Chad Henne & the Miami Dolphins

#6, play action fakes on 3rdand12, yeah lets sell that hard. next game when its 3rd and long annd Henning calls play action watch the linebackers and corners, and not Henne, tell me what you see. They are not falling for the fake because Henne isn't selling it, they aren't falling for it because it 3rd and 8. Now watch when it's 3rd and short. watch the lindbacker freeze....i mean really this has to be explained?

 

What credibility?

 

It is quite obvious that there are many Henne supporters on this forum. These individuals obviously see a lot more upside in Henne than those of us who think Henne will never be anything but a mediocre QB in the NFL. As a Dolphins fan for the last 40 plus years and a season ticket holder for over thirty years. I would love nothing better than for Henne to turn it around and become the franchise QB this team has been looking for since Marino's retirement. Many on here blame the coaching. I think it is quite obvious that if Sparano is the head coach next year and Ireland is still the GM. They will do everything they can to bring in a QB to replace Henne. Sparano, Henning, and even Parcells have all basically agreed that Henne is not the answer. Parcells admitted to this just before he left the team for good. Sparano and Henning made it quite clear when they benched Henne earlier in the year and went to Pennington as the starting QB. So basically the only chance Henne has to remain the starting QB after this season is for Sparano and Ireland to be fired. Any new coach coming in just might be willing to give Henne a chance to compete for the starting job next year. This doesn't mean Henne would be the starter. It only means another coach MIGHT give him another opportunity. The problem with Henne is that he has not progressed at the same rate many of the younger QB's drafted in the last few years have. In fact he seems to be getting worst and not better. Personally, I really don't think Henne will ever be the quality QB we need on this team. While I admit this. I pray I am wrong and that Henne will make a fool out of all of us who have given up on him. I would love to eat all the negative words I have written concerning Henne's quarterbacking skill.

 

I can't say I'm encouraged with Henne's development at all.

But most of your observations could have easily been applied to Phil Simms, Troy Aikman, Drew Brees, Brett Favre, Warren Moon and Dan Fouts - All of which threw more picks than TDs in their 1st 30 starts.

Just saying.

 

You don't have to have Henne posters above your bed to understand & accept everything that you just stated.... and all of what you said is reason enough to believe that this kid could show something with an improved offense, new OC, and a system that's suited for his cannon arm rather than Penny's pea shooter.

How Henne is being used here is equivalent to a Randy Johnson being asked to throw change-ups all game long...... with an occasional fast ball mixed in. You're only taking him away from his strength and making him an average player. Not to mention---- how accurate will he be with his fastball when he's throwing change-ups all game?

Henne's arm becomes an asset when he has speedy vertical threats or big, down-field receivers (whom have large catching radii) whom he can quickly rifle the ball out to (Michigan showed us that much). Pinpoint accuracy isn't needed for this; arm strength is, and Henne's arm is accurate enough to get the job done if used in this manner; however the offense is currently set up for a Chad Pennington type, which Henne is not.

Chad's accuracy only goes under the microscope when you're asking him to be deadly precise to guys like Bess or Hartline whom both lack size & speed and rather rely on great route running & precision passing instead. Penny doesn't have a gun, so he HAS to rely on guys like Bess & Hartline who can get open on short-intermediate routes to where he can place the ball with great accuracy before DBs can make a play on it. This is NOT Henne's game. I don't know why this is so hard to understand..... or why it's so hard to understand that a QB can actually perform less to potential in the wrong system.

 

You do realize that Randy Johnson was an average pitcher until Nolan Ryan and Tom House worked with him on commanding his off speed.

 

I'd like to go through this piece by piece really, because I agree with very little of it.

Why does the coaching staff need to think outside the box to make Chad Henne better? I mean if you've really got to think that critically on how to improve someone that drastically, then where is all this natural talent he's got? I mean no one has yet to answer that question for me. Everyone talks the world of this guy's talent, yet they get all over the coaches when they don't do all this work to make this guy better or put him in the perfect position to be good--not great--just good. I think having a buzzer to make sure that he gets the ball out in time is pretty damned outside the box by the way. And I don't want to hear that as a reason why he's struggling. I say that because he still takes WAY too many sacks from holding onto the ball. He never throws the ball away. He has a problem reading defenses, not feeling pressured to get rid of the ball. That guy has stood in the pocket for several seconds, which is an eternity in the NFL, at times and still has found a way to screw it up.

Why have you lost faith in the coaching staff and not Chad Henne? Chad Henne is the one that has never accomplished anything. The coaching staff here has. And please don't give me the fact they had a cupcake schedule as an excuse, because Chad Henne has lost to the Buffalo Bills, Cleveland Browns and other teams. He is abysmal down the stretch to boot the past two years. After seeing Henne this year, I find it miraculous that the coaching staff was able to take the liability that he is at QB, now last year was his first year starting I'll give him that, have all the injuries that they did, have the turmoil they did, the difficult schedule they did, and yet they found a way to go 7-9. Why would I want to lose a staff like that?

Dan Henning has a horrible feel for the game this year. I think a lot of it is due to him trying to find a way to make things work with the ineffectiveness we have at QB and other areas on offense--mainly not being able to run the football. I'm not opposed to trying another OC out. However, I don't want that because we need to see how Chad Henne does in another system. We do it because we want new altogether, IMO. Tony Sparano has absolutely no control over the crap timeouts Chad Henne takes whether it due to him or Henning's poor use of personnel groupings at certain times.

Here is a question I pose to the forum, which again, I've yet to get a response. Do you really think Dan Henning continues to call PA passes because Henne doesn't like it? I mean seriously? They asked Tyler Thigpen what plays he is most comfortable with running and what he's best fitted for. You don't think they've done that with Chad Henne at all? You don't think they know what he likes, is comfortable with, etc. Maybe, just maybe, they are trying to help the guy, which so many claim they don't, by calling those plays because he's comfortable running those plays. Again, there is no proof to that. That is just my thought there.

Also, I can't imagine they drafted Chad Henne not believing the offense didn't cater to his strengths. These guys aren't that stupid, so why do we make it as such?

I'll tell you why people love Chad Henne because of his arm. Yay! He can throw the ball far. He can throw the ball on the line. I could care less.

There is not a single issue caused by Dan Henning, Tony Sparano, lack of speed/deep threat, etc. etc. that can excuse the opportunities that Chad Henne has missed. Take everything out and he has missed big plays in every single game, especially lately. What is a speed guy going to do for us? He hasn't hit a big play yet with the guys we got. We have a guy that can go up and get the ball. Henne has YET to be able to put the ball up and give him a chance to make a play on that ball--since the NY Jet game in Week 3. I mean he offers the WR NO CHANCE at coming down with it because it's nowhere even close. We've had those opportunities. Henne hasn't capitalized on them.

We run an intermediate passing game, that Chad Henne struggles with. Chad Pennington was masterful at it. Why? Accuracy, awareness of the coverage, and anticipation. Chad Henne has none of it. Chad Henne is excellent pre-snap, but he's yet to figure it out once the ball is snapped. He can't anticipate a hole in the zone, a WR making a play, etc. He just doesn't do it. He can't do it, because he isn't that good. Watching the game live, allows you to realize how many opportunities the guy misses, it really does.

We've got players good enough to be an average offense. I really believe that. We need a lot of help in the interior OL and at RB. We need a HR threat either in the form of a RB/TE/WR for sure.

I don't think we should cut Chad Henne outright either. However, if we go into the season believing Chad Henne is the starter or should compete for the job, I think we're in trouble. Changing of the HC makes no sense to me. I'm all for changing the OC too, but not to keep the QB and run a system just for him.

 

This is just so completely wrong it isn't even funny.

Just some questions here for you...

Why has Chad Henne not capitalized on the opportunities he's had this year to make big plays?
Why has he not given the receiver in question an opportunity to make a play on those balls? (all over-throws by vast margins by the way, except for the HORRIBLE under-throw to Hartline against Cleveland)
Why was Chad Pennington able to complete more balls deep with his pea arm than Chad Henne with his cannon arm?
Why was Chad Pennington able to control the intermediate part of the passing game with his pea shooter than Chad Henne with his cannon arm?
Why was Chad Pennington able to maneuver the sidelines better with his pea shooter than Chad Henne with his cannon arm?

You know Randy Johnson was a bust before he learned how to throw a slider and a changeup? The same way Chad Henne is a bust until he realizes how to read and manipulate a defense. As well as, being able to anticipate throws and be accurate. And throw out those completion percentages all you want, but he's terrible in the intermediate and especially on throws down the field--when he recognizes them.

By the way what offense relies on nothing by deep throws? Tell me? You act like we need to just run go routes, and deep comebacks. That'd be the most predictable offense there is. Not to mention, we run more go routes than most, but we don't complete them--either by poor throws or not recognized an opportunity when it's there. When is the last time we've seen him get the ball to Marshall down the field and let him make a play? How about a throw that actually allowed him that opportunity? Trust me, I'm there watching the games--THERE ARE PLENTY OF OPPORTUNITIES. The defense and safeties manipulate Chad Henne so ridiculously well.

 

I was one of those big supporters of henn but realize he is not what I thought,he has the weapons and did his time on the bench not sure were we went wrong .i say we move on fans

 

I could care less if Henne is the starter for the Dolphins next year or not. I just want them to win.

But anyone who thinks Henning’s play calling hasn’t cost this team wins is fooling themselves.

The Wildcat call in the 4th quarter on 2nd and 10 in the Bills game was a drive killer. No ifs, ands or buts.

 

honestly I do not think the majority on either side is, "Henning is the entire problem, Henne is not at all" or "Henne is the entire problem, Henning is flawless."

 

Quit trying to use semantics to twist an argument. Grow up dude. You know exactly what I meant. Eh, forget it, I'll play along with your nonsense. So what you're telling me by your response is that- if Randy's fastball topped out at 87 MPH (in his prime) that he wouldn't have affected his career a bit? I guess his bread and butter stuff was all offspeed, and his fastball took a back seat huh?

I think even Randy himself would argue that...... as well as guys like John Kruk, but feel free to try and plead a case if you like. This should be interesting.

 

While I definitely twisted the argument, I did so only to try to use your own analogy to try to prove a point I didn't realize that just because you thought the analogy worked I should leave it alone. My apologies

I honestly would not argue baseball against me if I were you you're not going to win that one. While the idea that Randy Johnson was ever a bust is definitely incorrect, it is common knowledge that he was under performing at the beginning of his career because hitters could ignore his other pitches and just sit on his fastball. It doesn't matter how hard you can throw it, the second time you go through a line up you need to be able to show them another pitch. Also Randy Johnson's command of his fastball was above average during the best part of his career, that went along with probably the best slider of his era. It is his other pitches that kept him from becoming a closer.

Never questioned Henne's arm strength, but is this what we were talking about? No you said:

The point that I was making was even someone with the plus plus fastball of Randy Johnson was merely average until he focused on his off speed. To translate this to Henne I think that even with a change in play calling he's going to have to improve his accuracy on short and intermediate throws for him to be a great QB.

 

And again, your talk is right back to semantics. Randy's fastball set up his ENTIRE career. He had his success b/c of his arm strength. His slider was deadly because he could throw it as hard as Greg Maddux could throw a fastball. If Johnson had an 87 MPH arm, he'd be average at best.... if that. He was a thrower. He was NOT a Greg Maddux.

So if you'd like to keep diverting my point, then be my guest..... but my accurate point still remains that Randy's success came from his power, not his accuracy. Randy wasn't asked to ditch his power pitching in order to become a Greg Maddux type pitcher. He was never told to abandon his fastball. That is my analogy that you continue to ignore for some reason.

Henne is a power thrower just like Randy was a power pitcher. Chad's NOT a Penny type thrower just as Randy was NOT a Maddux type pitcher. The point is that we're not allowing Henne to use the full ability of his arm; rather we've forced him to become another Penny. Having the personnel, OC, and playcalling that allow Henne to throw down field is equivalent to Randy being able to utilize his fastball all game to set up his slider & change-up b/c his FASTBALL set up his slider, not the other way around. If he didn't throw 100 MPH, hitters could sit on his slider. If you asked Randy to throw change-ups & sliders ALL game with just a few fastballs mixed in, I can guarantee you that his fastball wouldn't be as accurate, just as Henne's big arm isn't as accurate when he opens it up b/c he has to dink and dunk all game long. If you're still not understanding this, let me know, and I can restate it 10 other ways till you get it. Thanks.

 

Merry Christmas Todd. Did you get a new OC under your tree? :-)

 

It probably just taught him the meaning of drinking and the physics of keg stands.

 

All your saying is that chad henne has a power arm which I agree with. What I'm saying is that in order for him to be successful with his power arm he needs to develop his other "pitches".

 

While I don't disagree with what your saying, you also need a play caller that runs an offense to his strengths, and we don't have that.

When Sparano made the move to Penny, one of the things he said was the offense is more suited for Penny. Well, a good coach adopts a style to the players he has, you can't stick a square peg in a round hole.

Henning is a dinosaur who won't change.

Henne has struggled, but the OC has not helped at all either.

 

Same thing my college education taught me, haha.

It just irks me that everytime I give a long, thought out post about Chad Henne any person that backs Henne does nothing to respond to it. Then all you see is this talent, and this strong arm, and this completion percentage, lack of OC, lack of talent BS. Yet, no one looks at the plays THIS year he has failed to make that completely go against that line of thinking.

 

Nice!!

Merry Xmas to you to buddy!! santa left me some coal in my stocking.... AKA Dan Henning.

Did you get one?

 

He has developed his other pitches to the tune of 61% which is good enough for a power arm..... what he needs now is to be allowed to throw his fast ball more often.

 

You and I both know that it's not strike percentage it's the quality of the pitch, and at this point he's not consistently throwing quality passes. Trust me I'm with you on fastball idea but he's got to set his guys up better to make plays for him.

 

Exactly..... but you don't set guys up with the weakest part of your game; you set them up with your strength. Miami is doing it backwards. We're trying to develop Henne's weak points (dink and dunk passing ala Penny) rather than using Chad to his strengths- strong arm and ability to throw downfield (despite what many members think). We're using a change-up to set up his fastball rather than doing the opposite.

Chad's not the kind of guy who will throw quality passes in the same way Penny will.... but that's ok. He makes up for slightly less accuracy by having a cannon arm who can squeeze the ball into tight spaces all over the field.

How do you make this "accuracy issue" less noticeable? You get him big WRs with large catch radii who can get vertical and outposition defenders for the ball..... or you get him some true speed. This offense isn't remotely close to taking advantage of a strong armed QB; it's the exact opposite really. We're on the right track with Marshall, but he's not a vertical guy. That's one reason I'd like to entertain the idea of Marshall in the slot so that Henne has a big target right in front. A pass that Bess has to jump or dive for could probably be caught in stride by Brandon. Just sayin-- accuracy becomes less of a deal, and you still get the ball to the receiver quicker than Penny can IMO. I would guess he'd be enough of a distraction to LBs and Safeties to help open up the ground game even better, no?

A few questions:
1. If you have a guy like Vincent Jackson, what matters more: accuracy like Penny, or a strong semi-accurate arm like Henne's?

2. If you have a guy like Davone Bess, whose arm do you want throwing to him: Penny's..... or Henne's?

3. If you have a big arm at QB, who do you want at TE catching more passes: Tony Scheffler.... or Anthony Fasano?

4. If you have a 4.52 #1 WR with little top end speed, what type of WR do you want playing opposite him with a big armed QB: a thin 4.5 possession guy..... or a 4.3 speedster of at least equal ability who can track a ball well?

Answering at least 3 of the following 4 (1. Henne 2. Penny 3. Scheffler 4. speed guy) means that our personnel is matched to Penny's needs, and as such doesn't allow Henne to play to his potential.

 

I agree he needs to continue to develop his other pitches. There's no denying that; however this regime is ONLY trying to do that, which is going completely away from his strengths. We've tried to make him into Penny 2.0, but he's Henne 1.0. If all you do is try to develop your "other pitches" while ignoring the development of your strengths, then you'll end up an average pitcher (QB) at best as I'm sure you know. It doesn't shock me at all that he's a 78 QB rating based on the system we put him in, how we've decided to develop him, and the personnel around him who are better suited for a Pennington type QB.

 

I agree with every point you made, the one exception I take is with Bess I just don't think you're giving him enough credit I think that he just needs someone to get him the ball quickly to be his best regardless of arm strength, but that is just my opinion and really doesn't have anything to do with Henne.

off topic: Did you play with Jeff Baker at all at Clemson? I work out with him in the winter every once in awhile.

 

Sorry, i didn't mean any of the post to come across negatively regarding Bess. It's hard to not give credit to the guy. The first reference to Bess was just to show that we "could" improve Henne's accuracy by giving him a larger target (if accuracy needed to be addressed and we wanted to maximize Henne's performance). I was more speaking hypothetically about one of the ways to get the most out of Chad. The 2nd reference wasn't against Davone. I agree with you that he definitely needs to get the ball quickly. I like Bess a lot actually, but part of me is torn b/c he's a 6-15 yard at a time guy. I love that on 3rd down, but it doesn't completely thrill me on 1st and 2nd when it comes to chunk yardage ability (or even run blocking). Do you like anything as a compromise to where we can still pick up more chunk yardage on 1st and 2nd while still having Bess as our 3rd down machine?

No, I was much earlier than Baker.

 

I'm absolutely sold on getting a faster guy, but I'm not sure that he even has to be as dynamic as a Vincent Jackson to completely change how good our Wide Reciever corps is. Can you imagine even a guy close to your heart like Jacoby Ford across from Marshall? I know he's undersized, but man is he a game changer and he would push safties back giving Marshall and Bess room to work. Any idea if he has a clone in the draft this year? (Anyone reading this please save any Ginn comments he had no balls). This would also give us the ability to put Marshall in the slot on 1st and 2nd down and save Bess for 3rd down, if that is the route you want to go. I just really don't think you need two pro bowl level talents at reciever to be a great passing game. But I do agree that Marshall would be a monster at slot.

Off topic: Funny story I was actually drilled with a beer bottle at Clemson my freshman year, as I did my flush run in the parking lot past Left Field. The atmosphere there is nuts.

 

Yeah, Clemson isn't always the most inviting environment for watching baseball (or football for that matter). Rednecks, booze, and frat boys make for some rowdy fans.

Completely agree on not needing 2 probowlers to make it work. I was only using V Jackson as a reference for the type of guy that Henne needs IMO (big, physical, can get vertical, and make plays on the ball). Sorry it came across wrong.

Don't get me teary eyed over Ford. I had a love affair with us getting playmakers last draft (I think I beat a dead horse wanting Dez, Gronkowski, and Ford (or Mike Williams) as our 1st 3 picks- Imagine that lineup with Brandon). I truly thought Ford would become like a Steve Smith type impact guy. How often do you find a kid who runs a 4.2, is tough as nails, has good hands, and will give you 110% all game long?

The closest to Jacoby IMO is Jerrel Jernigan. He's not quite as fast; I think he'll run a 4.3ish (although he says he was clocked at 4.28 at his junior pro day last year). Anything he loses in speed compared to Jacoby, he makes up for in elusiveness. He's the same size as Ford, is as equally tough, built like a running back, is a stud in the return game, and is a high effort kid, too. I'm not sure about his vertical skills though.

From what I know, this draft is lacking a bit in the speed department. I don't think there's a Mike Wallace hiding anywhere...... but it does have plenty of big, physical WRs who could make for a VERY nice #2. I think Greg Little will be a 3rd or 4th round steal (reminds me a lot of Brandon Marshall and could become every bit as good). Jon Baldwin is a major late 1st/2nd round stud who "seems" like a possible slacker, but IMO will play hard for a team/organization who respects and treats him well. If you can trade back in the 1st and pick up Baldwin AND a top back (Ryan Williams/Kendall Hunter) or TE (DJ Williams), then that's a serious victory to me. IMO Leonard Hankerson's best football will be in the NFL. He's still got the baby face and all, so once he fully becomes a man, he could become a 230 pound beast.

IMO our best bet is going after Mike Sims-Walker (who runs a 4.35) with Jacoby Jones as the 2nd best option. Walker isn't quite #1 material in Jax, but I think he could be a heck of a #2 here when facing easier coverage. I don't think this necessarily means we'd have to pass on a top WR in the draft either. The worst case scenario if we grab Walker or Jones is: if we're staring at a top WR who represents too much value (lets say Mark Ingram is off the board but Julio Jones is there), then you can still take Jones and move Brandon to the slot like we hypothesized about. I wouldn't plan out for that to happen, but I certainly wouldn't complain having Julio-Marshall-Walker as my starting 3 with Bess as a 3rd down specialist and Hartline as a solid utility guy.

Anyone who hasnt actually seen Walker play should watch his 09 highlight reel.
[video=youtube;OsOj6Jh6sN0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsOj6Jh6sN0[/video]