players who are young enough that when thsi team is competitive in 3 years, they will still be in their peak. Samuel is what, 24? Even if it takes us 3 years to build a team he's still be the best player on your D.

    And this only underscores how horrific a signing joey Porter was. Yet another black mark on the Cam/Mueller combo.
     
  5. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    You have to have some established players on your team. It can't be just from the draft. I do not mind overpaying for a top guard or tackle, or getting a veteran Wide Receiver [which we desperately need on this unit, Patrick Crayton would be awesome with Ted Ginn Jr in his second year].

    But as far as skill position players; I agree, you get those in the draft. But it's about time we start investing on offensive linemen to play along side or in between Satele and Carey.

    If you can get a veteran LT like Flozell Adams in free agency for a good contract, move Carey back to RT, and re-sign Hadnot, our offensive line would be very solid. We could only hope Mormino will be ready next season to take the LG spot; it would be a HUGE bonus if he is. An offensive line of Adams, Mormino, Satele, Hadnot and Carey can become one of the Top lines in the league by next season.

    Time to stop being cheap on our offensive line.
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2007
  6. azfinfanmang

    azfinfanmang Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Wait a minute. You want Trufant, Samuel or Haynesworth, but you are calling Ran/Cam out for Joey Porter...

    LOL does anybody see the total irony here?:lol:
     
  7. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Joey Porter is 30 bro. In 3 years when we're competitve JP will be at the end of his career. Haynesworth, Samuel and Trufant are in the 24-26 range.

    Do the math, in 3 years those players will still be in the primes and contributing to a potential playoff/SB run. JP won't.

    No iron involved, just reading comprehension.
     
  8. azfinfanmang

    azfinfanmang Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Oh, I understand the math..but you are using the wrong number for x in your equation ;-)

    The fact of the matter is the common denominator is that they are ALL overpriced names that wont contribute in the locker-room and will cost us what two nice role players would. That might fill one hole, but wont fill two.
    In the sieve we currently have, I will take 2 moderately talented players over 1 overpriced overhyped one any day...and twice on any sunday.:001_rolleyes:
     
  9. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Fair enough (and sorry to snipe at ya)

    How about this scenario, I believe adding a Samuel or Trufant does help us fix more than one position. With one of those guys in the fold Will allen becomes a very good No. 2 corner, with Lehan/Goodman becoming excellent nickel and dime guys. You improve the whole secondary tremendously by adding one player.

    Same thing with Haynesworth. If you sign him and we get some push from the middle and start stopping the run, all of a sudden your ends have more freedom to pass rush
     
  10. Reminisce

    Reminisce Banned

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    This past year, MIAMI built through DRAFT. PATS built through FREE AGENCY(moss, welker, stallworth, adalius). You do the math. 0-16 and 16-0.
     
  11. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Pats were building from a pretty good spot to begin with, though.
     
  12. Reminisce

    Reminisce Banned

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    We had the same chance to all their FA's as they did. Imagine us with stallworth, moss, welker.
     
  13. azfinfanmang

    azfinfanmang Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Its all good bro, and sorry to snipe back (Ever been on a snipe hunt LOL)

    I am not disagreeing with the scenario, but perhaps in our current situation, 1 high-priced player isnt going to fix it.
    Samuel is going to cost THE BANK (See what whats his name is doing in San Fransisco BTW) Trufant, perhaps if he isnt too expensive would be nice. I would rather have Asoumgah (sp) from Oakland than either BTW
    Haynesworth is a TURD (Spelled T U R D)...and he is absolutely going to cost the bank...

    Once again, I think we do need some FA's but several moderate (and yes I agree young, which is a very good point you brought up) ones than 1 high priced...
     
  14. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Right, but we don't have Brady, their o-line, etc.
     
  15. azfinfanmang

    azfinfanmang Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Actually, didnt both Moss and Welker cost them several draft picks :confused2:

    Stallworth hasnt completed a season in ohhh...about 5 years now.
    Moss here would've already quit and packed it in...then we wouldve been stuck with his contract and crap...
     
  16. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree that it's tough to break the bank for one guy, unless it is a special player. Is Samuel or Asoumgah that guy? Maybe.

    This year is unique in that some young and really talented guys will actually hit the market and I think it might be worthwhile to take adavantage of it. However, looking at lower priced/moderartely priced guys, I love Bryant Johnson from Arizona. Can definitely be a good no. 2 WR
     
  17. mullingan

    mullingan New Grandbaby Pic!!!

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    Haynesworth will not be leaving Tennessee. The Titans have made it very clear here ( I live just outside Nashville) that they are going to resign him.. They almost have no choice. Their Defense without him has been horrendous this year.
     
  18. azfinfanmang

    azfinfanmang Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Yes, I love this guy. He has been VERY impressive here while living in the shadows of Boldin and Fitzgerald.
     
  19. Mr772

    Mr772 New Member

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    Sometimes I few guys can make a huge difference. Look how much better the Titans D got when their big DT was able to come back and play. They looked like two different teams with and without him.

    And Moss is another example of how one player can sometimes make all the difference. The pats would be a totally different team without (and not even close to as good as they are with him) Moss. Granted not all big name free agents are going to be game changing players.
     
  20. arsenal

    arsenal Sunglasses and advil

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    uhhh thats 1 year... for the past 10 years the pats have built through the draft and we have tried to build through free agency... you do the math...

    lets look at the starters on their team that they drafted in the past 8 years alone:
    LT: Matt Light
    LG: Logan Mankins
    C: Dan Koppen
    RG: Steven Neal
    RT: Nick Kaczur
    QB: Tom Brady
    RB: Maroney
    CB: Asante Samuels, Ellis Hobbs
    DL: Ty Warren, Vince Wilfork, Richard Seymour
    S: Eugene Wilson, James Sanders

    they have built through the draft, they used this FA to pick up wide receivers, and a line backer, thats about it...

    you have to build a team through the draft and it takes some time
     
  21. lbmclean_sj

    lbmclean_sj New Member

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    if a guy wants to play for an 0-16 team, he is a mercenary just looking to get paid

    the NFL is full of cases where a guy played great in his contact year, got a big bonus and then did jack squat

    Haynesworth will be that guy if he isn't tagged
     
  22. azfinfanmang

    azfinfanmang Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Haynesworth wil be that turd if he DOES get tagged...
     
  23. Jets81

    Jets81 Junior Member

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    It's just that easy too. :up:
     
  24. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    Build through the draft sounds all nice and fun, but you need quality FAs to complement them. That doesnt always mean someone of the top level, but if you have a chance to get one of that caliber, why pass?

    We are on the road to 0-16 possibly. We have little talent. Why would you pass an opportunity to add a probowl talent? Really? If you have good cap space its okay to go out and get a premium player. You just dont want to be the Redskins who overpay for overhyped players year in and out and destroy yourself.
    But adding a player here and there isnt going to kill us, we NEED top players! You dont go from a team like this to a SB in 2-3 years "building through the draft" and ignoring FA. You need BOTH.
    FA gives you a chance to add an instant starter, a veteran presence, a leader, a PLAYMAKER! You just dont turn your back on that.
     
  25. Captain lou

    Captain lou New Member

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    I never said no free agents. I just don't want to designate too much money to one player where if could be spent on several needs.
     
  26. Captain lou

    Captain lou New Member

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    Go troll your own message board. I dont any desire to go to Jets message board and hang with a bunch Jets. Go away!
     
  27. phinfan0202

    phinfan0202 New Member

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    Think about the resurgence of the Cleveland Browns.

    Derek Anderson-FA pick up
    Jamal Lewis- Free Agent pick up
    Braylon Edwards- Top 3 pick
    Kellen Winslow- 6th Overall Pick
    Joe Jurivicuis- FA pick
    Joe Thomas- Top 3 pick
    Kevin Shaffer- FA pick up

    Willie Mcginnest- FA pick up
    Kameron Wimbley- 1st round pick
    Dquel Jackson- 2nd round pick
    Lee Bodden- 2nd round pick

    They have a good mix of both but the one thing that sticks out is that they hit on their early picks and they keep them. Then in the FA they get playmakers that complement what they have. They still have Quinn on the bench as well and to tell you the truth if he's as good as people think he can be than they got him for a steal when they did. Yeah they gave up a 1st rounder this year but they could have taken him at 3 this year and no one would have questiond the value.
     
  28. SMOKE

    SMOKE New Member

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    We're in a whole different situation then the Pats. Do you think we'd be anything near 16-0 if we held on the Welker and signed the guys New England did? They were already a very good team because they built through the draft. Adding the key guys that they did put them over the top. We have a bunch of upgrades needed. There's no need to shell out a ton of money when we're so far away. You also have to think that for top tier guys to sign with Miami, it will cost more than it would for other teams. Why would they want to play for a bad rebuilding team unless they break the bank?
     
  29. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    No question that if we hope to be even moderately competitive and not a walkover next year we NEED to nail our first and second rounders. Our laughable past drafting has landed us in this spot. I really think we have been the worst drafting team since 2000. If we cant turn that around, then yeah we are going nowhere.
    Cleveland has done a good job, would have loved to see a seasons worth of Ronnie vs Braylon, atm the clear top 2 players from the top of that draft.
     
  30. zach8111

    zach8111 New Member

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    you for got F. we have too many whole to fill to get them all through the draft. have to have some help in FA
     
  31. zach8111

    zach8111 New Member

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    ya but they already had a basic sructure to there team. we dont. we have to do the draft AND FA to fill our wholes.
     
  32. SMOKE

    SMOKE New Member

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    The point he was making is that we won't pay for any high priced free agents. Of course we'll have some signings but they'll probably be less familiar names.
     
  33. SMOKE

    SMOKE New Member

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    Thats basically what I said. I just don't expect any of our free agent pick-ups to be any of the top guys available.
     
  34. Canes_Fan_83

    Canes_Fan_83 New Member

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    Browns also grabbed FA G/T Eric Steinbach for big money, he's started 13/13 so far. I think it's important to pick the the RIGHT FA's, trade up for the right players, and keep the right guys, but that's a no-brainer.

    Also, you left out Brodney Poole and Andra Davis. Poole has started 30 something games in 3 years and Davis has lead the Browns in tackles multiple seasons.
     
  35. Two Tacos

    Two Tacos Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Only one of those was a free agent.
     
  36. Jets81

    Jets81 Junior Member

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    Listen to this man. He speaks the truth.
     
  37. Captain lou

    Captain lou New Member

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    Thank you. Finally someone who can read and comprehend written language!!!
     
  38. mmikel30

    mmikel30 New Member

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    no actually i don't porter is old those guys are younger you totally missed his point
     
  39. Jets81

    Jets81 Junior Member

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    The Pats built what some consider to be the most important parts of the team (O and D-lines) through the draft. When you have good lines the people you put behind them start to play better. The positions they've been adding are spots like LB and WR. Skill positions that are available pretty much every offseason through free agency.

    Think about it. If your D-line is getting a good push then QB's have less time to throw the ball. This can make an average DB look good because he's not in coverage for that long. A good O-line has the opposite effect, gives the QB a long time to throw and forces the other teams DB's into coverage for a longer period, allowing for coverage break downs to occur.

    Going out and spending a ton of money on high priced free agents isn't worth it because your team is not 2-3 players away. I feel the same way about the Jets. There lines are terrible right now. The only spot I'd be willing to let them break the bank is on the O or D-line at this point, but even there I'm wary because I hate the idea of throwing a ton of money at a vet that might not be at the top of his game by the time the team is ready to compete for a title. (if ever)
     
  40. finintheburgh

    finintheburgh New Member

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    whats the difference between throwing a ton at a guy like hayensworth or throwing just as much if not more at the top pick. if that pick is dorsey wouldnt you rather throw that money at a guy who at least has proven he can play at this level?

    until they get a reasonable set payout to rookies the first pick will be as much of a curse as it will be good thing. if you draft in the top 5 and you miss you kill your team for years. look at oakland , if russel flops then there screwed. hell eat up a ton of cap space for years.
     

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