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A case For Philly

Discussion in 'Other NFL' started by anlgp, Jun 3, 2009.

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  1. anlgp

    anlgp ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A

    by me.

    The case for The Eagles: Andy Reid, Donovan McNabb, Jim Johnsons Defense, The Super Bowl & Subsequent Drafts, The Immediate Past (2008 NFC Championship Game) & The Immediate Future (2009 draft, offseason acquisitions).

    A recent history:

    Andy Reid took over the Eagles on January 11th, 1999. That same year he drafted with the second overall pick Donovan McNabb who was destined to become his franchise Quarterback holding team records in: career wins, pass attempts, pass completions, passing yards and passing touchdowns. Since that time the Eagles have put together four consecutive NFCE division championship runs (2001-2004) and five NFC Championship games (2001-2004, 2008) and one super bowl appearance (Super Bowl XXXIX).

    Of course their defense lead by Defensive Coordinator Jim Johnson may have something to do with this. Jim Johnsons defense in Philadelphia has been incredibly succesful. Here are some numbers between 2000- and 2007:

    342 sacks in 8 years.

    34.3% in 3rd down efficiency

    43% red zone touchdown percentage

    and 17.6 fewest points per game

    21 points or fewer in 2001 for all 16 games and 34 straight games with 21 points or less.

    1999 - 46 turnovers (NFL best), team record 5 INTs returned for TDs.

    Has produced 26 Pro Bowl selections (7 for Brian Dawkins alone).

    Super Bowl XXXIX & What Went Wrong Numerically:

    *everything NE did is in ( )'s

    The eagles had 3 fewer first downs at 21 (against 24), more turnovers: 2 fumbles, losing 1 (against 1 fumble and 1 fumble loss) 3 interceptions thrown (against none), less time of possesion 28:23 (against 31:37 which is only 3:14 seconds), threw less completions 21 (against 10, a 11 completion difference), ran for 45 yards (against 112 a 67 yards difference), less rushing attempts at 17 (against 28 which amounts to 11 less rushing attempts) and 2.6 yards per rush (against 4.1 a 1.5 yard difference). They gave up 4 sacks for 33 yards (against 2 sacks for 17) which is a 2 sack 16 yard difference.

    They had better third down efficiency 9-16 (against 4-12), more total yards at 369( against 331) a 38 yard difference, more passing yards at 324 (against 219) a 105 yard difference, less penalties called against them at 3 for 35 yards (against 7 for 47), which is 4 penalties and 12 yards difference.

    So the Eagles:

    lost the first down battle, lost the turnover battle, lost the time of possession battle, threw less completions, ran less, tried to run for less, gave up more sacks for more yards.

    but

    had a better third down efficiency, more total yards, more passing yards, less penalties called against them.

    ---

    of course stats and numbers don't tell you how hard each player did or didn't work, assignments they made or missed or how well the other team did against them on pure talent.

    the biggest factors of the game (moving the chains, keeping on top of turnovers and time of possessions and completions -- which is huge for a majority passing offense --) that could have gone wrong for the eagles went wrong.

    what did they need more of to reclaim a birth in the superbowl and perhaps a win? more push on the ground? more completions? defense? a better offensive line?

    Let's take a look at the drafts (A * indicates they're still with the team):

    2006-2008 drafts:

    2006
    DT, Broderick Bunkley*
    OT, Winston Justice*
    LB, Chris Gocong*
    G, Max Jean-Gilles*
    WR, Jason Avant*
    WR, Jeremy Bloom
    LB, Omar Gaither*
    DT, LaJuan Ramsey

    8 picks, 6 with team = 2 DT, 2 WR, 2 LB, 2 OL (T/G) (4 on offense, defense)

    2007

    QB, Kevin Kolb*
    DE, Victor Abiamiri*
    LB, Stewart Bradley*
    RB, Tony Hunt
    CB, CJ Gaddis
    TE, Brent Celek*
    CB, Rashad Barksdale
    RB, Nate Ilaoa
    LB, Akeem Jordan*

    9 picks, 5 with team = 1 QB, 1 DE, 1 TE, 2 RB, 2 CB, 2 LB (5 on defense, 4 on offense)

    2008

    DT, Trevor Laws*
    WR, DeSean Jackson*
    DE, Bryan Smith*
    OG, Mike McGlynn*
    S, Quintin Demps*
    CB, Jack Ikegwuonou*
    OT, Mike Gibson*
    LB, Joe Mays*
    DE, Andrew Studebaker
    OT, King Dunlap*

    10 picks, 9 with team = 1 DT, 1 WR, 1 G, 1 LB, 1 S, 1 CB, 2 OT, 2 DE (6 on offense, 4 on defense)

    27 picks Total 7 picks not with team Draft Between 2006-2008 14 on offense 13 on defense = 3 DT (bunkley, ramsey, laws), 3 WR (avant, bloom, jackson), 5 LB (gocong, gaither, bradley, jordan, mays), 2 G (Jean-Gilles, McGlynn), 1 S (Demps), 3 CBs (Gaddis, Barksale, Ikegwuonou), 3 OT (Justice, Gibson, Dunlap), 3 DE (Abiamiri, Smith, Studebaker), 1 QB (Kolb), 1 TE (Celek), 2 RB (Ilaoa, Hunt).

    With Most Important Being Offense only slightly as a total and Linebacker by position by two picks. To me the numbers from the Super Bowl and the numbers since then until last year make sense. The offense had more trouble in the Bowl than the Defense did.

    These were enough to get the Eagles to the 2008 NFC Championship Game. They lost 32-25. The game was very close.

    The Immediate Future:

    2009 FA Acquisitions, Re-Signings, Etc.

    FB Leonard Weaver <-
    S Rashad Baker,
    S Sean Jones <-
    OT Stacy Andrews <-
    WR Hank Baskett,
    C/G Nick Cole,
    LB Tank Daniels
    CB Joselio Hanson
    OT Jason Peters <-

    2009 NFL Draft.

    WR Jeremy Maclin <-
    RB Lesean McCoy <-
    TE Cornelius Ingram <-
    CB Victor Harris <-
    OT Fenuki Tupou
    WR Brandon Gibson
    G Paul Fanaika
    OLB Moise Fokou
    CB Ellis Hobbs (traded for on draft day) <-

    These arrows ( <- ) I have placed there because I think those are the players that are (in the case of Peters, Andrews, Weaver, Jones, Hobbs) or could (Maclin, McCoy, Ingram, Harris) help the eagles make a push deep into the playoffs or help them become super bowl bound again.

    Conclusion:

    The Eagles have consistently put themselves in position to win it all going to 5 NFC Championship Games. They dominated the East from 2001-2004. They have the QB who has won the most for the Eagles under contract. They draft incredibly well in terms of 7 players not making the team from the past couple years drafts & this past year picked up huge FA acquisitions. I think they've added where they needed to since the super bowl, especially this last off-season. If the pieces fall in place (and there are quite a few that need to do so including but not limited to: draft picks & FA acquisitions becoming a success, a balanced offense and the new co-ordinator for Jim Johnson coming in and making the best use of his talented defense) they could make a serious push.

    The Eagles get a lot of criticism. A lot of people say Andy Reid and Donovan McNabb aren't worth their weight in gold (factoring in Reid alone that's quite a bit) but looking over these numbers they've attempted to do things right and despite losing championship games and the super bowl have put themselves in position to win. You have to ask yourself: If they had won that super bowl would the thoughts surrounding the philadelphia eagles current FO, QB & team be a little different? Is the criticism too harsh?
     
  2. TiP54

    TiP54 Bad Reputation

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    You get a "thanks" just for writing all that
     
  3. anlgp

    anlgp ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A

    Did you read it :lol:
     
  4. TiP54

    TiP54 Bad Reputation

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    More of a yes than a no :D
     
  5. sking29

    sking29 What it takes to be cool

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    Well that post certainly deserves more than one thanks.

    Personally I think the Eagles are the top team in the NFC if, and its a big if, Westbrook can stay healthy. Their division is easily winnable for them as without Burress the Giants are just not the same (the last 4 games of their season last year proved that), the Redskins can be good but not better than the Eagles because the Eagles have a better team. Now I think the Cowboys probably have overall the most talented team in the division but they always find a way to fall apart down the stretch where Philly gets stronger. The Eagles are just plain impressive to me and I can't think of one team besides the Vikings with Favre (AP can keep him healthy enough to last the season) that could challenge them.
     
  6. anlgp

    anlgp ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A

    :lol: at Westbrook being healthy. He has had an injury every year of his career. There have been a few seasons where he has played injured but every year he has had one. Usually with season ending results. He just went under the knife a few days ago to remove some bone spurs in his ankle. The good thing about that is much like our own Donald Thomas his injury happened now as opposed to august. I think the Giants defense is enough to be able to give Philly a run for their money but in the NFCE they're the only competition IMO.
     
  7. sking29

    sking29 What it takes to be cool

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    :lol: or not, it has bit them in the past, how many SB rings do they have in the last decade again. :wink2:

    I know his injury past hence why the "big if" part I included but if they are left with McCoy and Booker they will be in trouble because they do struggle when they are a pass happy offense. :yes:
     
  8. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    McCoy is a good cutback runner, very light on his feet, good vision and has good hands. Really thought he should have gone higher than he did.
     
  9. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

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    Eagles are that one team I legitamently like. Not as much as the 'Phins, of course.
     
  10. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I like Philly's chances, they've been awfully close and this may be their best team yet. I think Reid and McNabb do get a little bit of a bum rap, they've been really successful and people act as though they are bums holding their team back. The Eagles should have drafted another RB and some Wrs years ago, seems like they have all of the pieces in place right now..
     
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  11. anlgp

    anlgp ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A

    I have thought they have banked on westbrook and their defensive play for far too long. The offseason acqisitions this year is really what has me thinking that as long as they all step up and/or play to their ability that Philly has a legit shot at this thing.
     
  12. Sethdaddy8

    Sethdaddy8 Well-Known Member

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    i hate hate hate the iggles, living just a few miles outside the city. dont get me wrong, i love the city, but the iggle fans are low brow d-bags, and a mar on the game. my thoughts, the fans do not deserve this team. i really really like andy reid. think mcnabb is a great player and class act. love westbrook. loved b-dawk while he was here. those fans do not deserve this team and these players. i hope and wish Sparano has a similar tenure to that of Reid's. because the luck factor is what it is...being good is all you can really hope for. and these guys have been really good for almost a decade straight, and thats hard to do. you just need to be good and in the mix, and then hope fate falls your way.

    nice job gap!
     
  13. Regan21286

    Regan21286 MCAT's, EMT's, AMCAS, ugh

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    Good writeup. I personally am a fan of Donovan McNabb especially since his transition from running QB to refined dropback passer. I like the signing of Sean Jones to replace Dawkins but Jones doesn't quite bring the same leadership and energy Dawkins had. This is a team that's managed to avoid crumbling apart. Really just one tall WR, healthy TE, and maybe a LB away from really looking dominating. Granted the last 6'2 and up WR was a headcase but when they had him for most of a season, they went to the SB.
     
  14. anlgp

    anlgp ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A

    i grew up close enough to philly (newark, delaware) to be born and bread of the same fan mentality. i am a dolphins fan, make no mistake about it, but the same way i treat the dolphins is the way a lot of fans around here act. they expect their team to perform on sundays and criticize when they don't. that's me to a t. there's a lot that don't appreciate what the birds have done but there are fans (you listen to 610 WIP by any chance?) who were VERY upset that Dawkins hit FA. They do love their players and their team and I think they are just upset that they haven't won the SB and I think it's because at least in 2004 that they thought (expected?) that they had the team to do it. It's hard to argue with these numbers; they've consistently been put in positions to succeed. I think they're just tired of not finally getting over that final hump and some may not be able to see the forest thru the trees. Once McNabb is gone and they're in the hunt for a QB they'll realize what they had. Same for Reid.

    Yeah living around here when Dawk hit FA and went to Denver they talked about it on the radio for at least two to three weeks guaranteed. Fans. Were. Pissed. Some were talking about abandoning the team. And it's not just because of dawkins. Like I was just writing about a lot of them are tired of seeing them get there only to fail. They're tired of Reid. They're tired of Laurie (the owner. who won't fire/replace reid). Their team treats veterans like **** IMO. They expect certain things out of players for a certain time and they "sell" them right before they believe they won't get any more out of them. Case in point. Dawkins, Thomas, Etc. and these are just the players I know about. Sheldon Brown comes to mind. Lito Sheppard. Correl Buckhalter (who I thought did a decent enough job stepping in for Westbrook).
     
  15. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

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    Quite frankly, if I was Donovan McNabb, I'd move on to another team already. Quite frankly, I think it's sad when I, a fan of another team, cheer for the Eagles more than the fans whose favorite word seems to be "BOOOOOOOO".

    No offense to any Eagles fans on this site.
     
  16. Regan21286

    Regan21286 MCAT's, EMT's, AMCAS, ugh

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    I don't want to agree with TO but they certainly treat players more like property than people. Part of the business I guess and certainly a reason Eagles are still a good team. Though I do wish they had some player loyalty since having fan support for retaining players sells just as much tickets as wins.
     
  17. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Philly fans are awful, and some of the most idiotic fans on the planet. I listen to them all of the time on the radio shows they all think they know a ton about football and show they know next to nothing whenever they open their mouths. The team they've had has been really good but not good enough. McNabb and Reid havent' been holding back some all time great team from a title, they've played as well as their talent will let them. They have a better all around team this year. It is strange that the fans their seem to hate Reid and McNabb despite them being amongst the most successful at their positions over the last 10 years.
     
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