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Soldier mom refuses deployment to care for baby

Discussion in 'Lounge' started by unluckyluciano, Nov 17, 2009.

  1. Firesole

    Firesole Season Ticket Holder

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    if you're not a registered voter, no. :no:

    Maybe I should put it a different way. I see looking back at that post and see how it sounds:

    If you haven't served this country, I don't believe you should feel like you are in a position to criticize her or the military for how they are handling the situation.

    Some of you guys are not just "simply talking about" the situation. She's been called a turd, and basically being branded a coward in this thread. I don't see any need for that. Just because one doesn't deploy overseas does not mean she isn't serving her country, even if she is "just a cook".
     
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  2. HolliFinFan

    HolliFinFan Not a Face Painter Luxury Box

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    Thanks, Muck, for being a voice of reason. I have really tried to be "good" since my self-imposed ban from the PoFo, but I was reeling :hi5:
     
    dolphindebby likes this.
  3. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    If the military was a private company or we lived in a totalitarian state, I would agree with you.
     
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  4. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    muck totally stole what i was going to say. REP ME TOO!
     
  5. Crappy Tipper

    Crappy Tipper AKA Hero13

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    As a United States citizen a taxpayer and a registered voter you bet I get to have an opinion on this.
     
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  6. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    as someone who lives off your taxes, thank you.
     
  7. Crappy Tipper

    Crappy Tipper AKA Hero13

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    You're very welcome.

    :up:
     
  8. dolfan32323

    dolfan32323 ty xphinfanx

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    I'm not saying she isn't at fault. It is entirely her responsibility to find somebody to look after her child when she is deployed. But how many parents would willingly put their children in foster care? Again, she isn't right but it's just a shame for the child.
     
  9. 1armychick

    1armychick New Member

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    Which is EXACTLY why I called you a closed-minded idiot. You didn't just attack this one woman for being a single parent; your statement attacked ALL single parent women. Now you are basing an assumption on lack of data. Before you go suggesting ANYTHING, do a little research so you don't sound like a babbling idiot.

    And FYI, I'm a single mother and I don't receive ANY benefits I don't earn. My roommate, also a single mother, doesn't either.
     
  10. 1armychick

    1armychick New Member

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    And she did and her FCP (Family Care Plan for you non-military types) fell through. So as a responsibility, her first line supervisor should have started the appropriate channels to get her chaptered or to get her help. There are plenty of avenues for childcare; foster care shouldn't have even been a consideration.

    So, if she's prochoic, and she decided to keep the baby... Interesting dynamics in this story. Bottom line-the system failed yet again.
     
  11. 1armychick

    1armychick New Member

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    I also find it interesting that you don't even mention single fathers. You singled out women altogether. There are single fathers out there that live on the system, too. Why didn't you include them in this discussion?
     
  12. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    you leave opie out of this!!!



    oh you meant fathers that live off the system and raise their kids. my bad.
     
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  13. TrueDolFan

    TrueDolFan Minion of Satan

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    Now the REAL reason for your attacks come out. Just because you aren't able to keep a man around you longer than it takes for him to impregnate you, don't take it out on ME, lady.

    Hate all men if you want, just don't insult me if I disagree with you. :up:

    I'm glad you and your roommate aren't looking for handouts from the government. You are not a turd.

    Because the amount of single fathers leeching off the system is FAR FAR less than the amount of mothers. Those that do are even bigger turds. Why? Because they're men and I hold them to a higher standard when it comes to working and paying their own way.
     
  14. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    Yep especially those who are raped and choose to keep the child, truly a burden...
     
  15. Tone_E

    Tone_E Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Dude, I've been following this thread and have mixed feelings, but your bolded comment and view on single mothers is ABSURD!!

    Did you ever think that so many single mothers need assistance because of dead beat fathers, and that men play a part in this? It takes two to tango, and you are way out of line for patronizing the women only.

    You have your opinions, and I'm entitled to mine. Unfortunately, because of the TOS, I can't say what I think of the views you shared in all your posts, and ultimately, in my opinion again, a poor reflection of yourself as well.
     
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  16. texasPHINSfan

    texasPHINSfan New Member

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    as a person who was a parent in the military that was deployed, i can only speak from this point of view. the military has wonderful programs in place for these circumstances, and certainly if you legitimately cannot care for a dependent, you can get out of deployment orders.

    without knowing the entire story, i'm inclined to think there is more to this than is being relayed, and i'm leaning toward the fault being on the mother here - you think she is the first single parent with deployment orders?

    the military does not deploy single parents with no plan in place prior, and they will not place children in foster care for deployments - i do not know who is feeding this incorrect information.
     
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  17. TrueDolFan

    TrueDolFan Minion of Satan

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    To YOU it's absurd. To me it's not.

    Women who are divorced and have custody of their children are not the people I'm talking about. IMO, there's a huge difference between them and women who were never married, and were never planning to be married.

    I believe that NOBODY should be PROUD of being an unwed single mother.

    Unfortunately our society has gone from viewing unwed single mothers as reprobates to viewing them as honorable. To me, it's pathetic.

    Like you said, you have your opinions, and I have mine. The difference between us is that I also believe that mine are no more valid or "right" than yours.

    To insinuate that you would tell me off because I believe differently than you is the absurd thing here.
     
  18. 1armychick

    1armychick New Member

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    I stand corrected. You aren't a closed minded idiot, you are just an idiot.
     
  19. TrueDolFan

    TrueDolFan Minion of Satan

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    Classy.

    And you wonder why no man wants anything from you other than what's between your legs...
     
  20. 1armychick

    1armychick New Member

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    Ya' know, the more you talk, the more ridiculous you make yourself seem. You have absolutely no idea what you are even speaking of when it comes to me and men. You have no idea if I'm in a solid relationship. You have no idea if I just lost someone that meant the world to me and that I might still be dealing with that pain. You have no idea if I'm a **** or a "born-again" virgin. You have no idea. My opinion was based on fact - your statements. Your opinion is base on what? A response from a strong, single, independent woman that can crush you into a little boy and has obviously done so by what was said and the result that insued? Everyone on here can obviously see that you are a babbling idiot. They are just being nicer in how they tell you that.
     
  21. Tone_E

    Tone_E Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Sooo, if my opinion is that anyone other than Anglo-Saxons are inferior in all aspects of life, does that not make it absurd because it is an opinion?

    Hmmmmm?

    To each his own, but I would like to reiterate that unwed woman can't impregnate themselves (naturally of course). So, a burden has to be placed on the male as well. You act as though it is all the woman's fault for caring for a baby. Sheesh, are they supposed to file the baby for adoption because they are not wed?

    I do feel you views are absurd, and if you read my post again, I clearly state that is merely MY opinion, and one that I am rightfully entitled to, as you are yours. Never did I mention I feel mine are any more correct than yours. I just said you are out of line for blaming the woman only, that is all. Considering sex requires two, both the man and the woman are equally at fault for unwed babies. I don’t see how that can be denied, and how you only cast a bad light on the mothers.
     
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  22. TrueDolFan

    TrueDolFan Minion of Satan

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    You're giving yourself WAY too much credit. I don't care what you think of me.

    My opinion is based on the fact that you chose to attack me personally for what I believe. Insulting me personally was crossing the line, so I'm more than glad to return the favor, ****bag.

    Like I said, just because you have nothing to offer a man other than carnal gratification doesn't mean you have to be angy at ME. I didn't make you undesirable, YOU did.
     
  23. TrueDolFan

    TrueDolFan Minion of Satan

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    I wouldn't have the audacity to try to tell you off. Just because I think your opinion is absurd, I don't have the right to attack you personally, like Ms. armychick thinks she does.

    You told me this:

    To me, that's telling me that you would attack me personally, but you aren't doing it because you would lay into me so bad that you'd get in trouble.

    Why can't people understand that they can have disagreements without personal attacks?
     
  24. Tone_E

    Tone_E Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Well, regrdless, it is not a personal attack on you, just your views - aka your opinion. Whatever was not said because of the TOS is my opinion. I never attacked you personally, or meant to.
     
  25. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    The unfortunate truth of the matter is the fact that a man can leave completely after the conception. We can call the guy a dead beat or say things like it takes two to tango, however that does not change the fact that after the seed is planted the guy can disappear.

    Also the reality of the situation is that it might take two to tango, however it only takes one to determine if a baby is born or not, or given up for adoption.

    This does mean that women should be extra responsible to who they let in between their legs and what birth control she is using to prevent the unwanted pregnancy. Assuming that becoming pregnant with a douchebag is something that she does not want.

    We can talk about blame and fault, however if you know a man is a douchebag, chances are becoming a father isn't going to wash the douche out of his bag.

    We as a society need to do more with women to help curb this problem of the young single mother who is impregnated by a douchebag. One of those solutions in my opinion is to give more responsiblity to who has the most resonsibility and in this situation it is the woman. Instead of telling them it is the douchebag guys fault and then putting them up on a pedistal of being brave.
     
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  26. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    i find it pretty hard to believe that when two people have sex the first thing going through the womans mind is "if i get pregnant I will be a hero."
     
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  27. TrueDolFan

    TrueDolFan Minion of Satan

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    I agree 100%.

    There is no shame or responsibility anymore in our society, and I find it very unsettling.
     
  28. TrueDolFan

    TrueDolFan Minion of Satan

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    No, but if she does get pregnant, she knows that society is going accept her, and even reward her.

    In the not-so-distant past, she would be shamed and ostracised.

    I'm just an old-fasioned guy, I guess.
     
  29. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    again though, how much of a factor is it? Its one to thing she shouldn't receive so much support after, but again I don't see that as a major factor in unwed pregnancy.
     
  30. TrueDolFan

    TrueDolFan Minion of Satan

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    The point is, women used to be afraid of being unmarried and pregnant.

    Now, there is basically no deterrent. It is socially acceptable to be an unwed mother now.
     
  31. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    Some might say that means we've evolved as a society. Beats having to wear a Scarlet 'A' on your chest.
     
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  32. DaFish

    DaFish Well-Known Member

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    Please don't take this wrong way because I have 2 brothers that are currently serving and just got back from Iraq a couple of years ago. I respect you guys and everything you put on the line. However, I don't think it fair to say that everyone outside of the military is not entitled to his or her opinion. It is everyone's tax dollars that supports the military and I reserve the right to talk **** about any politician I think is a POS even if I didn't vote. What if the reason I didn't vote is because I don't agree with either of the 2 smucks they offer us every 4 years anyway.

    Maybe every American citizen who has never served or doesn't vote just keep our tax dollars. Where would we be then? There would be no military and we would all be screwed. I just don't get the "if you aren't a part of this club then shut your mouth" attitude.

    And as I said before I respect you and the military for what you do but just think it's wrong to imply that nobody else's opinion matters.
     
  33. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    barring prosecution, unwed pregnancy will continue to happen. Even with societies chiding. it happened in the good ol days, it happens now. You sound more pissed off they are not being punished. I think raising a kid without help is punishment enough, on welfare or not.
     
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  34. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I have met women who did think, "if I get pregnant, I will have someone to love me and people will notice me."

    One of things that should go through her head is, "Do I want this guy to be the father of my child?"

    Especially if the question is, "Do I want this douchebag to be the father of my child?"

    Studies even show that men make stupid decisions when they are aroused. They have the decision making that is very close to a crack addict.
     
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  35. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    That is true it does beat that.

    We need to find a middle ground.
     
  36. 1armychick

    1armychick New Member

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    Of course, even then it was always the woman that was at fault. As we have evolved, there are those that seem to think it's a woman's fault she is a single mother. Others can put blame on dead-beat dads. Yet, two in here suggest that women need the help with being more responsible in not getting pregnant. I can agree with this to an extent. I think there should be more options for birth control, and there should be more means and cheaper ways to getting them.

    However, there is no indication that a man will be a dead beat. There is no real warning sign that they will skip when they hear the "P" word. Yes, you can make an argument from a stereotypical standpoint (in which I think he is trying to make - uneducated, lower class, etc). However, there are those that don't fit this stereotype that still skip when they hear the "P" word. So how do we correct this?

    I say let those that are currently dead beats wear a sign tattooed on their forehead that says "DEADBEAT." And let the women be more responsible with birth control. But this definitely gives them the option. Either that or castration. (I personally like the latter).
     
  37. 1armychick

    1armychick New Member

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    Hence the castration comment. It amazes me that your opinion is still to completely blame the woman. If it is known that an aroused man has the decision making of a crack addict, then there needs to be a way to track how many kids he fathers. Maybe make DNA testing mandatory from the birth. This way, we can track the fathers and then sterilize them. Ya' know, a vasectimy???

    Is that good middle ground? I'm not saying a woman shouldn't be responsible, but it is unfair and completely wrong to label every woman in this category that is single. Not every one of them milks society. I don't like it any more than you, but that doesn't mean that I should blame woman for procreating, no matter what the situation.
     
  38. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I do not agree with this. There are a lot of indications. Unfortunately a lot of those indications are blinded by the fact that people fall in love. When it comes to love people are idiots. There are chemicals that actually block our decision making about the person.

    In the situations where I have friends become single parents or get in a relationship, I can tell if the guy is a douche bag or the woman is *****. It is about creating a group of people who surround us that we trust to tell us to dump the person we are with and listen to them. We as a society are very indivisualized, so the idea of letting someone close to us make a decision like this for us is foriegn and even frowned upon.

    I also believe that creating this idea of a "dead beat" dad is also part of the problem. For one it hurts a lot of dads who are out there trying their best. It just swings the pendelum the other way and creates more trouble than it solves.
     
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  39. TrueDolFan

    TrueDolFan Minion of Satan

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    I agree, it will always happen, but it didn't happen as often back in the good ol' days.

    I'm pissed off at how morally bankrupt our society has become. Nobody takes responsibility for their own actions anymore. Everybody is a "victim" and is told that they aren't to blame.

    I'm pissed because many people sympathise with the unwed single mother, and don't seem to understand that THE KID is the one to truly suffer the consequences of her misdeed. A child is FAR better off in a house with both parents, IMO, and to take that away from that poor kid is the biggest shame of all.
     
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  40. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    It is all about responsibility. Right now women have the responsibility as to whether a child is born or not.

    It is not really looking at blaming a side. It is looking at responsibility. Would you give your life savings over to a crack addict? That is what you are doing if you are relying on a condom as your ownly form of birth control. I am not saying it is right for the crack addict to spend your life savings on crack.

    Right now I think our society has done enough if not too much on the man's responsibility side of it. Hell it is even to the point where a man can pay child support on a child that he knows is not his, however didn't contest it birth in the first two years, EVEN if he learned about it on year 5. On top of that have to pay back child support as well.

    Also the middle ground for your scenerio would be taking the babies away and then sterilzing the mother as well.
     

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