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Are we a good football team?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by SICK, Nov 20, 2009.

  1. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    imo there are

    great teams (saints, pats, colts)

    good teams (ravens, packers, falcons, chargers, bengals)

    average teams (us, panthers, cowboys, steelers)

    below avg teams

    and bad teams


    i didnt list everyone obviously, but where do we fall in this catigory, right now we are 5-5

    but we are 5-0 against teams with current losing records

    and 0-5 Vs teams with current winning records. not good imo.

    where do we stand? and is playoffs an actuality?
     
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  2. mbmonk

    mbmonk I have no clue

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    I think slightly above average.

    Our Defense is mediocre at best at stopping the run or pass.

    Our offense is good to great at running and mediocre at passing.

    Our special teams... I don't know. We used to be below average, but with Ginn and the better kick coverage I would say above average.

    Coaching.. above average.

    You are only as strong as your weakest link.. and the weakest link this year is the defense.
     
  3. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    IMO there are great teams, bad teams and everyone else.

    We are part of everyone else.
     
  4. opfinistic

    opfinistic Braaaaains!

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    You forgot to mention the Bills separately, right below bad teams and right above day old doggy doo doo.
     
  5. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    We're close, but IMO our defense is keeping us out of the good category. If we have some more games like Thursday where we don't give up any huge passing plays then we could move up. (I would prefer better run D too, but Carolina is a great running team).

    I also wouldn't put NE in the great category as their D is too suspect. Their passing offense makes them a threat against anybody but they are not complete enough to be great. I'd put Minnesota up there instead.

    Pitt is also tough. They are a good team when Polamalu is healthy and average when he isn't.

    I'd also drop the Ravens and Falcons from the good list.
     
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  6. SeanP

    SeanP Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Average, but held back by seriously consistent issues stopping the TE and plugging up the middle, and the lack of a playmaker WR that can make the kind of plays against us that we've been seeing all year.

    Those two things are the biggest issue we have. We're starting to get the pass rush thing figured out I think, and if Cam Wake can step up and be a full package OLB, we're in the good category for sure.

    The thing that separates good teams from great teams though, at least on defense, are players that are a master of every angle of the game. We've got a lot of defensive players that can stuff the run, or play well in coverage, but we don't have a lot of players that kill everything that comes their way. We need that to become a great team, and unfortunately thats going to mean in two or three drafts finding replacements for some players who are working well, but could do better.

    We've got the formula, the bricks are in place, and we've got a solid foundation. Now we just need to properly address the fine details like we've been doing, and then over the next few years properly address our biggest need year to year.

    I'm more confident in this team than I have been since Marino was around. Barring any major shakeups, the phins will be relevant again, thank god.
     
  7. miamiron

    miamiron There's always next year

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    I don't think we are anything more than a .500 team

    Good teams dont have a passing offense that is#29 out of 32 teams
    Good teams are not #23 in total yards
    Good teams dont have a defense that is 26th in points allowed
    Good teams are not 25th in the NFL in yards allowed

    With that being said I have no doubt with the next two drafts this team will be elite
     
  8. dolphans1

    dolphans1 New Member

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    Consider the fact that we were dominating 2 of the best teams in FB, who are both undefeated, we're in a tough division as it is. Now injuries are taking a toll on us.

    I thought we looked good last night running a traditional offense.

    d-1
     
  9. SeanP

    SeanP Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    We're better than our record shows. Right now until we can stand toe to toe with the Patriots, we're a potential wildcard team, that's it. Wildcard teams sometimes can capitalize on other teams injuries, or put together a remarkable SB run. But until we can reliably give the Pats a run of their money, and consistently split, or beat them 2x every year, we are just like every other team with SB hopes.
     
  10. Paul 13

    Paul 13 Chaotic Neutral Staff Member

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    I would categorize the above as this:

    Great: Saints, Colts, Pats, Chargers
    Good: Bengals, Steelers, Vikings, Cardinals, Giants, Eagles
    Average: Us, Cowboys, Ravens, Falcons, Broncos, Texans

    You left out some good teams... Vikes, Cards, G-men, and Iggles...
     
  11. Thunderbolt89

    Thunderbolt89 Well-Known Member

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    I think we are considered average right now but are on the rise and with a few moves this offseason ready to move up into a contender. Although I do think we are better than most think,I feel some people still see the Dolphins as an easy game on the schedule and that is usually when we win.
     
  12. keypusher

    keypusher Well-Known Member

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    I think to be good in today's NFL you have to be able to pass and stop the pass. Right now we really can't do either, but I think we have a promising young QB and promising talent in our defensive secondary. Looking ahead, we need to replace Porter and J. Taylor while upgrading our pass rush. We also need to upgrade our receivers. I'm afraid we may be two receivers away, though, not just one.
     
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  13. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    How are the Giants good? They get killed by good teams.

    How are the Cardinals good?

    Eagles got beat by the Raiders, and they are good?

    Chargers are great?
     
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  14. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree with the need to be able to pass and stop the pass but I don't think we're far off at least on D. I expect JT to be back and continue at a high level for at least one more year if not two. I also think Wake is already our best pass rusher. He seemed to get pressure on every snap and that was despite at least four non-called holds against him. When he develops his reputation the refs will be giving him those calls. Depending on what happens with Porter, Roth and Anderson going forward, I believe we have enough talented pass rushers there.

    I actually think our secondary is set. The CBs are outstanding with Smith, Davis, Jones and a returning W. Allen. The Ss could be better in coverage but with Bell, Wilson, Clemons and just more time playing together they will be at least good.

    The lack of go to receiving targets is what keeps us from solidly being good or great. I think we need a #1 WR and a seam splitting TE. I can think of other needs, specifically ILB and now a NT, but just adding those two receiving targets would make us a SB contender.
     
  15. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Good list, I have no real issues with any of it. I do think that teams with great passing attacks are always a threat though, so while NE, SD and Ariz. are not great or complete teams they are dangerous enough to win it all if they get hot at the right time.
     
  16. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    to me there arent any great or even very good teams so my list would start with

    GOOD TEAMS

    1) Vikings
    2) Saints
    3) Colts
    4) Patriots
    5) Bengals
    6) Chargers
    7) Broncos

    AVERAGE TEAMS

    8) Steelers
    9) Texans
    10) Cardinals
    11) Dolphins
    12) Cowboys
    13) Ravens
    14) Giants
    15) Eagles
    16) Packers
    17) Bears
    18) Falcons
    19) Jets
    20) 49ers
    21) Jaguars
    22) Titans

    POOR TEAMS
    23) Panthers
    24) Redskins
    25) Bill
    26) Seahawks
    27) Chiefs
    28) Raiders
    29) Lions
    30) Buccaneers

    HORRENDOUS TEAMS

    31) Rams
    32) Browns
     
  17. eric

    eric New Member

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    its a shame not to have a receiving threat with how much potential has been in our back field all season.

    if we had that, we would probably 7-3 or better. our offense's weak performance is putting to much of a burden on our defense. they wouldn't be as bad if they didn't have to play so much.

    we have 4 prime time games this year. EVERYONE knows receiving is our weakness. think of this season as a show case for the organization. everyone knows about the changes being made. how much progress is taking place. those two things together SHOULD make us a desirable place for any free agent receivers. and its south Florida on top of that.

    what free agent receivers wouldn't jump at the chance to come down here and be an immediate impact and fan favorite? any one that did so would be like a hero around here.

    i think that is our number one need. a free agent receiver that can come in and start producing immediately and not have any periods of growing pains. with that assistance to the offense, it takes a lot of burden off of the defense as well. and im sure we will get plenty of production between player development and the draft, for all other positions.

    i think more passing production alone moves us up from average to good. all the other pieces added in would make us one of the top teams.
     
  18. UM_all_day

    UM_all_day New Member

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    I think we are right at good but are just beating ourselves out of wins.....I feel like we aren't even a couple players from winning, we are a couple plays from winning games.....we're not just getting smacked around....I think we just lack communication and execution at times...

    like we might lose because a missed FG and some dropped passes but we all know that Ginn can catch or Bess can catch and that Carpenter doesn't miss often...so it's not lack of talent IMO...

    the saints, colts and pats game we had a chance to either win or tie the game on a GW drive but some players weren't making plays...I think we get it together and make playoffs...you can call me crazy but I think we got it together...if not, then we should be ready next year..
     
  19. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    very good on the way to excellent in year two of the rebuilding
     
  20. anlgp

    anlgp ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A

    I think nearly beating the Colts and the Saints we're very close (as in next years draft) to being a good team based upon the list you have chris.

    Right now we're a neutral team who seems to be finding their execution on both sides of the ball.

    Last year we found the identity
    This year we practice executing that
    Next year we kick some solid ***.
    Year after we dominate
    Super Bowl?

    That's how I'd like to see it.
     
  21. Jt0323

    Jt0323 Fins Up! Luxury Box

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    id drop the packers from that same list
     
  22. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    we will contend in 2010
     
  23. Skeet84

    Skeet84 New Member

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    Right Now we ar average football team. Injuries starting to take there toll but schedule getting easier can't hurt us or at least i hope it doesn't
     
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  24. B.Sebo

    B.Sebo TV Mastermind Club Member

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    We are contending this year. We are a good team that knows who we are. We will make the playoffs and after that it is a crapshoot.
     
  25. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    We contended in 2008
     
  26. jetssuck

    jetssuck I hear Mandich's voice...

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    I think all things considered we haven't done badly.....could have done better but we've had to make adjustments on the fly and deal with some major changes, the latest being replacing our starting RB and cog to our offense.

    Personally, I'd like to have a do over of this season with Henne being named the starter at the beginning of TC. I think it would have been good for at least one more win.

    We won the games we should have and I think that should automatically puts us a little above average. What we do from here on out will depend on how much help the Robot gets. We're on a 5-2 streak with Henne and his only losses were to teams in the top 5 power ranking. Gotta be happy with that from a guy with 7 starts to his name..

    We still lack talent in some areas, we're dying for better LB's, WR's and a few other things. But we're still a dangerous team....I'm sure the Saints and Colts would agree with that.
     
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  27. Tiki

    Tiki New Member

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    We are an average team at this time. But an average team with a lot of young talent still being developed and seasoned. Agree, we won games we should have won. We lost some games we could have won, specifically the Chargers and the Falcons. And we hung in until nearly the end with some of the best teams, in games that we should have been blown out of.

    I agree, we need talent in some areas, WR for one. But I think that has been a part of the plan from the start. Year one, was all about the lines. Year two secondary, another QB for depth (wild cat) and WR last. Next year, WR will be at the top of the list, while adding other players where we are getting older or need upgrades.

    BTW, the wild cat in my opinion, once brought in and embraced, has always been a bridge until we can build and run a more conventional offense. I say that even with Pat White being drafted, nothing to say Pat can't be a good back up in a traditional offense. Henne has gotten a jump start on his on field development and JS, can't disagree about Henne starting from game one. But Penny did a really good job leading a young offense, so hard to bench that veteran leadership. But now we are ahead of what I believe is the curve due to the injury and Henne starting.

    BTW, JS, good to see you. Been awhile since we "debated" on either the old DD or DT boards. Hope all is well!
     
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  28. GISH

    GISH ~mUST wARN oTHERS~

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    You are what your record says you are. 5-5 is as average as they come.
     
  29. Paul 13

    Paul 13 Chaotic Neutral Staff Member

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    Giants... true, they have struggled recently, losing four in a row... however, they are historically a strong second half team, and I suspect they will beat the Falcons on Sunday.

    Cards...Cards are 6 and 3 and have not lost a game all season on the road... including at Jax and NY Giants. They will win their division easily and are coming off last year's SB run.... = good

    Eagles... can't say they won't make the playoffs... good. Any team that makes the playoffs should be considered good by default.

    Chargers... yes great... they've won four in a row, beating good teams in NY Giants and Philly... that makes them great...

    suck it... :tongue2::wink2:
     
  30. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    Cards..Jax and Giants are not good, they are winning their division by default again.

    Chargers...Giants and Philly aren't good

    :tongue2:
     
  31. jetssuck

    jetssuck I hear Mandich's voice...

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    Hey tiki, good to see you too......hope you've been well

    I think the big mystery right now is what to do with Pat White....are we really going to put him out there and keep playing college ball (Pistol). That formation hasn't looked impressive enough to warrant removing Henne, IMO.

    I still have a hard time buying the FO's story on White and them drafting him as a QB and blah blah blah......I mean come on, #44 in the draft as a QB prospect? There's no way, they had to have more than this on their mind for him. Hopefully a better plan than how it would appear...lol

    The guy has been in a decent number of plays and we've got him out into the open field with the ball all of once. If we ever want to get some value out of the pick, we need to figure out better ways of getting him into that position.

    And White throwing the football just doesn't make sense......we have that guy. And to be honest I'd rather see Thigpen as back up. I don't see Pat having much of a career unless he learns to catch a football. Which I would actually love to see and can't believe that it doesn't even seem to be on the table. That kid would wreak havoc out there just catching short passes and darting all over the field. We could use a guy like that right about now.
     
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  32. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

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    I'd say we're between average and good.....slightly above average. Being 5-5 says you're average, I agree, but we've had the toughest schedule in the league through 10 games and we gave the two current 9-0 teams their toughest test yet. Those 2 variables alone bump us up to slightly above average.

    And you had the Steelers as an average team. They're reigning Superbowl champs, they're 6-3 and their 3 losses are by a combined 12 points. They've beaten 2 very good teams already too. I'd say the Steelers are between good and elite this year.
     
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  33. Killerphins

    Killerphins The Finger

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    If we would have played a good football team last night we would have lost.

    That's the right answer. :up:
     
  34. rdhstlr23

    rdhstlr23 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Do good teams hold the trophy at the end of the year?
    Because that is what we'll be doing...
     
  35. Ross Ohlendorf

    Ross Ohlendorf Banned

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    lol please don't put this team in the same sentence as the current pittsburgh steelers
    not even close
     
  36. Ross Ohlendorf

    Ross Ohlendorf Banned

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    where's this easy schedule? jax,ne,hou,pitt looks like 4 teams with better records and better talent. lose 2 of those and the season is over.
    2 road games at tennessee and buffalo won't be easy, there are no easy games for this team in case you haven't been paying attention for the last 1 1/2+ seasons
     
  37. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

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    Who did that?
     
  38. finz810

    finz810 Season Ticket Holder

    I think we are a good team once we get a strong WR group.

    Dfense will be better next yr. if Peezy starts playin like he did against carolina and wake starts more. I think we'll be alright... the young'n CBs will be better next yr. and they already are competin with the best of the best
     
  39. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree with us being average but with talent to move up especially if we can upgrade our receiving targets.

    I don't agree that the WC was a bridge to conventional offense though. There were comments by and about Parcells since before he took over that he wanted to revolutionize the NFL game. He had some theories he wanted to implement that he thought would work in the NFL and he wanted the power to do that without anybody looking over his shoulder. Maybe it was the older guy reaching the end of his career who wants to leave his mark, I don't know. But I don't think it was a coincidence that Lee was hired as a coach. I think that he saw the Gator and Pistol offenses as the future of the NFL. I think that in his own way he was as excited about trying those as Gruden is.

    And I don't think the Pat White pick as a QB was a smoke screen. They took him that high b/c they want him to be that dual threat QB. I think they brought in Thigpen for the same reason. They double up on every position they see as important with the hope that one will hit.

    This doesn't mean that the conventional offense will be scrapped. On the contrary I think Henne is the biggest part of our future. But Parcells has always valued QBs with smaller egos and enough confidence to put the team first. I think he sees value in having 10% - 30% of the offense being unconventional (eventually) and having a starting QB that was okay with that.
     
  40. mroz

    mroz Rosen is a franchise QB Club Member

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    Without breaking it down by team IMO we are a good team. I don't think we are a great team like the Saints, Colt Pats but we are not too far behind them.
     

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