Bikini-clad strippers protest church in rural Ohio

"Finascious D wrote:

So, you're fine with private citizens blackmailing other private citizens?

Stripping is a sin apparently.

How can you be blackmailed if you dont think its wrong???

Silly acts of individuals protesting against those that enter the CLUB are silly acts by individuals. Same silly acts the bikini clad group is resorting to.

"padre31 wrote:

I'm fine with people behaving legally via protesting what they do not like.

Put it this way, you sling the charge of "blackmail"..have they broken any laws? Have they been arrested? Charged with any crimes?

Blackmail is illegal isn't it? Then why haven't they been charged if what you say is true and not hyperbole?

Maybe because the people they're blackmailing won't speak up. That's kind of the point of blackmailing you know. Or some of the guys they tried this on, just say fine tell them they don't care.

Taking down license plate numbers then threatening people with telling their wives or mothers is blackmail padre.

"BigDogsHunt wrote:

How can you be blackmailed if you dont think its wrong???

Silly acts of individuals protesting against those that enter the CLUB are silly acts by individuals. Same silly acts the bikini clad group is resorting to.

Did you read the article?

They are writing down license numbers than threatening to tell their wives and mothers. That's blackmail.

"Finascious D wrote:

Did you read the article?

They are writing down license numbers than threatening to tell their wives and mothers. That's blackmail.

did you miss the concept of Blackmail....if the owner of the car doesnt care if his wife or mother knows, its not blackmail. If the wife or mother doesnt care if the husband/son is at the strip club, its not blackmail.

Its a small town....folks know each other. Its not illegal to be at the club...so you are basing this Blackmail mentality on guilt...well its only guilt if you feel you have done something wrong or sinned.

So which is it? Does the Church have it right that it is a sin to feel guilty about? or do the patrons of the club have it right that its not a sin, so nothing to feel guilty about?

"Finascious D wrote:

Maybe because the people they're blackmailing won't speak up. That's kind of the point of blackmailing you know. Or some of the guys they tried this on, just say fine tell them they don't care.

Then why haven't they been charged with a crime?

Taking down license plate numbers then threatening people with telling their wives or mothers is blackmail padre.

What would they have to worry about if they are doing nothing wrong FinD?

How about..because it isn't blackmail?

This tactic is common in places with high prostitution or drug sales, the local community watch takes pictures of license tags, then mails them to the registered owner.

The State does the same thing as well as a crime suppression effort.

"BigDogsHunt wrote:

did you miss the concept of Blackmail....if the owner of the car doesnt care if his wife or mother knows, its not blackmail. If the wife or mother doesnt care if the husband/son is at the strip club, its not blackmail.

Its a small town....folks know each other. Its not illegal to be at the club...so you are basing this Blackmail mentality on guilt...well its only guilt if you feel you have done something wrong or sinned.

So which is it? Does the Church have it right that it is a sin to feel guilty about? or do the patrons of the club have it right that its not a sin, so nothing to feel guilty about?

"padre31 wrote:

Then why haven't they been charged with a crime?

What would they have to worry about if they are doing nothing wrong FinD?

How about..because it isn't blackmail?

This tactic is common in places with high prostitution or drug sales, the local community watch takes pictures of license tags, then mails them to the registered owner.

The State does the same thing as well as a crime suppression effort.

I see, so now the church is the law. Interesting.

I think this is a prime example of you two being biased in favor of your own beliefs. You see nothing wrong with a church threatening people who may not believe the same way they do or for going against the church.

What difference does it make if the patron feels they did something wrong by going to the club? What authority does the church have to blackmail them with their family life?

I wonder what would happen if you guys would say, if someone had Jewish or Muslim accountant who threatened tell their wife about having a bank account the Mrs. didn't know about, unless they stopped eating pork.

Apparently, religious freedom in your eyes means a church has the freedom to strong arm people into their beliefs.

And the main glaring difference is, the things you mentioned padre are actually illegal, going to strip club isn't.

"Finascious D wrote:

I see, so now the church is the law. Interesting.

I think this is a prime example of you two being biased in favor of your own beliefs. You see nothing wrong with a church threatening people who may not believe the same way they do or for going against the church.

What difference does it make if the patron feels they did something wrong by going to the club? What authority does the church have to blackmail them with their family life?

I wonder what would happen if you guys would say, if someone had Jewish or Muslim accountant who threatened tell their wife about having a bank account the Mrs. didn't know about, unless they stopped eating pork.

Apparently, religious freedom in your eyes means a church has the freedom to strong arm people into their beliefs.

And the main glaring difference is, the things you mentioned padre are actually illegal, going to strip club isn't.

First, I am already on record stating that the Church protesters are as silly as the retaliatory Club protesters...so this doesn't have a thing to do with beliefs (religious or not).

Who said the Church actions are the law? Its apparent, the concept of guilt escapes you I see. Simply put, if you don't feel guilty for your actions, you have zero to be blackmailed about. Whether clubbing it, or eating pork to your liking.

And as far as being JUDGED by others....happens everyday in every facet...this just happens to center around Church and Strip Club which doesn't change the core fact...if you aren't guilty of your actions you cant be blackmailed over them. Agreed, not illegal to go to Strip Club..so what is one guilty of by doing so that a picture of a license plate would change? Guilt of Sin? Again, I ask...is that possible?

"BigDogsHunt wrote:

First, I am already on record stating that the Church protesters are as silly as the retaliatory Club protesters...so this doesn't have a thing to do with beliefs (religious or not).

Who said the Church actions are the law? Its apparent, the concept of guilt escapes you I see. Simply put, if you don't feel guilty for your actions, you have zero to be blackmailed about.

And as far as being JUDGED by others....happens everyday in every facet...this just happens to center around Church and Strip Club which doesn't change the core fact...if you aren't guilty of your actions you cant be blackmailed over them. Agreed, not illegal to go to Strip Club..so what is one guilty of by doing so that a picture of a license plate would change? Guilt of Sin? Again, I ask...is that possible?

They threatened to tell their wives. If the wife doesn't want them going, then that is what they have to feel guilty about. Either way, what business is it of the church's? Why are you not answering that?

Hey guys.....ROLLER COASTERS!

"Finascious D wrote:

They threatened to tell their wives. If the wife doesn't want them going, then that is what they have to feel guilty about. Either way, what business is it of the church's? Why are you not answering that?

Then if they have put themselves in that position they have guilt and have done something wrong. So which is it?

I have answered it. The Church is no different than anyone judging someone of their actions here in my book. Parent, Spouse, Sibling, Friend, Enemy, etc.....if you are guilty and feel guilty you screwed up. Deal with it...whether its a church member pointing it out or not doesnt matter. You F'd up! Fix that!

You have also indirectly answered that if patrons of the club feel guilty, then they have sinned...and that's is the business this church is in for this town. So be it.

"Pagan wrote:

Hey guys.....ROLLER COASTERS!

Wait, I am being Judged by Fin-D cause I'm not agreeing with his view....dont blow his mojo of what he does best! :lol::up::wink2:

"BigDogsHunt wrote:

Then if they have put themselves in that position they have guilt and have done something wrong. So which is it?

I have answered it. The Church is no different than anyone judging someone of their actions here in my book. Parent, Spouse, Sibling, Friend, Enemy, etc.....if you are guilty and feel guilty you screwed up. Deal with it...whether its a church member pointing it out or not doesnt matter. You F'd up! Fix that!

You have answered that if patrons of the club feel guilty, then they have sinned...and that's is the business this church is in for this town. So be it.

There's a difference between judging someone and threatening them.

Its also interesting that you think, the church gets to define that guilt is only because of a sin that they've defined and then have the right to pressure people into their way of thinking.

"Finascious D wrote:

There's a difference between judging someone and threatening them.

Its also interesting that you think, the church gets to define that guilt is only because of a sin that they've defined and then have the right to pressure people into their way of thinking.

LOL....the individual is defining the guilt, you said so yourself. Guilt and Fear are personnel issues....outside forces are meaningless unless you give in and accept what they preach. So that too is an individual decision.

Again, if no one that has their license plate taken feels guilty...than its moot. If anyone does, that speaks more to their personal problems then anything the Church is accused of in this instance.

You really are fixated on what the Church is or does or what power you want to give it. Dont know if its conscious of sub-conscious but its interesting and self defining for you it seems on many many related topics.

"BigDogsHunt wrote:

Wait, I am being Judged by Fin-D cause I'm not agreeing with his view....dont blow his mojo of what he does best! :lol::up::wink2:

You know, I started this thread respectfully. You came into it to tell me I'm wrong. That means you came in here to tell me I'm wrong. Do you see how ridiculous this is?

Just exactly how is it, that on a forum meant for the sole purpose of expressing an opinion, am I the only one who isn't allowed to have one without you and a handful of others constantly having to personally attack me for it.

It is so effing old. If you don't like my opinions, then argue with me, but stop making it personal or just put me on ignore.

"Finascious D wrote:

You know, I started this thread respectfully. You came into it to tell me I'm wrong. That means you came in here to tell me I'm wrong. Do you see how ridiculous this is?

Just exactly how is it, that on a forum meant for the sole purpose of expressing an opinion, am I the only one who isn't allowed to have one without you and a handful of others constantly having to personally attack me for it.

It is so effing old. If you don't like my opinions, then argue with me, but stop making it personal or just put me on ignore.

I raised one question about how can someone be blackmailed if they haven't done anything wrong or feel guilty about.....your interpretation of attacks against you being in the right or in the wrong are all yours.

Debating opinions is just that. Funny as Pagan says, those that choose to personalize or internalize the debate are the same ones over and over in many many threads. Classic.

Good luck, I will exit the thread since nothing left to debate. Wouldnt think of ignoring you.

"BigDogsHunt wrote:

LOL....the individual is defining the guilt, you said so yourself. Guilt and Fear are personnel issues....outside forces are meaningless unless you give in and accept what they preach. So that too is an individual decision.

Again, if no one that has their license plate taken feels guilty...than its moot. If anyone does, that speaks more to their personal problems then anything the Church is accused of in this instance.

You really are fixated on what the Church is or does or what power you want to give it. Dont know if its conscious of sub-conscious but its interesting and self defining for you it seems on many many related topics.

You said yourself, if there's guilt there's sin and that makes it the church's purview. I'm saying someone can feel guilty about something that has nothing to do with what the church defines as sin.

It also seems you miss the fact that they are taking down the license numbers so they can say stop going to this legal business or we're telling your wives. If the guy sees nothing wrong with going but his wife does, how is that any business of the church's? You still haven't really answered that.

You are basically saying the church has the right to threaten people.

"BigDogsHunt wrote:

I raised one question about how can someone be blackmailed if they haven't done anything wrong or feel guilty about.....your interpretation of attacks against you being in the right or in the wrong are all yours.

Debating opinions is just that. Funny as Pagan says, those that choose to personalize or internalize the debate are the same ones over and over in many many threads. Classic.

Good luck, I will exit the thread since nothing left to debate. Wouldnt think of ignoring you.

Funny nothing.

This is absolutely a personal attack:

I am being Judged by Fin-D cause I'm not agreeing with his view....dont blow his mojo of what he does best!

the photographing of plates is a bit wierd no?what purpose would that serve in the church goers protest of the club patrons?are they going to have someone look up the plates and show up at these patrons homes and business to preach the good book?i'm not a lawyer but isn't that a form of stalking?also should be a privacy matter as well no?

partly-cloudybathing=less risk of skin cancer but,mercy i would hate to see their tan lines.

Both sides want publicity for their "cause" and the newspaper/TV want to show bikini clad women and church signs to hype ratings. It is a perfect storm of self interest.

btw, I live 20 minutes west of Cedar Point! Anyone planning a visit should pm me and perhaps we can meet ftf.

I live in Columbus, and I have never in my life heard of Warsaw....

But boy thems womens sure is hot! :up:

"Ohiophinphan wrote:

btw, I live 20 minutes west of Cedar Point! Anyone planning a visit should pm me and perhaps we can meet ftf.

You can count on that!

fact is the church is actively harassing and intimidating people in an attempt to discourage them from going to that club anymore. im no lawyer but common sense, which some people in here dont seem to be exercising, would tell me that this course of action IS or SHOULD BE illegal.

funny thing is, the strippers are being more christ like then the churchies.

i personally think all these church backers need to get their heads out of their asses and look around. the church is not infalable.

i guess it doesnt bother believers, when they hear about the catholic church doing nothing about child molesting preists, yet they want to file charges against churches that have female leaders. yea sounds like they have their priorities in line.

like they say, "ignorance is bliss." at least i imagine it is.

"eric wrote:

fact is the church is actively harassing and intimidating people in an attempt to discourage them from going to that club anymore. im no lawyer but common sense, which some people in here dont seem to be exercising, would tell me that this course of action IS or SHOULD BE illegal.

funny thing is, the strippers are being more christ like then the churchies.

i personally think all these church backers need to get their heads out of their asses and look around. the church is not infalable.

i guess it doesnt bother believers, when they hear about the catholic church doing nothing about child molesting preists, yet they want to file charges against churches that have female leaders. yea sounds like they have their priorities in line.

like they say, "ignorance is bliss." at least i imagine it is.

So says the Atheist...

I practice the Ricky Williams religion of "Its just nature dude" because it is....some churches/religions expect you to follow a certain way of life wich is 100% nuts (not all) I mean if you read that bible you will find that you shouldnt "judge" others, but yet these people are going to the extreme to do just that.

And to threaten to tell wives?? Wow these fanatics need to take a look in the mirror because frankly they are grandstanding the bible. But their probobly isnt much else to do in Warsaw besides be a hypocrite.

This congregation is not that far from me and thus I have watched this story play out in the press and on TV for a long time. The owner of the club is a spokesperson for "adult" entertainment in Ohio and has been on record saying clubs like this should be allowed to be anywhere. They are regularly raided for drugs/prostitution/ and all manner of vice crimes.

The pastor has also been very public claiming as his vision "cleaning up" his town and reforming it into what would be his view of proper.

Nothing either side is doing is illeagel. If you enter a club there may be consequences to your job or marriage. The members are letting patrons know that. Still it is the patron's choice. Likewise the dancers have been protesting the effects of the boycott though it certainly appears both sides are interested in their time in the limelight more than anything else. Publicity is a motive.

What has been interesting though are some of the side stories among the worker bees of both sides. Some of the congregation's members have engaged the girls in converstaion. "Why are you allowing yourself to be exploited" has been the gist of the opening. There has been a real conversation among the women who see this as a way of supporting their children/families and people who who "love" them enough to say being exploited is harmful to you. It cheapens your self image and self respect.

Women who were formerly "in the sex trade" and have reformed have come and talked to both sides about the freeing power of Jesus Christ and the joys of "straight" employment, warts and all. That is a much more interesting and powerful story but it makes less good print and especially TV so less is told.

We have disagreed on this forum many times about whether people of faith "have a right" to express their moral views in the publkic debate. Many of you would muzzle any protest of position which arises from a faith based perspective. I find that bigoted and hypocritical from your side just as you actively work to demean faith based perspectives. We will not agree.

This story is a pimple on the religious debate of this nation and the world. Let's lance it and move on to better questions.