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Dolphins Plans for QB

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Galant, Jan 25, 2019.

What Should the Dolphins do at QB?

  1. Ditch RT17 - Draft High this year - QB answer is?

    13 vote(s)
    19.1%
  2. Ditch RT17 - Aim for 2020 - QB answer is?

    21 vote(s)
    30.9%
  3. Ditch RT17 - Aim for 2021 - QB answer is?

    3 vote(s)
    4.4%
  4. Ditch RT17 - Draft first round QB every year until you find one.

    6 vote(s)
    8.8%
  5. Keep RT17 for 2019 - Aim for 2020 - QB answer is?

    9 vote(s)
    13.2%
  6. Keep RT17 for 2019 - Draft High this year - QB answer is?

    7 vote(s)
    10.3%
  7. Keep RT17 for 2019 - Aim for 2021- QB answer is?

    1 vote(s)
    1.5%
  8. Keep RT17 for 2019 - Draft first round QB until you find one?

    7 vote(s)
    10.3%
  9. Keep RT17 and give him another shot - Draft low 2019, high only if doesn't work out.

    1 vote(s)
    1.5%
  1. tirty8

    tirty8 Well-Known Member

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    I am rather unimpressed with this QB crop. The rumored plan is that we are gonna shore up both sides of the trenches. Honestly, this is one thing that has really impressed me about the new regime.

    That being said, I think the best QB coming out of the draft is Daniel Jones. I implore everyone on this board to seriously watch the film on him. Don't make assumptions based on where he went to school or even looking at his stats. Seriously. Watch the tape. I feel like every time I sat down, I watched him throw multiple deep balls that probably would have been TD passes that were simply dropped. I am 100% confident that NFL receivers would have made those catches with ease. I am telling you guys. His receivers were bad.

    This guy also has the frame as long as a nice, high release. His throwing motion feels like a NFL QB. I know Lock is pretty popular on this board, but his throwing motion kinda bothers me. It is elongated, and he sort of releases it lower than he should. In fairness to Lock, it has never affected his accuracy, but it kind of annoys me.
     
  2. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    Literally every pick is a gamble. The NFL has changed and continues to evolve. We will be seeing shorter QBs have greater success. If you are discounting a player of Murray's caliber based solely on his being short, you are making a terrible mistake. Got to take the risk for talent sometimes.
     
  3. tirty8

    tirty8 Well-Known Member

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    Do you think the inability to see over the offensive line could be insurmountable?

    I am not saying that he is that short, but we are certainly testing it with Murray.

    In my mind there comes a point in which you are too short to be QB. The only thing up for discussion is just how tall that happens to be.
     
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  4. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End

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    The thing is, the lineman he has played with/against in college are every bit as tall as they are in the NFL. And seriously, Tannehill is a tall guy and I've never seen a QB get as many passes batted down in my life as his. I think in this day and age height is not as big a deal as it was prior to guys like Brees, Wilson and even Flutie.
     
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  5. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    I think the best course of action would be to try to get a QB in the first this year without breaking the bank by trading up (Murray, if he falls to us or gets close enough to trade just a couple of picks to move up).

    If we can’t do that, then try to trade down for a 2020 pick and pick up a later round QB with potential upside. Have the rookie battle it out in camp with the QBs on our roster (Falk, Rudock, Fales etc) and give the job to the winner.

    Then do the same thing in 2020, 2021, etc. If we repeat this process enough times we’ll eventually have one of:
    1) a top 3 pick and the QB of our choosing
    2) draft ammo to trade up to pick the QB we want.
    3) a diamond in the rough who turns out to be the next Russel Wilson or Tom Brady.
     
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  6. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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    FYI - for those looking for draft prospect info, in the Draft forum there are a few threads dedicated to collecting information/profiles/tapes etc.
     
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  7. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    I'd like Miami to take the approach the Seahawks took to finding a QB. They tried just about everything until they found Wilson. Trades, free agency, etc. They kept spending resources on the position until they got it right. And they didn't wait a year or longer to see if an option panned out.

    That answer really isn't in the poll, but I guess maybe that's what you're getting at with draft a first round QB until you find one. I don't necessarily think they need to draft 1rst round until they find one, but definitely keep at it using any method that solves the problem until they find one. Due to the nature of the position and the scarcity, that's almost always going to be the draft. And it's usually in the first round where the successes are found, but the position is getting easier to play with the rules geared towards offense so I suspect we will see more later round success stories at the QB position going forward.

    I'm not familiar enough with Tannehill's cap hit and what it would cost to keep him in 2019 to have an opinion on whether or not to keep him around. Love or hate Tannehill, he's arguably the most talented QB Miami has had since Marino. Miami needs better than Tannehill to get to playoffs and beyond, but it will be hard to find a QB better than Tannehill. That's not based on any Tannehill homerism, rather the odds and scarcity of good QBS out there. I'd say the odds are far against Tannehill becoming better than he is right now.
     
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  8. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree I drink your milkshake! Club Member

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    Miami did. They ended up with crap. Seahawks are the only team that worked out for.
    Maybe Cowboys.
     
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  9. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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  10. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    Not like the Seahawks did. My memory is a little hazy on it, and I invite anyone to correct me if / where I'm wrong, but I seem to remember them spending picks, $$$, etc. on Charlie Whitehurst, Matt Flynn, and others along with drafting Russell Wilson all within a pretty short time-frame, a season and a half or so.

    My point being, they didn't get a guy, give him a season + to see if he panned out, cut bait, try again, repeat. They went out and got multiple guys quickly and tried them out until they found one that worked. The speed and number of QBs, multiple methods that they tried made it unique in my opinion. And I don't count guys that Miami may have picked up or drafted to be camp arms or backups to be comparable. Every guy the Seahawks grabbed during that timeframe they went after to be a possible starting QB.
     
  11. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree I drink your milkshake! Club Member

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    Miami did the signing people, trading for people, using 2nd and 3rd round draft picks for people.

    It already never worked. Seahawks are the exception only because Wilson was thought of as too short. If they were smart he would have been a first round pick.
     
  12. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    Yes, they've tried just about every method since Marino retired to get a new franchise QB. But not rapid fire like the Seahawks did until they got it right. Again, speed and amount of resources spent in a short amount of time made the Seahawks approach unique and it worked for them. Yes, you can argue they got lucky with Wilson.
     
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  13. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree I drink your milkshake! Club Member

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    The Seahawks got it right the third person. Of course they are going to look good.
    Seahawk method could be like buying bitcoins now.
     
  14. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    What's funny is that he is only like 3 to 5 inches or so shorter than Dan. Doesn't look like that much of an issue, especially given the way the game has changed. It's not like Dan is staring down at him.
     
  15. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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    *Looks down. Sees 5 inch platform shoes.*

    :D
     
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  16. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure what picture you're looking at but Marino makes it look like he's talking to a middle schooler.
     
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  17. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Yeah...Murray is tiny.
     
  18. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Just a Guy Staff Member Club Member

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    Its always easy to say that the Dolphins should copy Team X when the other team had success, but sometimes that's like looking at a guy who won the lottery and saying "I should do that too!". Its not a plan, its a prayer.

    The smart thing is to do it the traditional way, by doing all of the homework, and then drafting one of the perceived best QBs in the draft. That doesn't guarantee success either, because any number of factors can lead to that QB failing too, but its still the best course of action.
     
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  19. tirty8

    tirty8 Well-Known Member

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    First and foremost, I completely agree with you on Tannehill and the amount of balls that he got batted down. I do not have any stats nor have I ever seen any, but it sure did feel like it happened to him at a higher clip than most other QBs. For the life of me, I can't figure out why either. RT has a nice, high release. I don't know if he was just unlucky or if it was because our line was so bad that defenders were closer to him than most QBs when the released the ball.

    I also agree that the linemen at Oklahoma are at least comparable to NFL standards. Why I think it worked was that he played almost exclusively from the shotgun. Although I am sure it happened, I can't remember him take a snap from under center. Realistically, when evaluating, we need to be at least open to the very real possibility that he cannot play from under center. There should almost be a consensus on this board that a three step drop with a pass to a receiver running a slant would be a dicey proposition at best.

    I spent awhile watching the tape on Murray, and I came to the conclusion that there are football minds that would be smart enough to succeed with him AND build the right type of player personnel around him, but I also think that it is a low amount of teams that are creative enough to do just that.

    I think that there are certain formations/playcalls that simply just need to be removed from the playbook. I also think that there may have to be a significant shift in traditional play calling in certain situations. How many times have you seen Tom Brady connect on a pass that leaves his team with a 4th and 6 inches, and the whole team runs to the line, and he falls forward for a yard. I think that is a situational play call 100% of the league should have in their playbook. In all honesty, I don't think that is something that Murray is capable of doing. A team with Murray at the helm might have to run some sort of RPO, wildcat, or trot in the backup for these types of situations. I think there are plenty of other situations like this that will take some creativity.

    Chad O'Shea has never been an offensive coordinator. Honestly, no one really knows how creative and his ability to understand his players' limitations. Drafting Murray could be setting both of them up for disaster. Before people start clamoring that they believe in O'Shea, I just want you guys to think about the last time O'Shea worked with an offense not led by Tom Brady. In 2008, his QB was Gus Frerotte. That feel like an eternity ago. He has been riding the Tom Brady train for a long, long time. There will be an adjustment period for him.

    I want the Dolphins to set themselves up organizationally to be successful.
     
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  20. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I’m in on Murray unless he’s wavering back and forth on what sport he’s going to commit to.
     
  21. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    According to Armando Salguero of the Miami Herald, the Dolphins have already decided to part ways with Ryan Tannehill, it’s just a matter of how.

    They’d probably like to trade him for whatever bag of beans they could get, but his $18.7 million salary for 2019 and $19.5 million in 2020 is something exactly zero teams want. That means they’re like to just show him the door and move on from the 2012 first-rounder.

    Tannehill is also said to be expecting this, which I guess shows pocket awareness.

    Salguero suggests they aren’t likely to be in the market for a big-name quarterback such as Nick Foles or even Teddy Bridgewater, which sets up something resembling tanking, even if no one wants to say it out loud.

    The Dolphins have always been willing to swing for the fences in free agency, but if they don’t fill their roster holes that way, the losing figures to be organic. The only other quarterbacks on the roster at the moment are Jake Rudock and Luke Falk, though they could always draft one.

    Either way, Tannehill will be gone.
     
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  22. Deus ex dolphin

    Deus ex dolphin Well-Known Member

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    When do they need to cut Tanny? Is he due some bonus money if he is on the roster? Miami can keep him around and prevent a team from bringing him in to learn the offense and the other players ASAP. I'd think some team would be willing to part with a third rounder to know for sure that they have him at QB instead of having to wait and fight for him in free agency.

    Unless Tanny is just that bad and the rest of the league knew that years before Miami figured it out?

    Saving a big chunk of cap space and getting an extra pick is EXACTLY what this team needs to do to speed up the rebuild process.
     
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  23. Surfs Up 99

    Surfs Up 99 Well-Known Member

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    Here's a little chart I did with the important dates for the next few months to give us something to look forward to.

    2019 NFL Important dates.PNG
     
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  24. Fame

    Fame Well-Known Member

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    Luke Falk looks like Tom Brady.

    Yeah, I said it. While contemplating the Tannehill cut (which is the right move) I found myself watching some Luke Falk game film for the first time. He reminds me so much of Tom Brady in the way he plays and in the way he moves in the pocket. He might not be special like Brady, but damn if he doesn't look like the guy back there.
     
  25. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    7 years of incompetence will do that to a man.
     
  26. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Just a Guy Staff Member Club Member

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    Dude, seriously?

    The six years with Tannehill were so much better than anything at all we had from 2000-2011, and you keep using that phrase. Its like you've forgotten how it was back then.
     
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  27. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End

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    I do honestly agree. My only argument in my post was that I do not believe height is a reason not to draft him. Anymore most college Qb's dont get much, if any, work under center. It seems it is getting more difficult to find guys that are really ready to run an NFL offense.

    Good Post!
     
  28. Desides

    Desides Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Tannehill's overall tenure was average. He had peaks of above average that were destroyed when he had his knee injury. He's still the best QB we've had since Marino retired.
     
  29. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Just a Guy Staff Member Club Member

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    I think that you can pretty easily argue that other than Marino, he's the best QB that Miami has had since 1977. Griese seemed to really drop off the last few years of his career.
     
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  30. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Lol, yes, seriously..:)
     
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  31. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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  32. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Just a Guy Staff Member Club Member

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    Ugh....
     
  33. RevRick

    RevRick Long Haired Leaping Gnome Club Member

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    yawl - is a boat
    y'all - is a shibboleth
     
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  34. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    I personally like Jake Rudock more, lol. Seems like he has some good pocket awareness and can run when needed. I'm actually going to be pretty excited for the QB1 training camp battle, first time in a long time we've had one.
     
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  35. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    I don’t know. Tannehill May have been a better passer but I really think Jay Fiedler was a better QUARTERBACK than Tannehill.
     
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  36. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I don't know....I love Jay Fiedler, when my grandfather was in the hospital passing of lung cancer he was kind enough dude to sign a football personally for us to him. Tough guy I ALWAYS have had respect for.

    At the same time though I feel like Jay had a pretty strong line, decent backs and receivers even most of his tenure along with a tough defense to work with.

    If we are going to say someone was better...Pennington maybe?
     
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  37. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    I always like Fiedler. Thought he was a damned fine quarterback but for the reasons you raise above, that’s why we were in general a fine football team. You can’t just have a GREAT quarterback and everything will just magically fall into place.

    I truly hope Flores will finally build the offensive line we’ve been lacking so whom ever we do choose as our next QB of the future will be set up for success
     
  38. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Just a Guy Staff Member Club Member

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    Well, part of that discussion has to be the fact that Fiedler consistently had better help around him than Tannehill ever did. The Fins running game was always good while he was a starter, the OL was solid, and he generally had a solid cast of WRs and TEs. And yet despite that, he would often go off script when he didn't need to, forgoing the chance to pick up first downs or get into FG range, and either turn the ball over or force the team to punt. For most of his time as the Dolphins QB, he was the problem. He was what was holding the team back. The support was there., and he also had good offensive coordinators in Gailey and Turner.

    Tannehill had his problems and wasn't perfect. He wasn't ever going to be an All Pro. But that same support just was not there for him, and his coaching was almost always poor. We've had this discussion before, but if you could somehow teleport a 25 year old RT onto the early 2000s Dolphins, I think that he would have done fantastic - much, much better with the same players than Fiedler did.

    And on the flip side, if you took Fiedler from those years and plunked him down on the 2013-2016 Dolphins, he would have just imploded and failed miserably.
     
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  39. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree I drink your milkshake! Club Member

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    IMO, Fiedler held the team back and tannehill would have been much better with that team. Not even close.
    Jay had guts but he also had no arm.
     
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  40. Surfs Up 99

    Surfs Up 99 Well-Known Member

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    You guys are bringing back memories of Oronde Gadsden and Feebler's deep jump ball. Ah...the good ole days...;-)
     

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