1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Beck Needs To Start This Sunday

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by nosoapradio, Dec 11, 2007.

Tags:
  1. nosoapradio

    nosoapradio Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    90
    203
    33
    Dec 11, 2007
    "Cleo Lemon gives us the best chance to win."

    I don't buy this one bit. What has Lemon won? What good things has he done? Why start a mediocre QB who will be a FA at the end of the Bengals game?

    For some reason, out of all of the garbage that I've seen this season. The one play that sums up this team, happened last Sunday...Lemon performs a beautiful play-action fake with NOBODY IN THE BACKFIELD, which sets up a perfect pass to Donte Whitner. That would be pretty sweet if Donte was a Dolphin. Lemon has showed me absolutely nothing. In fact, he is one of the worst QB's under pressure that I have seen in a long time.

    Beck looked bad against the Jets, but the OL was awful, our #1 RB had a whopping 26 yards on the ground, and our receivers couldn't catch a cold. Then last week, Can't Cameron benches the rookie after a shaky start, and brings in the Lemon. And what does our glorious leader do for Lemon? He changes the game plan; more roll outs, more vertical passing, more aggressive. I liked what I saw from him against the Eagles...with fewer dropped passes, better Special Teams play, that could have been a different game. Then against the Steelers in those ridiculous conditions, he showed me some good game management skills.

    Guys, Beck was set up for failure against the Bills. He is a rookie, he's going to make mistakes. How do you run our offense as if we still have Ronnie Brown and Chambers on the field? Our OL has regressed, our receivers can't get separation, and we are on 5th string RB.

    I would like to see Beck start. I would like to see Can't grow a pair and open up the offense some more. More shotgun sets with Lo Bookers lined up next to Beck. If we can't protect the QB and we can't gain yards on the ground, at least design some plays that give him a chance to move his feet. We need to know if Beck is the type of player to overcome or be overcome. Lemon is not our future, Lemon has not won a game.

    What do you think?

    NSR
     
  2. emocomputerjock

    emocomputerjock Senior Member

    5,649
    1,853
    113
    Nov 23, 2007
    DC
    Beck shouldn't have been out there to begin with. I'd love to see him grow into a great quarterback, but he's not going to do it out there now. He needs an offseason and a training camp to get this all under his belt and digested.
     
  3. pocoloco

    pocoloco I'm your huckleberry Club Member

    8,343
    5,438
    113
    Nov 28, 2007
    North Chicago
    Cameron is trying to save his job, and he is more comfortable using his playbook with Lemon out there. He's got every right to do this, since 0-16 would probably get him fired, out of the NFL, and coaching college.

    It's disappointing from a fan standpoint because we'd like to know more about what Beck has to offer as we go into a draft were we hold the #1 pick, but Cameron is thinking about his career at the moment.
     
  4. Zod

    Zod Ruler of the Universe

    3,415
    1,557
    113
    Nov 25, 2007

    Uh... None of that you are listing as reasons he is failing will change between now and Sunday. If you want John Beck to develope, send Cleo Lemon out there to learn bad habits and throw interceptions. :up:
     
  5. Zod

    Zod Ruler of the Universe

    3,415
    1,557
    113
    Nov 25, 2007

    So which one do you care about? Your sending mixed signals here.

    Do you care about not being 0-16? Or do you care about John Beck starting?

    You will get 0-16 with John Beck starting.

    Is that what you want? Cause that's the signal the Miami Dolphins got in week 11 when everyone including the Queen of England was yelling "START JOHN BECK".
     
  6. pocoloco

    pocoloco I'm your huckleberry Club Member

    8,343
    5,438
    113
    Nov 28, 2007
    North Chicago
    I would rather Beck starts from here on out, but I understand why Cameron is going to go with Lemon.

    If Cameron believed his job was safe, no matter what, he would be making this change. He'd be evaluating Beck going into the draft. This change tells me that Cameron understands he might be fired, and is going everything possible to try and win a game. I think it boils down to, go 0-16 and get fired, go 1-15 and stay on for another year.
     
  7. Jsbaugh

    Jsbaugh New Member

    118
    1
    0
    Dec 2, 2007
    This is the situation that Cam has created on his own. Everything that nosoapradio listed are great reasons to start Beck, but they are also reasons to not put him in and start Cleo.
    To be honest at this point in time, with how bad our line is playing and no running game, I think Cleo probably should start. He is better at running for his life than Beck is and has more experience doing it.

    Right now Cam needs to win a game. He can see the team giving up on this season and him as a coach and he needs to stop the bleeding. Devolping Beck will have to wait until they get a win or move to next season.
    My guess is we will see Beck again in a game or so due to Cleo getting knocked out or turning the ball over to many times.
     
  8. Dolphan5876

    Dolphan5876 New Member

    23
    0
    0
    Nov 25, 2007
    I'm all for a Rookie learning on the Job, But Beck is not even close to being ready. He holds the ball too long and he will get killed by the ravens. The only reason it has worked for Cleo is that he rolls out of the pocket and MAKES more time to throw. Not to get off topic, but 1,2,3 in the draft should be Derek Mcfadden, Colt Brennan & his receiver Rivers from HU, Defense the rest and Offensive and Defensive line through Free Agency. Playoffs next year QB's to last into the next 10 years
     
  9. arsenal

    arsenal Sunglasses and advil

    2,768
    1,081
    0
    Nov 26, 2007
    Commack, NY
    i do agree with the fact it seems our offense is different with lemon... more chances down the field, more moving pockets, more play action...

    i dont know why we are afraid to do those things with beck...
     
  10. nosoapradio

    nosoapradio Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    90
    203
    33
    Dec 11, 2007
    My point is that we need to adapt our playbook. Due to injuries and inexperience, we can not run a traditional "Power I" scheme. We need to exploit the positives. Place Beck in a shotgun, line up Lo Booker next to him. Try something different. Maybe something good can happen. We do have speed between Ginn, Lo Booker, Hagan and Beck's quick release. Starting Lemon because his instincts tell him to flee at the hint of pressure rather than scanning the field to make something positive happen is not how you win games.

    I'll be the first to admit that I don't know a fraction of what anybody that earns their living in football knows about the game. But I do know that sometimes plans don't work, and in these cases you swallow your pride and adapt...change the plan.

    I don't think you ruin Beck by starting him. The expectations are low. 0-16, unfortunately, looks more and more likely. Try to build on the future. Beck, Ginn and Booker are our future.

    Also, if we draft a RB, QB, and WR with our first 3 picks in the draft I will personally go down to the Dolphins HQ and punch Wayne right in the Huizinga! WE NEED DEFENSE!
     
  11. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

    99,377
    37,301
    0
    Nov 22, 2007
    inching to 100k posts

    More or less, the idea that "We must start Beck no matter what" is not a wise one, and I was one of the the supporters of Beck starting.

    Then the obvious became apparent, it's a stacked deck, Beck simply cannot succeed in this environment, no "reliable" running game to keep the Defense honest, no blitz pickups.

    Cleo Lemon for better or worse, is the only QB on our roster that can deal with the current realities, and he has been in the NFL how long?

    The Ravens were blitzing Tom Brady and getting to him, what does anyone suppose will happen this Sunday?
     
  12. FinsAreLife

    FinsAreLife Well-Known Member

    2,824
    762
    113
    Dec 7, 2007
    because if Cam knows if he doesnt win at least one game this year that hes a goner for sure. Right now he'll try anything to win a game.
     
  13. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

    36,721
    27,700
    113
    Dec 11, 2007
    By the quarterback I have read Beck to be from college I don't seen playing him as damaging him unless he gets hurt. From the horribliness he played during his first year in a Quarterback rich college and how he handled it, I thought was pretty good. Yet I can see a good reason not to start him due to the fact that everything is so broken right now that even Brady wouldn't succeed in this offense. The runningback situation is beyond horrible and the line just isn't equipped to be dominating without at least a passing game to take pressure off the running game or a runningback who can make plays and take pressure off the passing game. Really there are few lines that are.

    If Beck just has one good game that helps the Beck Mystique for next year when it comes to the fans. Right now Beck looks like another Feeley and that isn't going to help ticket sales at all.
     
  14. GridIronKing34

    GridIronKing34 Silently Judging You Club Member

    23,330
    16,125
    113
    Nov 22, 2007
    Denver, CO
    Cleo gives us a better shot at getting a W and the offense isn't ready for Beck and it's uncertain if Beck is ready for the starting role. Beck is more of a pocket passer and the line isn't really getting the job done with pass protection while Lemon is better with the roll outs. I don't think we should have started Beck to begin with, but hindsight is 20/20 and we all asked for this.
     
  15. larfo2224

    larfo2224 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    769
    304
    63
    Nov 26, 2007
    Box Elder, South Dakota
    If Beck is being set up for failure due to the injuries and other factors, then let him sit and Cleo start. Turn the reins over to Beck after the season and let's see what develops. I think it would take alot of pressure off of him to have a running back of Ronnie's caliber back there to help him.
     
  16. azstryker

    azstryker New Member

    242
    1
    0
    Dec 2, 2007
    I was all for starting Beck for the rest of the season, even if it meant 0-16. That being said, I completely agree with the benching. If Beck was even playing decently then I could take a winless season. However, he is been simply horrible. He did not play well in any of the games. We scored 6 whopping points with him at the helm. Now 3.1 games may not be enough for some of you guys to evaluate him, but what I saw is extremely troubling. What I saw is Rex Grossman and Kyle Boller. Beck carries himself exactly like those two on the field. He's a good guy, sure. Strong arm, fine. Hard worker, you bet. But those three will never intertwine to make him a great QB just like Boller and Grossman won't either.

    Think about it. Good QB's come in ready to make all the throws, it's the reads that trouble them. You have to make the right type of throw as well as finding the open receiver. Beck hasn't done either. Can he learn this, sure, but learning isn't enough. He has to be able to do it with very little margin for error.and he has to be physical able to do it. Many QB's could make the reads but their bodies couldn't cash in. Also, factor in that he's already 26 and the clock is ticking. We don't have time for him to improve his throught process just to see his physical skill start to decline.

    Next, Beck's delivery and footwork need major work. There are way too many batted balls and his accuracy has suffered with the quicker pace. He'll have to re learn this too! Again, he's 26 and it's not a good time to start from scratch. It's only compounding the things that he has to fix, and the more they pile on the longer it will take

    Last, he looks lost, or probably more correctly put, not confident. Now this is the only one that you might be able to insert the "he's only a rookie" excuse. However, Pocket presence and leadership are something you either have or you don't. IMO, it can not be taught. Look at our boy Danny. He wasn't mobile but he always knew how and when to side step a blitz while keeping his eyes down field. It was second nature to him. Beck seems to panic and try to write checks that he can't athletically cash. He tucks and runs but let's face it, he's not Vince Young. Let's also not forget that the team played much better when Lemon came in. The team has more confidence with Lemon for some reason. I say we trust them. I know that Cleo is a terrible QB too and won't be here next year but at least the team puts some points on the board when he plays. How can we beat the Raves or Bengals if we can't at least score 17 points?? Beck tried to lead but nobody followed, and that was pretty obvious by the look of his team mates.

    SO I ask you: With Becks' problems

    1. Making NFL Throws amd Reads

    2. Delivery and footwork

    3. Pocket Presence/Leadership

    How can you maintain confidence in this kid and say Cameron is making the wrong choice. The man is trying to avoid history and save his job. Stating Beck does neither.
     
  17. #1dolphinsfan

    #1dolphinsfan New Member

    1,664
    189
    0
    Nov 23, 2007
    your right he does need to be in the training camp for one more year to get used to the WR but sence he was put in he should be the starting QB
     
  18. Lungoystr

    Lungoystr New Member

    56
    0
    0
    Dec 1, 2007
    I'm glad that you mentioned this. It seems that so many people forget the difference in these two QBs and the fact that there are areas of the playbook that can be opened up for Lemon because he is more mobile than Beck (which is was we saw against the Bills). Cam has mentioned this as well in the past (the certain players limit the amount of the playbook that can be used) but I'm certain that since so many here want Cam gone so bad that they have simply stopped listening to him. In the end it doesn't matter who starts, fans have made up their minds about Cam. If we lose he is damned for not pulling out at least one win. If we win he is damned because that may just be enough for him to save his job (which very few fans want to see happen). Personally, I think Cam is making the right decision by starting Lemon, especially in the absence of a running game. At least he can help keep a defense honest......and run for his life if need be. The gameplan in Buff wasn't changed for Lemon, it was changed because of Lemon.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2007

Share This Page