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Caserio, viewed around league as ‘organizer’ not ‘decision maker’ meets again w/Miami

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by jim1, Jan 25, 2014.

  1. mroz

    mroz Fix the OL Club Member

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    who cares who we hire… Dolphins fans are not going to be happy.
     
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  2. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Name one guy that has left the Patriots in their front office or coaching staff that has set them back after losing them?

    As long as Brady is healthy and Belichick is around, they have been competitive, division winners, and in the playoffs. So those beat writers are right to feel confident that things will be fine.
     
  3. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Does anyone else wanna answer this dumb response or should I take it? Tom Brady. Bill Belichick. Remove those 2 names and the Patriots are a shell of their former self. The fact you're actually responding condescendingly to my post makes me wonder if you have any clue about the draft whatsoever.

    11 of New England's 17 second & third rounders from 2008-2011 are either flat out busts, out of the league, or significant underachievers.... and that's not including Ryan Mallett who is to be determined and Steven Ridley who could be viewed as an underachiever [it's too early to assess the past 2 drafts], and they have only 1 starter drafted in the 5th round or later during that stretch and only 1 other player in the 5th or later who contributes on offense or defense [Marcus Cannon].
     
  4. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I don't really buy this at all.
     
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  5. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Ridley is anything but an underachiever.
     
  6. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    He was drafted in the 3rd round to be their primary rushing back, yet they turned to Blount in FA this year b/c they had trust issues with Ridley IIRC, and he was supplanted as a starter for much of the year by Blount. It's certainly not outside the realm of argument that this could be viewed as underachieving based on draft expectations, or at least close to it.
     
  7. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Feel free to counter argue.

    I see Disgustipate thanked your post, which would be ironic considering, if my memory serves me correctly, he's argued that Miami's roster is stronger than New England's when Brady is removed from the equation.

    Regardless, New England's drafting prowess since 2008 certainly hasn't been at the level the rest of the NFL aspires for, so I'm not sure why the need for semantics. Even if New England's drafts have been better [which they arguably haven't], it would be negligible at best, so please don't respond as if there's a Mariana Trench sized gap between their drafts and ours.
     
  8. Pandarilla

    Pandarilla Purist Emeritus

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    Stick around...
     
  9. mroz

    mroz Fix the OL Club Member

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    Ridley's problem is that he puts the ball on the ground…
     
  10. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Here's some good feedback on Caserio from the Herald:

    Falcons GM Thomas Dimitroff, who previously worked with Caserio in New England, told Breer: "Nick's gotten where he's gotten for good reasons, because he's incredibly driven and intelligent. It's a huge asset to Nick that he can move from personnel to coaching and coaching personnel, and even perform those tasks in the same day.

    “To be able to handle that multitasking and understand what someone as talented as Bill Belichick wants, it's huge. When you work for Bill, you better come to the table with your I's dotted and your T's crossed. Nick is able to do that, and Bill has great respect for that."

    When I mentioned his name to an NFL official Friday, the first response was "very sharp guy."

    Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/spor...gain-um-recruiting-marlins.html#storylink=cpy
     
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  11. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He had a fumbling problem, not an achievement problem. Fix that, and Ridley is still their best RB and very tops in the league. He is not underachieving based on draft expectations, as he's a 3rd rounder and has shown the ability to run in this league. Fumbling can be fixed. They also drafted Vereen that year.
     
  12. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    That's like saying Mark Sanchez had an INT problem, not an achievement one. Ridley was drafted with the expectations of being their primary ball carrier, not to have much of his role given to LeGarrette Blount. If fumbling issues are keeping him on the sideline, then he's clearly not achieving what's expected of him, no ifs ands or buts about it. And he was an early 3rd rounder, not a 7th........ and 773 yards and a demotion from the starting job is anything but among very tops in the league. Vereen was drafted to be the change of pace back who gets more involved in the passing game than the running.
     
  13. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    Highly doubt they drafted him to be their primary ball carrier when they drafted Vereen the round before.

    If anything their plan was to go committee from the beginning.
     
  14. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Ridley is a piece of the puzzle. You cant say anyone was drafted for a specific reason...because Belichick doesnt use just one mold.

    Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk
     
  15. LBsFinest

    LBsFinest Banned

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    Ridley had 1260 and 12 TDs last year, if he's an underachiever Daniel Thomas doesn't even belong on a roster.
     
  16. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    it was to give Ridley more of the carries and Vereen more of the touches in the passing game, that's why when you go back to New England's first two preseason games of 2011 [just after Ridley & Vereen were drafted] it was Ridley who led the team in carries by a wide margin.
     
  17. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    What have you done for me lately. He was clearly an underachiever this year.
     
  18. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    lol, the same people that are *****ing about New England's drafts are the same people *****ing that Cesario has no experience drafting.
     
  19. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    So he's a bust because he had a down year after he's had a year of production far above his draft slot?
     
  20. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    It was kind of cool to see Jamie Collins do good. I had him in my mock. Sucks it was for the Pats, but he was a good pick. It's not that I really disagree with phinsational, but that was a pick which I liked.
     
  21. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    So it's a coincidence Vereen gets most of the touches in the passing game between the two backs and Ridley gets more of carries in the ground game?
     
  22. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    When did I call him a bust? Please refresh my memory.
     
  23. LBsFinest

    LBsFinest Banned

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    Honestly if he didn't consistently get benched and thrown in the doghouse for fumbling he woulda had another solid year, Belicheck is really one of the few coaches that punishes his tailbacks to that level for putting it on the ground.
     
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  24. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Sorry Todd, underachiever not bust.
     
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  25. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Pats failed 2nd/3rd round picks 2008-11 [few of these were the result of trading back 1st round picks IIRC, which makes it even worse]
    33rd overall pick, Ras-I Dowling- bust
    34th overall pick Pat Chung- demoted and no longer with New England
    40th pick Ron Brace- bust
    41st pic Darius Butler- cut after year 2
    2nd round Germaine Cunningham- bust
    2nd round Terrence Wheatley- bust
    3rd round Taylor Price- bust
    3rd round Brandon Tate- cut after year 2
    3rd round Tyrone McKenzie- bust
    3rd round Shawn Crable- bust
    3rd round Kevin O'Connell- bust

    That ineptitude would've gotten lambasted in Miami considering how badly our fans rip the 3rd round pick of John Jerry even though he's at least been a starter.
     
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  26. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    Thats not irony. but yeah I agree with you...........
     
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  27. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    but he did turn it over 4 times, most in the NFL among backs, and he did so in fewer rushing attempts, and he was rightfully demoted for it. That tied him with Reggie Bush who had 50 more carries than Ridley, and Bush was benched too for it I might add. To me that's the definition of underachieving. Not sure how it can be viewed otherwise. If you're not seeing the field or carrying the ball as often as your coach expects from you b/c of something you're doing wrong, you're underachieving.
     
  28. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    shaddup.... and thank you. lol
     
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  29. DPlus47

    DPlus47 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I, too, have my questions about the Patriots' recent drafts, but here's where Caserio's position works both for and against him: he didn't have the final say. IMO, the Pats sometimes try to get "too cute" with their drafting (e.g. trading back, overdrafting certain people), and I don't think that's necessarily a scouting issue. Shula was an amazing coach who was a crappy GM. Maybe Belichick is following in Don's footsteps a little bit?
     
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  30. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    Yeah man. They've had some solid picks, but I agree, they've had a lot of turds.
     
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  31. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    However, they did strike gold in the sixth round that one time. :)
     
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  32. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Good point. I think the key would be to discern whether or not Casiero advocates New England's draft approach, whether or not it's rubbed off on him or become ingrained in his belief system, how open he is to change, and how he would've done things differently if he indeed would've followed a different approach had it been his baby.
     
  33. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yes but you're choosing just one year of 3. And even then, just a few games out of last year, not all of it. You said he underachieved based on draft expectations. What is the expectations than for a 3rd round running back? Reggie Bush and AP have a lot of fumbles. Yes they had more carries, but that's because they weren't punished as much as BB. BB's doghouse is notorious.

    When they drafted him they still had BJE on roster. 1,000 yard rusher, 4.4 ypc on a pass first team. Ridley and Vereen ate into his carries. This is what BB does with RBs. He had 5 different RBs carry in 2011 with their leading rusher, BJE, only getting half the carries. You point to Vereen as a pass catching back but he didn't catch passes primarily until this year. He was absolutely drafted to carry the ball, look at 2012. 62 carries, 8 catches. So your'e telling me Vereen was drafted to be their pass catcher but they didn't unveil that purpose until year 3?
     
  34. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    I just don't like that most of their hits were in the 1st round. I think those should be a given for any halfway competent drafter.
    I don't think Hightower has fit the bill of the 2nd highest drafted LB the past 3 years.
    Hernandez looked like an outstanding pick and now.... well......
    Gronk looked like a phenomenal pick and now he cant stay healthy... but that's also partly due to his playing style.

    They traded out of the 1st round in 2009 to take Darius Butler in round 2.... and the Packers selected Clay Matthews with the pick. LOL.

    They traded back their 22nd pick in 2010 [for Devin McCourty], which Denver used to take Demaryius Thomas. Also passed on Dez Bryant even though their only receiver at the time was Welker, and Gronk & Hernandez weren't on the team yet.

    They traded two picks to move up 8 spots in the 2nd round for Ron Brace who became a bust.

    Love the Collins pick though. Can't argue there.
     
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  35. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    Biggest blind luck s*** in history.
     
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  36. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    I know the narrative is that the Fins and Ross are incompetents, BUT has anyone considered that perhaps Caserio was actually one of the Dolphins first choices?


    The media will never agree with this because they were cut out of the loop, but the way things have played out so far, with all of the interviews and rumors and negative BS, but it could have been that they were biding their time until the Pats were out of the playoffs to arrange to get him in for talks. If he was a top choice, it makes more sense of why the interview process has taken so long.


    For all anyone REALLY knows, the Dolphins have actually been doing things correctly (or somewhere), despite what they media has been saying.


    IF they hire Caserio, they would have been able to hire the GM they wanted, and also have lined up interviews with the other candidates JIC he didn't want the job.


    Yeah, perhaps I'm being a wee bit too positive, but makes sense on a certain level as it explains why the process has dragged on and also why they didn't let Caserio leave last night and have had him in house today.


    I'm really hoping we get this right and have our guy within the next day or two.
     
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  37. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    lol based on their first 2 preseason games in 2011. Really?

    Safe to say they tried to use Vereen even more in the passing game but I think that's even more about them losing so many pass-catchers. Otherwise I think you'd of seen him get pretty close to an even split w Ridley.
     
  38. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    A. You really think sources around the league know the inner workings of the Patriots and Belichick?

    B. The guy has been with Belichick for nearly 14 years. Coaching, scouting and in the front office. That's a pretty good person to train under.

    C. This is the case with every potential GM (unless he already has been one and was fired elsewhere). We really don't know about the decision-making prowess of any of these guys in other organizations - except perhaps DeCosta who probably has proven himself, hence the contract that gives him the GM when Ozzie retires.

    D. How this makes Gaine any better is beyond me. Funny, Cesario has somehow learned nothing from Belichick and does not contribute anything, but then, fans justify hiring Gaine and think he had nothing to do with Ireland's gaffes. The level of unwarranted supposition in all this is just a bit over the top.

    Just no way to know about any of these guys. But, I'll take a guy who worked under Belichick for 14 years in all those areas over a guy who worked under Jeff Ireland. Whether that is a good move or not remains to be seen. But, that's the case with every new hire.
     
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  39. GreysonWinfield

    GreysonWinfield Release The Hounds

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    You can have a lot of turds when you consistently win.
     
  40. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    The odds of this are slim. The narrative is there because of Ross' past with a) Harbaugh; b) Sparano; c) Ireland; d) the stadium fiasco, etc., etc.,

    But, your supposition also falls on its face in that the Dolphins made a last minute desperation offer to Licht when he was going to the Bucs. Add that to the flaws and foibles of Mr. Ross.
     

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