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Allen Hurns & Albert Wilson Opt Out

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Destroyer, Aug 4, 2020.

  1. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Still a decent amount of lives and COVID-19 still isn't a year old. It has plenty of time to kill more people
     
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  2. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He didnt die so its completely fine!
     
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  3. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

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    Yup. Protected by his peak athleticism with no lasting issues.
     
  4. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    He gained 12lbs during quarantine? Was he quarantined longer than 14 days? It doesn't say that he had any significant issues requiring hospitalization. He also had strep throat. Attributing this solely to covid isn't accurate, and neither the article nor the coaches are putting it on covid. The article mentions mental issues stemming from covid/strep.

    Seems a little odd.
     
  5. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    He had strep throat and GAINED 10-12 pounds and then he couldn't handle the workouts.

    Ok.

    Sounds like he is just out of shape and mentally checked out of football.
     
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  6. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    I mean did they even read the article? Lol
     
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  7. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Hospitalization is only when they think the person is going to die. You can still be knocked on your *** and have lung damage while not being hospitalized.
     
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  8. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    An athlete struggling to breathe and having breathing issues would be in the article.
     
  9. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    And 80% of the people who had Covid 19 didn‘t have any symptoms at all.
     
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  10. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Bacterial co-infections are not exactly a rare occurrence with Covid, and if he's unable to work out for an extended amount of time(which is very clearly the case here, and the driver of why he's getting the redshirt), he's going to end up dropping or gaining significant weight depending on his natural build.
     
  11. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    The article clearly mentions a mental hangup. It wasn't simply covid, or they wouldn't have brought up the weight gain, the strep, and the mental aspect.

    Attributing it to covid may be correct, or or may not be correct. But there seems to be more to it than covid.
     
  12. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Yes, and they are finding that they still have lung damage.
     
  13. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    literally said he had issues with his breathing.
     
  14. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Breathing would be an issue for an out of shape player who gained 12 lbs. Nothing in that article indicates that covid was the actual problem. It's why they talk about the weight gain, the strep, and the mental problems.

    We probably aren't going to agree.
     
  15. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It's certainly possible, but you're not coming from a place of credibility here when you're going through every possible contortion to determine that it wasn't actually a side effect of the pandemic virus with very well documented short and intermediate term complications for an athletic career.

    I mean we're about 5 posts away from someone citing Xavier Thomas as clearly having a phlegmatic composition and the skull proportions of a loafer.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2020
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  16. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I'm just saying, that the article points all these things. Don't you think they'd love to just point to covid? I'm not saying covid didn't play a part, of course it did. But how much? I mean, a guy gaining significant weight and being out of shape is going to cause issues with getting back into the swing of things. Especially if he is having depressive symptoms or other mental struggles.
     
  17. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    gaining 12 lbs for an athlete shouldn't keep them out of practice.
     
  18. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Agreed. But The article indicates that it was the strep throat, weight gain, and mental issue causing him struggle in workouts.
     
  19. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    The article also mentioned not being able to breathe well as for his struggle in workouts. Not being able to breathe well does not help your mental state, especially if you are an athlete.
     
  20. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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  21. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Sure. All I'm saying is, it appears that he had covid, didn't need hospitalization. Gained 12lbs. Went to camp, had strep, had mental struggle, and struggled to be successful. It seems to me, from reading it, that there was far more at work than his prior covid diagnosis.

    You see it differently, that's fine.
     
  22. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    I think that many if these NFL athletes will contract the Rona (who's real name should be posted but the cancel culture objects) if they played or not. In their everyday lives NFL players have caught it. They are not very risk adverse in their actions IMO. They will be tested constantly and be diagnosed quicker if they are exposed then "out in the real world". And who's to say they didn't catch it outside of the NFL workplace. THere is a risk in everything we do. That's why the lightning strike and car comparisons come up. While some dismiss it as apples/oranges the representation is that there is inherent risk in everyday things that we do. We dismiss these as "acceptable" risks in our normal lives. So if you look at the risk of the Rona for a specific age group and do what the data tells you, it tells you that the risk profile is way lower than the everyday life risks that we dismiss on a daily basis. For some ZERO is the only number. Great opt out. That's your right. I personally know 2 people that are so paralyzed that they won't leave their houses and have had mental breakdowns over the fear of the Rona.

    Turn off the news and stop obsessing about "the numbers" IMO.

    Or live your life in fear and end up worse than the actual reality of what the virus is.
     
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  23. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I mean, the bottom line to me is that one death or hospitalization would be too much to justify a frivolous and unnecessary thing like football when said event is entirely preventable, despite how entertaining it might be.

    The comparisons to car crashes, swimming, ect are logically flawed because those things cant be spread from person to person unknowingly.

    So if the NFL can guarantee full safety, go ahead. If not I wont blame any player who opts out.
     
  24. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

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    And that answers my question.... How?
     
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  25. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    It shows you that you have much higher chances of dying by things that you do everyday, like eating, than a .00000002 or whatever chance from drinking there drink, but it doesn't stop you from doing them.
     
  26. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    They are risks you take everyday. That is the comparison. It's about risk assessment. You drive a car you expose yourself to the risk of X% of injury or death. NFL players exposure to the virus carries X% of risk for injury or death. They decide on if that risk is worth it. I go to work everyday because I need to get paid. Most of these guys also need to get paid. You look at it as entertainment. Many doing the sport and supporting the sport look at it as a livelihood. Too many are too quick to take away someone's livelihood because " the bottom line to me is that one death or hospitalization would be too much". Who are you to decide for them??
     
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  27. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    My statement was simply that I dont blame anyone who wishes to opt out.

    I'm not sure how you got me taking peoples livelihoods away.



    Lastly, Unfortunately, if you dont understand the inherent differences in the risks you listed, I dont think anything will change your mind. The differences are so basic and plain to see, and unlike an exaggerated figure that has ruined the world with his preachings, I cant cure the blind.
     
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  28. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    That is what it is supposed to show? If it is it did a terrible job.
     
  29. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think there's really a lot of unnecessary posturing and emotional bargaining and deal-making over people not wanting to be called or thought of as an ******* because they're OK with people potentially dying for their entertainment(provided, of course that there's no additional personal risk).

    It's unnecessary because a lot of the arguments here aren't really proving much of a fig leaf to hide behind- just say it. Like if that's actually what you believe, you'd presumably have done better research into the risks, etc. and so on.
     
  30. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    That video, in conjunction with the question about drinking the drink that was asked. There video just shows likelihood of being killed by various things.
     
  31. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    It is different. I don't walk outside and get cancer and die.

    There is a HUGE difference between chance of dying of something while living your life, or chance of dying of something due to a specific action.

    In this video the chances of someone dying of Russian Roulette would be very low, however, if I do Russian Roulette it would be 1 in 6.

    That video didn't work in conjunction with the question.
     
  32. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Well I think you're being intentionally obtuse on this. It gives, for instance, the likelihood of choking on your food, or dying in a car accident. Both of those are a greater probability than dying or being injured in the drink example. And those are two things you do everyday.
     
  33. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    These are their livelihoods. They need to pay their bills. Most of these guys aren't rich. They got bills to pay just like all the other support personnel. How a group of individuals think it is up to them to determine the risk level people should be taking and advocate to strip them of their livelihoods, be it in sports or in business, is beyond selfish.
     
  34. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    The feeling is mutual.

    Saying, "Here, you have a 1 in 10 chance of dying if you drink this drink" the response, "Well I have a 1 in 6 chance of dying in cancer throughout my lifetime" is not a good response.

    The chance of dying in a car crash is 1 in 103, that is because 1 in 103 people will die in a car crash. That does not mean that out of 103 times someone drives their car, someone dies.
     
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  35. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    [​IMG]

    It's the same false dilemma as when applied to football players. You can't purposefully engineer a scenario to compel people to risk their lives for money and then hold your hands up and say that scenario was a naturally occurring state of affairs that couldn't be helped if someone dies.
     
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  36. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Except they CAN opt out. No one is COMPELLING them to do something. Except the side that says we will NOT ALLOW you to make a living if you so chose to take the risk. Try again.
     
  37. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    In my home, my wife/I have been ultra careful to protect the home and my 85 year old dad. But my teens are a different story and they disappear every chance they get. Daily we're running other teens off since they stopped by "because they're bored"...and they don't care about the virus for the exact quotes you shared in another part of this thread.

    My 18 year old had COVID and she thought she was going to die from not being able to breathe...and then she was fine a week later. And don't get me wrong, we're thrilled that she's okay, but her attitude towards this could have taken another family member. My dad was released from our hospital a few hours ago; we honestly didn't think he'd come home at all but it turns out he didn't have COVID....yet he was on the COVID floor for three days until his tests came back negative. Will he have COVID in a week from now? Who knows.

    The point is, you can't say "Well, you look well and so do I, so there's zero risk." That's how the virus keeps spreading and the NFL won't be able to use that philosophy....elite athletes or not.
     
  38. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I understand what it means. The point is, there are assumed risks that we all act under all the time. Covid is new and abnormal, so it's scary. I think down the road or will be no scarier, for the average person, than the flu.
     
  39. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Prayers for your family, Key.
     
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  40. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    There's still ultimately a moral culpability for people beyond the individual even in a scenario where someone is fully informed and making a conscious choice of the risks. If you're paying for, facilitating, or even watching someone play russian roulette with fully informed consent and understanding it doesn't suddenly become an ethically clean transaction, and it's still something that bears consideration in the context of the NFL.

    And again, putting it fully in the context of the players is more than a little bit disingenuous as well. If the guy making $15 dollars an hour to do stadium security to make ends meet ends up on a respirator, or Chan Gailey ends up getting murked because it was his last shot at a job he loved doing or whatever, it's not any better.
     
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