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Does Ryan Tannehill Throw The Ball Away Enough?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Bpk, Oct 6, 2013.

  1. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Honest question. I rarely see him purposely throw the ball away (like out of bounds) when something is just 'not there' on a play.

    Could that be contributing at all to the sacks he is eating?

    I think the Oline, and RBs and TE protection is, by far and away, the main culprit. But I find it interesting that I never noticed Ryan throwing it away. It would have been the smart thing to do a few times today, like on the sack that moved us further to the edge of Sturgis' FG range.

    Thoughts?
     
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  2. Larry Little

    Larry Little Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    If he had enough time to get outside the tackles, I'm sure he would throw the ball away.
     
  3. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    Can't really throw the ball away while that crumbling earthquake some call a "pocket" is imploding on him in under 2.5 seconds, time and time again.

    Him looking to throw the ball away in that situation takes time because he needs to find a place with a receiver and then make sure he puts it on the ground and not in the defenders hands. He doesn't have time to make plays, let alone do this.
     
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  4. unifiedtheory

    unifiedtheory Sub Pending Luxury Box

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    You can't throw it away when you can't even finish your set up to throw because someone is hitting you.

    It's the offensive line. Tannehill is just fine. In fact, I'm happier with him now that I thought I'd be this year. I think he's been really good.
     
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  5. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    Agree. The pocket gets crushed almost instantly. Best thing he did today was cover up, get down, and not get injured. Suggs and Dumervill are premier rushers. You can't expect Martin and Clabo to hold up for long, but Jerry is atrocious and even Cogs had a couple gaffs today.
     
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  6. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

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    He can hardly step up into the pocket w/out being knocked around.
     
  7. maynard

    maynard Who, whom?

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    Only thing I will add here is that I think Tanny may start needing to play nearly every pass play like that 4th down near the end of the game. The regular setup just isn't working. It's time we start playing some sandlot football
     
  8. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Time for him to ignore the coaches, basically. lol.
     
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  9. Jagfish

    Jagfish Season Ticket Holder

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    The guys are just getting physically whipped too. Cogs got mixed up on his sack, but Clabo and Martin got dismantled.
     
  10. sports24/7

    sports24/7 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He definitely does. The line is beyond awful and most of it lies on them, but there are times when he has enough time to throw it away.
     
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  11. unifiedtheory

    unifiedtheory Sub Pending Luxury Box

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    It's up to Sherman to start calling designed roll outs. Why we don't do it more is beyond me. Tannehill is really good when he's moving and our offensive line sucks balls. Seems like an obvious recipe.
     
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  12. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    IMO the blame goes to the QB. The protection needs to get better, absolutely. But take a look at the big play to Gibson on the final drive, Tannehill has the athleticism to do that a lot more. For some reason he tends to stand in the pocket like a statue. I'd love to see him break the pocket and look to make plays down field, scramble for yards or at least throw the ball away. The last two drives were both killed by sacks, it's unacceptable.

    And of course the run game was a no show yet again. Part of pass protection is pounding the ball so opposing defenses can't tee off on the QB. Draws, screens, roll outs, I hope Sherm uses the bye week to change things up bc it been different versions of the same story all year long. No run game, shoddy protection, I'm sick of it.
     
  13. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    I think CK noted his throwaways are in line with the league average but slightly lower, probably due to the rapid nature of the pressure our line gives up.

    I also believe most people would call him scared if he did it more often. Afraid of tight windows and other **** like that.

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  14. maynard

    maynard Who, whom?

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    lol. Not really. For, example, the Steelers offense was planned chaos for few years when Ben got really poor blocking. everyone was on the same page after the clock went off in their head, it became a scramble drill. Ryan isn't Ben or Tony Romo, but the o-line isn't getting better and I think that calls for a bit of sandlot ball.
     
  15. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    Ben is not a scrambler. He's a statue who can take a hit. Not sure what you're recalling.

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  16. firedan

    firedan Well-Known Member

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    At time he does hold the ball to long but he didn't have the luxury to hold it very long today.
     
  17. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    that wasn't on Cogs. That was on miller. Dude dbls up on cogs guy and lets suggs(?) stunt. Miller should have slid and picked him up and Cogs would have kept his guy.

    Miller did us no favors in this one.
     
  18. maynard

    maynard Who, whom?

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    He most certainly moves outside the pocket
     
  19. Jagfish

    Jagfish Season Ticket Holder

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    That's what I was trying to say. The stunt caused confusion and it wasn't that he just got pushed around. Clabo, Martin and Jerry all got manhandled at one point or another.
     
  20. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

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    RTH needs to start extending plays with his feet. He also lacks the 6th sense that other QB's have when the pocket is collapsing and negate some of the bad plays.

    Having said that, this OL is atrocious. We rushed for 15 yards today. That makes us a one dimensional team and against teams like Baltimore, they will be in the pocket all day. On top of that, 3-4 of those sacks, he had less than 2 seconds to even get set in the pocket.
     
  21. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    I don't think he does, he tries to extend plays...

    My question is, does Tannehill have small hands? His pump fakes look awkward, like he's afraid to pump and tuck the ball down kind of like Ben does, but I assume Ben can actually hold onto the ball since he does it so well.
     
  22. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    No doubt RT needs to significantly improve his pocket presence. He needs more games.

    But, that doesn't change the reality that the OL sucks (esp. at the OT and RG positions).
     
  23. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    I agree on the roll outs... Sherman needs to move Tannehill around more (like last season) and look for more screens or shovel passes to try to stop defenses from just pinning their ears back and charging every down.

    Instead, we have played right into the teeth of the defenses this season.
     
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  24. fins4o8

    fins4o8 Mac FTW! Club Member

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    How do we know if it isn't the coaches that are telling Tammy to stay in the pocket more instead of bolting or not?

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  25. rdhstlr23

    rdhstlr23 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I mean it's just so hard. It's the Ben Roethlisberger theory. Tannehill's willingness to hold the ball longer allows a play to develop and allows downfield throws a little more. I think the offensive line needs to be better. I also think the personnel packages and play calls can improve.
     
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  26. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The bizarre thing was that Ryan Tannehill last year was so good at knowing when to throw the ball away to avoid the sack.

    It also wasn't consistent, but he also displayed light-years better ability to get out of the pocket and avoid pressure.
     
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  27. Jaj

    Jaj Registered

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    It almost looks like he's told to stay in there. It's like telling Elway, Steve Young, and quarterbacks of that type to play as Dan Marino making miraculous side-steps to avoid pressure. That just isn't him. He has 4.6 speed that should tell what he should be doing. I'm not saying run like an idiot, just move him then mix it up.
     
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  28. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    I think he IS being coached to hang in there.

    Philbin said in a press conference that he'd prefer he hang in there and get through is progressions faster than to get in the habit of bailing the pocket. So it's a long trm QB development approach... except when your Oline is THIS bad and the QB has an unreasonably short amount of time to operate you are setting him up to fail. That ruins QB confidence, and could ruin Tannehill.
     
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  29. Fame

    Fame Well-Known Member

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    Ryan Tannehill has atrocious pocket awareness. Granted the protection is equally as bad but Tannehill just folds like a lawn chair as soon as anyone gets within 5 ft of him. There were so many occasions today where slidimd a foot or two away from the pressure would have bought him an extra 2 or 3 seconds but instead he just collapses.

    Not to mention how many times he could have tucked it and run when they dropped back and rushed 4. There were so many huge holes for him to exploit on the ground but he refuses.
     
  30. Jaj

    Jaj Registered

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    The first play I really saw him roll out he hit a 40+ yard big play. That's ridiculous. He was drafted to move around the pocket. He is not Aaron Rodgers. The point of having him was to hit the defense with a guy that can move around, drop back, and throw the ball downfield. Compliment that with a top defense and that was the blueprint. Let him develop as he goes.
     
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  31. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    I think this is because he was used to knowing that Jake Long was his LT.


    How can he develop his pocket awareness when there is no pocket?
     
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  32. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=- Club Member

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    It really looks more like a bear trap. Or a folding ladder.

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  33. Alex13

    Alex13 Welcome to the NEW Miami Club Member

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    does BpK starts to many threads after games....that would be my poll...all these strange questions after every game....just chill out some
     
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  34. IdrA

    IdrA Rebuilding for Eternity.

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    He gets sacked enough (1st in the NFL) -- and yes I know our OL stinks. But he was a WR he needs to know when to get the hell out of the way and buy time. This dude is supposed to be athletic...
     
  35. Marino1384

    Marino1384 Member

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    I really don't want to hear anything about tannehill. That 4th down roll out really shows that we have something special. There's very few qbs that can make that throw. Yea it sucks we couldn't get anymore yards but that's not Tannehills fault. What happens on 3rd down? A drop by clay. Play calling was horrible too on that last drive.54 seconds and we spike it on 1st? Should of been a fake spike thrown deep to Wallace or an out route to the sideline no reason to waste time. Also why a pass on 3rd if we are gonna kick a fg? Should of been a dump off or a draw atleast put Sturgis in a makeable kick. Really don't get the fg attempt, it does two things... Ruins Sturgis confidence knowing he missed the game tying fg and shows we have no confidence in tannehill. 57 yarder what's the chances a kicker makes that? Maybe 10-15%? As for the original question it's kind of like a pick your poison. Sure tannehill can attempt to throw it away but most of the time there's a guy right in his face it within arms length. So if he's throwing away then I'd bet he'd have a good 2-3 more picks due to lineman hitting his arm and ducks coming out much like flaccos pick 6 today and end of the game vs the falcons (both times by the Kracken's prodigy,dion Jordan) sacks may kill the drive but as long as he holds onto it, ill take a sack over a int trying to throw the ball with the dline on top of you. All comes back to the oline. Normal olines should create an upper case U or horseshoe shape.... Ours looks like a Cherrio for about 1.5 seconds then a very obese man steps on it
     
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  36. Springveldt

    Springveldt Season Ticket Holder

    It's like he's the meat in a tackle sandwich on about 50% of his drop backs.
     
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  37. Springveldt

    Springveldt Season Ticket Holder

    Does anyone else get the impression that a bag of rocks is more intelligent than Miller? He's been in this offense for nearly a year and a half and he still has Tannehill telling him were to line up.

    On the play that Dumerville knocked down the quick WR screen, Miller was lined up to the right of Tannehill than proceeded to block someone away on the left. This left Dumerville totally unblocked. Granted Tannehill shouldn't have thrown it (I think Dumerville was already in the air by the time Tannehill released the ball) but I'm not going to to knock him for wanting to get rid of that thing as fast as possible.
     
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  38. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=- Club Member

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    Chalk it up to MDCPS

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  39. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Actually, I think the bigger issue is Tannehill's pocket awareness.

    He seems locked in on receivers and has trouble multi-tasking back there. That's not an easy thing to do and there really are only 10 or 15 people in the world who can do that well at the NFL level. But, let's face it, that's what is required to be a winning QB.

    He simply needs to be able to get to a point where he can sense the rush and know when to scramble and Where to avoid the rush.

    This is an area where Luck and Wilson (to some degree RG III was last year but he's struggled this year) are well ahead of Tannehill.

    Tannehill still appears to me to be a player who looks for his primary open receiver; then, if time, he will look to the 2nd receiver or possibly 3rd. If time runs out, he's getting sacked.

    What he needs to be able to do is two things simultaneously: 1) learn better to scan the field and read the whole defense as he's going back to pass (I think he's looking at the WR/TE to see if they come open) and figure out quickly where he's going (this is a more holistic view rather than processing check downs one at a time). Whether he'll ever develop a mind to be able to do this is a question-mark at this point. Simultaneously, 2) he has to be able to sense the rush and avoid it instinctively either by shifting in the pocket better or scrambling out of the pocket.

    There's two kinds of QBs that are great at this. There's the Marino / Brady / P.Manning types (Marino was the greatest of all-time at this move) - who are able to deftly "shift" in the pocket and give themselves an extra second. RT is Not very good at this.

    The second kind gets out of the pocket as soon as the rush starts to cave in. Steve Young and Montana were both great at this; Luck is one of these.
     
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  40. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    This is all fine and good, however all of this is happening too quickly for you to reasonably expect him to do it consistently. It is not like he is standing back there 4-5 seconds holding onto the ball reading his targets and then wham he gets sacked. No, he basically has enough time to drop back, read his first option and by then the pressure is already on his face.

    As it is right now, if his first read isn't open immediately, he more than likely is getting sacked. It is that simple.

    For you to say a QB has a legitimate problem in the pocket, the o-line has to consistently allow him to make his progressive reads within a reasonable time, identify that no one is open, and then decide to scramble. As it stands, the o-line is only affording him one or two reads at most before he is getting pressured. This is not good enough.

    Then, we must question the offensive game plan that does not recognize this situation and game plan towards finding ways to buy the extra time for the 2nd and 3rd reads to be made. They have the QB stand there in the middle, often under short drop backs, when it has already been proven beyond a doubt that this o-line is not capable of allowing this to be executed efficiently.
     
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