Does Flores Quit?

Good question. Considering Flore's childhood and how he worked his way up the ranks in NE, I don't think he is the type of guy who quits.

I don't think that's a good question at all.

Do you guys think Flores is actually working for the Russians? I mean, I haven't seen or heard anything to suggest that, but I wasjust wondering.

/sarcasm

"resnor wrote:

I don't think that's a good question at all.

Do you guys think Flores is actually working for the Russians? I mean, I haven't seen or heard anything to suggest that, but I wasjust wondering.

/sarcasm

I hope that's obviously not the case. I did say it was speculation, but perhaps I should have more emphatically specified that I'm not say I think this is the case - I'm just pondering the possibility. Why? I'm not anti-Ross but we have had over a decade of issues in terms of leadership, from coaching to management etc. That has come from somewhere, namely Ross (despite good intentions I'm sure). Due to that, I don't think it's unreasonable to wonder whether the process of bringing Flores to the Dolphins was done the right way, or if, in fact, communication at the beginning and/or throughout this process has been 100%. If it hasn't, if Flores is taken by surprise with at least some of this - which he wouldn't admit - then that's the sort of thing that can end a business relationship quickly.

Head coaching opportunities are rare in the NFL, and he may not get another opportunity if he quits. The only way I see him walking out is if Grier is really incompetent and his relationship with Ross turns really sour.

I'm just surprised we haven't started fielding offers for Christian Wilkins....I mean....we drafted him in April! My God! Get rid of him now!
No....I don't think Flores quits. But we need to acquire talented players for him to stay.

I don’t know about Flores, but I was taken by surprise. I am in favor of taking a different approach; however, I didn’t think it would be this drastic. I get that we are gathering resources for a big push for a QB, I just didn’t think we would churn the roster like we have. That may be a combination of getting players that fit our scheme ( round hole, round peg), and a, just do your job, mentality. All of which I fully support.

"Galant wrote:

I hope that's obviously not the case. I did say it was speculation, but perhaps I should have more emphatically specified that I'm not say I think this is the case - I'm just pondering the possibility. Why? I'm not anti-Ross but we have had over a decade of issues in terms of leadership, from coaching to management etc. That has come from somewhere, namely Ross (despite good intentions I'm sure). Due to that, I don't think it's unreasonable to wonder whether the process of bringing Flores to the Dolphins was done the right way, or if, in fact, communication at the beginning and/or throughout this process has been 100%. If it hasn't, if Flores is taken by surprise with at least some of this - which he wouldn't admit - then that's the sort of thing that can end a business relationship quickly.

I just was being sarcastic...but at the same time, would you say that question directly to Flores? I wouldn't. That's like questioning his manhood. Where I'm from there's a good chance a question like that without any reason behind it could get you punched in the mouth.

Would I just walk up and ask him? No. If I were a close personal friend I'd probably ask how things are going. Either way, my question was aimed at the forum members/thinking out loud here.

It looked like a few of the trades did catch him by surprise- for instance, why would he publicly support Stills and go into details of his own life if he knew that he was going to be traded a few days later? Those moves don't jibe and it's not Flores pulling the strings here.

About your question though- no, he can't quit....it would be career suicide. But if he stays and only wins a few games over the next few years, that's also career suicide. So unless Grier's plan works by 2021, Flores is likely out of the NFL entirely by 2022 despite any efforts he may make. He's the fall guy, the scapegoat, and there's literally nothing he can do but prepare his guys to play football.

As I said six months ago, I don't think Ross has any intention of firing Gase until Grier got in his ear. One thing you can't say about our 2018 team is that they were quitters- we probably should have only won 2-3 games but everyone over-achieved by fighting back in games and staying positive. I don't see how that happens this season under the circumstances and I have a sneaking suspicion that the recent releases were those who questioned trading Tunsil.

To me, it feels like the team is already falling apart before we play even the 1st game...but that's not on Flores at all since he's being gutted from the inside out. We just need to hope this ridiculous tank job plan works or it's going to cost us a decade of meaningful football. I mean, cutting John Denny? Everyone loved him and he clearly won his camp battle; the excuse that "We saw some young guys so now seemed like a good time to move on" is complete horse-shit. They cut Denny for being a leader and speaking up...exactly as a leader is supposed to do.

Trust me folks- join me in rooting for the Browns this year. I picked them completely at random since they're supposed to be an up and coming squad, and honestly all of us will need a distraction. I have a sickening feeling that by week 3 or 4 our season will be over and everyone will have given up, and there's just no turning back from what Grier has done unless we can magically make 5 starting linemen appear.

As everyone seems to agree.. why would Flores quit when being a NFL coach is a privilege? I think NFL coaches (like most humans) quit when they: 1) lose way more than THEY expected despite trying to win, or 2) they are the center of controversy, often because they aren't winning as much as the ownership expected (though the controversy could theoretically come from non-football issues).

The one good thing about the Dolphins organization this time around seems to be that Grier and Flores are working in tandem. You get the HC and GM to push opposing views of how a team should be built and that's just inviting disaster no matter how good either is. So I'm guessing Flores was an integral part of the planning for all this. Ross wanted to "build a team the right way" and he wouldn't have hired Flores if Flores didn't agree with the basic outlines of what we're seeing now, even though the specifics might have been hard to predict.

So I think Flores quits only if we're still a losing team in year 3 or possibly year 4 because by that time the rumors, potential player revolt, etc... will become too great. But what we're seeing now is just all part of the plan so I'm not too concerned about that part. My only concern is whether these guys know how to draft well with all their picks. Mess that part up and that's like getting the tactics wrong with the right strategy. Doesn't work either when competing teams get both right.

"Not So Fast wrote:

Head coaching opportunities are rare in the NFL, and he may not get another opportunity if he quits. The only way I see him walking out is if Grier is really incompetent and his relationship with Ross turns really sour.

Exactly. Head coaches almost never quit, unless they're retiring. Its virtually a guarantee that he would not.

However, he very well could be fired. We'll see how things are going in the third year.

Dumbest post of the century!

Considering that the circumstances around Gase's departure last year seemed to hint that there was disagreement between Gase and Ross and maybe TB/Grier, it's not far fetched to wonder whether history might repeat itself. We can't see what has been said nor what is being said behind closed doors. If Ross and Grier sold Flores on something different than what they put into action then it's entirely possible that Flores will ask to get out.

This is putting the cart before the horse.

"Galant wrote:

I think it's been made pretty clear Ross is on-board with this and isn't likely to fire Flores for a losing team at least for the next 2-3 years, but, is there any chance Flores quits because the level of overhaul is far worse than he may have been told?

This is pure speculation - I've not read or heard a single thing along this line. However, I believe he's sincere as a coach and as a man when he says he's going to try to win, and that he despises tanking. He may understand the need, Ross says he told him the plan was to build it from the ground up, but is there any chance that some of these moves start to give him pause for thought?

Why would you voluntarily give up a guaranteed contact?

"Disgustipate wrote:

Why would you voluntarily give up a guaranteed contact?

Because he reaches the point where he's being asked to do a job but not being permitted to do it? Or where the direction he wants to head isn't the direction Grier and/or Ross want to go. Or some other scenario where he reaches the point that he cannot in good conscience continue to do the job being put before him.

Again, I'm not saying this is likely - I've no idea. I'm simply trying to consider one not impossible scenario for what's going on and will go on.

Ross has had a history of bad leadership decisions, so it's not implausible he might be doing more of the same.

"Galant wrote:

Because he reaches the point where he's being asked to do a job but not being permitted to do it? Or where the direction he wants to head isn't the direction Grier and/or Ross want to go. Or some other scenario where he reaches the point that he cannot in good conscience continue to do the job being put before him.

Again, I'm not saying this is likely - I've no idea. I'm simply trying to consider one not impossible scenario for what's going on and will go on.

Ross has had a history of bad leadership decisions, so it's not implausible he might be doing more of the same.

This is a question for two years down the road.
While Tunsil was a surprise it wasn't anything that was beyond when he signed up for

Let's check back on this in two years, though the end of year three will tell us if this razing of the roster and rebuild has a solid foundation. If the drafting is below average with all those picks, it will be obvious at that point.

"Galant wrote:

Because he reaches the point where he's being asked to do a job but not being permitted to do it? Or where the direction he wants to head isn't the direction Grier and/or Ross want to go. Or some other scenario where he reaches the point that he cannot in good conscience continue to do the job being put before him.

Again, I'm not saying this is likely - I've no idea. I'm simply trying to consider one not impossible scenario for what's going on and will go on.

Ross has had a history of bad leadership decisions, so it's not implausible he might be doing more of the same.

I don't think there was any illusions about what was going on here between the potential coaches and the front office. Ross is an idiot, but they know for sure.

In all likelihood Flores knew the plan going in. There was no reason that his contract should have been 1 year longer than the standard contract length other than he was told going in that this was the plan.

I think Flores is probably 100% on board with everything they're doing, TBH. It's probably the very reason we have HC Brian Flores and not someone else.

Flores wasn't exactly the most qualified HC candidate if you recall. Most of us here had him as our 4th or 5th choice looking at it from the outside. But that's because we were thinking schematically and looking at experience.

...but it seems Chris Grier had plans of which we weren't aware. This massive overhaul must've been something he was planning. I think we're now seeing just why Grier favored Flores.

Flores is young. He's flexible. He has many years to go. Flores brought multiple years of personnel experience. He understood the nature of building a roster and of making tough decisions. He wasn't just brought in because we liked his connection to Belichick's defense.

I think the most likely explanation is that Flores agreed to go along with the kind of stuff we're seeing. I have to believe he's on board 100%. I don't see Grier making moves without his consent.

Grier and Flores are both relatively young guys. They're being given their shot. There's no reason for them to be conservative. Grier knows that half-measures haven't worked. And Flores comes from an organization that understands the need for vision and commitment.

"Galant wrote:

Considering that the circumstances around Gase's departure last year seemed to hint that there was disagreement between Gase and Ross and maybe TB/Grier, it's not far fetched to wonder whether history might repeat itself. We can't see what has been said nor what is being said behind closed doors. If Ross and Grier sold Flores on something different than what they put into action then it's entirely possible that Flores will ask to get out.

Dude, that's the thing. You can question anything. Doesn't mean it's valid. We're on the precipice of an absolutely terrible season, and people are going to be ridiculous...and the season hasn't started, and with no proof of any sort, we're now discussing whether or not Flores will quit. It's unnecessary and completely speculative.

I can only imagine the topics in the months.

"Galant wrote:

If Ross and Grier sold Flores on something different...

I mean, is there any evidence whatsoever that what you're describing is what's going on?

"resnor wrote:

I can only imagine the topics in the months.

I know, right?

I'm looking around and thinking, 'am I the only person who freakin' loves this!?'