2013 NFL Draft Thread

Geno Smith is definitely looking a lot better this year than he did last year. He's becoming pretty interesting.

 

Matt Scott is a guy I need to catch up with. The QBs are largely known commodities. I don't feel like I'm finding out anything new about Tyler Wilson or Matt Barkley. Logan Thomas I think will just need to go back to school and try and get some better chemistry with players around him because he's clearly not feeling it with this group. He's got some maturation to go through. Geno Smith is certainly taking a big step up but Landry Jones isn't, nor is Tyler Bray who has yet to convince me of anything. E.J. Manuel certainly is looking like the same inconsistent guy and I'm not buying the Collin Klein hype train.

Matt Scott is a nice little wild card.

 

Scott has a good arm but needs a lot of work with footwork, namely hip rotation and stepping through.

 

Dysert and Renfree intrigue me. Dysert needs to play smarter and Renfree is a smart guy; just checks down too much. Nassib initially intrigued me but not really a fan after a longer look.

 

Just saw that Kiper has Hunter rated ahead of Keenan Allen and Robert Woods. I have to disagree there. I've seen quite a few UT games, and Hunter seems like the 3rd best of those three to me. Am I crazy?

Starting to like Allen the best of that group the more I see of him.

 

To me, Justin Hunter is all about potential. I hate to bring out this comparison because it probably says more than I'm trying to have it say, but he does remind me a little of Jason Pierre-Paul. Hunter has a significant body with significant ability and skills. But he hasn't fully grown into it yet, is still under-developed as a football player, and let's keep in mind first year back from a bad ACL tear is no picnic. That'll throw a lot of players off their game.

You're absolutely right that if you just watch him play football you're more impressed with Keenan Allen and Robert Woods. Some are even more impressed with Hunter's teammate Cordarelle Patterson. In the past Da'Rick Rogers has certainly looked like he could outshine Hunter on occasions. But Hunter is all about the long term view, much as Jason Pierre-Paul was. Sometimes that kind of thinking can bite you in the ***, but sometimes it's the right way to go. There's no alchemy here, no automatic check boxes that when checked guarantee success.

 

I'd take Hunter over Woods on sheer talent & potential alone..... but not ahead of Allen, at least not for our offense.

 

Same here.

 

Would you take Woods over Rogers [if his troubles appear in the rear view]? I don't think I would TBH.

 

I'm really turned off by what I hear of Rogers' attitude. It would take a lot to get me convinced to accept him. A precipitous drop on draft weekend would help.

 

Is it something that sounds ongoing?

 

I'm watching the replay of ND-Miami to check out the TE factory...... and I gotta say, it's a sad sad day in football land when Notre Dame allows their helmets to be ruined by no longer being the iconic solid gold.

The whole uniform looks like utter crap TBH..... a convoluted cluster****. From one profile it appears mostly ND, but from the opposite profile it looks almost like Missouri. They wanna play football... or enter an artsy Paris fashion show?

 

.... plus the gold paint design looks like something belonging on a bass fishing lure...... or cousin Eddy's tenement on wheel's linoleum bathroom floor.

 

I'm iffy on Terrence Williams from the look I had of him earlier this season and all of last year, but I need to watch him again. He just drops too many simple passes.

 

Yeah but those two aren't the same talents, even with the criticism's of Jones coming out. And I've learned if he drops passes in college, he drops passes in the NFL.

 

IMO, I know he's 3 inches shorter but Victor Cruz. A great possession receiver with big play capability but not quite like the NFL's elite 5 or 6 guys.
Even the way he can be used both inside & outside.... as well as short, intermediate, deep, and quick passes behind the LOS. Similar looking athleticism, suddenness, balance, body control, physicality, and ability to play the ball...... although I think Cruz has a tad more suddenness & athleticism on Allen, but then again he's not 6'3.... granted he plays like he's 6'2.

 

IDK. Only thing I can think of is perhaps some of the drafniks believe Bailey's big play potential is more limited to the college game where as perhaps Austin's translates better. Not saying that's how I necessarily feel but just trying to come up with an answer.

 

Right now I think so, too..... or at least Bailey potentially seeing a greater number of snaps.

 

Here's what I like about Terrance Williams. He's a perimeter specialist. That seems pretty rare nowadays. Everyone loves the slot players and they're getting very popular. That's not him. In fact for whatever reason he seems a lot more likely to drop the ball when he's working the middle or the slot. He's got the run after catch ability to play there, because ultimately he's a very gifted runner. But why play him there when you can get much cheaper and much less physically gifted guys to play there, be more reliable on the catch, and be just as productive if not more?

I've talked before about how Art Briles' extremely wide splits with his receivers create almost a CFL like field for his offense. I think this helps the QB and certainly creates opportunities in the middle of the field. But it puts a lot of pressure on a receiver that's working in a more compressed space between the coverage and the sideline. You just have to be more impressive to win there, IMO. He does that. He negotiates the compressed space between the coverage and the sideline very nicely, bolstered by his gifted pure running skills. I think this all bodes very well for him and he'll be a great role player in the NFL. Maybe he won't be a guy that you move all around the field to try and create mismatches, touchdowns and other big plays, but there's virtue in a guy that will be out on the perimeter and scare the bajesus out of a corner that tries to stay with him on a go route, and oh by the way he's also nice on the comeback, the out, etc...and is perfectly comfortable with the sideline and compressed spaces. That's a valuable asset and just how productive he will be will probably just depend on your quarterback and what kind of offense you're running.

I think he's like a faster Brian Hartline, sort of. Hartline drops the ball a lot too, ya know.

 

I think I would put Stedman Bailey ahead of Terrance Williams, because Bailey has some fearless and physical qualities, plus better hands, to be a more versatile football player over the middle and moved around the field (even though he's currently used as a perimeter specialist). But then, I think Terrance Williams is a safer bet in terms of purely threatening the perimeter and edges of a defense.

I still have Keenan Allen and Marquess Wilson atop this class or potential class of receivers. Justin Hunter would be below them. I love DeAndre Hopkins and think he will get open at the next level and catch a lot of footballs but the explosive qualities might not be there for him, similar to a Brian Hartline that way. It's a little tougher to say on a Robert Woods relative to Stedman Bailey and Terrance Williams...but I'm leaning toward Woods and Hopkins below Bailey and Williams.

I would currently not put a Cordarelle Patterson above any of those guys. I think he's kind of soft, to be honest with you. He could have trouble getting off the press at the next level. Da'Rick Rogers I have trouble with from an attitude/history standpoint. Kenny Stills I have issues with from a body control and body language standpoint. Tavon Austin will never play out on the perimeter and his impact could be capped because of that. I've always had some issues with Cobi Hamilton.

Quinton Patton is someone I've got to get a better grip on but I haven't necessarily been overly impressed other than with knowing he beat the tar out of a pretty good corner in Terry Hawthorne. I still think Aaron Mellette could be a pretty good player.

 

Call me crazy but I don't see much if any difference between Dee Milliner and Jordan Poyer other than one plays for Bama. Kid's a pure football player.... and a sparkplug to boot. IMO he'd be a great fit opposite Sean Smith.

 

As far as CBs go, I like Justin Gilbert of Oklahoma State and Xavier Rhodes of Florida State. Rhodes in particular seems like a guy that fits into Kevin Coyle's scheme fairly well and has some size to him.

 

I like Johnthan Banks. Was not sold on him entirely last year but he's gotten better this year with technique. Very good. Good call earlier, Roninfin4.

 

I'm not sure I see it in Gilbert. IMO he takes a back seat to Poyer.
Agree on Rhodes and him being a good fit.
As far as guys we could potentially get in the 2nd round, I don't see anyone better than Poyer ATM.

 

I think I also mentioned David Amerson in that same post with Banks. Oops.

Dee Milliner seems good every time I watch him, but there's been a stretch in every game I've watched him where he looks like he lacks the adequate foot speed. Do you think some of his success is attributed more to the scheme than his actual talent. He strikes me as sort of a Charles Tillman type of CB.

Xavier Rhodes I think could be a nice fit in Coyle's scheme. I think he's been over-aggressive at times (Clemson game) and it's cost him, but I think he's got good physical tools to work with.

Thoughts on Justin Gilbert? Physically he reminds me a little bit of Chris Culliver, though I don't think he's on that level just now in playing ability.

 

An interesting video of Gilbert. Played against some pretty good QBs in 2011, including Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oO70JyLbXM&feature=related

Seems to have pretty good ball skills. I like the fact he can play off and in press. The play that starts at the 2:22 mark in the video, Baylor tries a double-move on him, and he does a nice job recognizing it and shows good recovery speed. He's a pretty athletic guy and shows some good ball skills.

Here's another video of Gilbert. A little more lengthy with his 2011 games against Oklahoma, Texas, and Baylor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaNRbJbmyNk

 

Anyone see this nifty little catch & run by Da'Rick Rogers vs Oregon.

[video=youtube;26UYATqb7ZI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26UYATqb7ZI[/video]



I watched his 16 minute press conference upon joining Tenn Tech, and he doesn't come across as a punk.

 

Sadly, he will always be remembered for blowing Natl Champ bid for WV and Rich Rod; and his nemesis/kryptonite is PITT....jury is still out.

but dang fun to watch for sure...

 

I'm not saying he's a bad player, just IMO Poyer has quicker & better feet, quicker reaction ability, and slightly better ball skills & decisiveness..... but there's still a lot of season to play.

 

Not many videos out there on Poyer. There aren't too many Pac-12 games in Cincinnati unless it's USC. I'll have to look at Poyer more. I was impressed with his quickness. Made me think of Cortland Finnegan. His tackling didn't impress me; seems like he goes for the big hit more than a sure tackle, but he was around the ball and created turnovers.

 

Not many videos out there on Poyer. There aren't too many Pac-12 games in Cincinnati unless it's USC. I'll have to look at Poyer more. I was impressed with his quickness. Made me think of Cortland Finnegan. His tackling didn't impress me; seems like he goes for the big hit more than a sure tackle, but he was around the ball and created turnovers.

 

Poyer is not consistent vs. run. Can sometimes be really, really bad. Like Darius Butler was coming out.

 

Tillman ran a 4.49 coming out, so he's not lacking much. Regarding scheme vs. talent, I think its both.

I haven't seen Gilbert. I don't usually watch JRs until they declare.

I saw mention of the Quinton Patton from Louisiana Tech. Want to see more but I like him so far. Reminds me a bit of Brandon Lloyd.

 

I mentioned Quinton Patton earlier as a guy I need to get a better grip on, that didn't necessarily overly impress me from a size/speed/physicality standpoint, but whom I watched beat the tar out of Terry Hawthorne (whom I view to be a good corner prospect). I think Alen also mentioned he needed to see more of him but that he liked him and reminded him of Brandon Lloyd.

I've been taking a little bit closer look at the guy and I have to say I'm pretty impressed. Part of me is still conflicted because ultimately you can see that he's not got blazing speed to take a guy deep and blow by him, nor does he have physical size or strength to break tackles and power through things. But he's also not slow, nor is he weak by any means. It's that classic middle of the road type physical prowess. What he does have is extremely quick feet, great pad level, good enough size and frame at about 6'2" and 200 lbs, a knack for finding and adjusting to the ball in the air, good body language, the ability to move and rotate his body, a quick mind, uses his hands and shoulders to create separation, kills people in blocking whenever possible...basically all the things you want in a receiver. Patton just has those quick feet, strong legs to move around and create separation, reminds me of Davone Bess that way. But he's taller than Bess and has better speed, so he's exponentially more scary running deeper routes than Davone...though obviously not a Mike Wallace, Calvin Johnson or Vincent Jackson that way. But the important thing to me is, he can score touchdowns. I think that's something we need. He goes on the list.

I don't know that you hold his being a JUCO guy against him as I've heard he's a good person off the field. You go to his college profile and the very first thing you see is a quote from Johnathan Banks on October 28th, 2011 that says that Quinton Patton is the best WR he's faced since he's been at Mississippi State, that he's faced some good ones in the SEC but Patton is the most complete. And the way Terry Hawhorne got taken to school by Patton, you'd have to wonder if he (now) agrees with Banks. He strikes me as the kind of guy that might spark a little disagreement between our personnel people (who seem very size/weight/speed/numbers oriented) and our coaching staff (who very classically seem more about 'football players').

Just my two cents.