You're drawing your own conclusions, Marty... Sorry, bro... But I see it differently. The fact is, Kevin's "facts" are simply half-truths that the media is giving him... He has no idea what goes on in JT's life other than what the newspaper or latest internet blog tells him... However many are presenting these half-truths as cold-hard facts. I may just have to agree to disagree, because I know what happens when I get in an argument.
You are incorrect, I've had a sour opinion of Jason Taylor for a few years now, it wasn't just because he decided that he wanted to play somewhere else or jitterbug on TV. He had been hinting at retirement for the last few years, usually at the end of the season, leaving his teammates in limbo and potentially scaring away prospective free agents. He has pointed fingers at his teammates when talking to reporters, he did so last year when asked about Beck being a rookie. He did the same thing with Trent green before the season. Does a leader stand up for his teammates and encourage them or shrug his shoulders and place blame on them? Then you have him causing a commotion on the sidelines and yelling in the direction of Cam. Like him or hate him, Cam was the head coach and he deserved respect from his players. If Jason had a problem with him or his game planning, then he should have done it privately behind closed doors like a professional. Instead of doing that, Taylor decided it was a great time to tell the media that he had a better relationship with Nick Saban than he did with Cameron. There were alot of reasons to be down on Jason Taylor, it wasn't just because he wanted out, although that is a factor. I've spoken about this before, I didn't form my opinion when he left. Alot people chose to look the other way because he was our best defensive player and put up great numbers, I don't deny that he was a great player for us, but he isn't above criticism for his actions. What Thomas did was standard for players at the end of the season, the fans and media blew that way out of proportion.
Bro, the media was actually pretty protective of Jason up until the very end. Taylor had several opportunities to put out the fire and end the stories about a rift between him and Parcells and he kept feeding the flames. He didn't bother showing up and sweating along side his teammates and Parcells was not a happy man. I don't think that Kevin has really said anything that wasn't true.
If I Remember Correctly I had to look it up, I saw it and never knew what the hell people were saying. lol
To me, all this Taylor speculation is simply this. If Parcells and Co reach an agreement with JT to bring him back, I'm fine with it. If they don't, I'm fine with that too. I am totally in agreement beforehand with whatever their judgment and decisions are in this instance. We don't even know if JT would want to come back or feels he can go somewhere else and be a full time starter. Just looking at the thing from a physical standpoint, IMO, JT would make an effective situational pass rusher for us. If he made contact with the Dolphins and expressed interest in coming back, a very unlikely thing IMO, I'm willing to agree with however Parcells chooses to handle things. I think since about 99% of Phin fans seem to love that we have him in charge, that they should also be happy with any decision in this matter that he makes. IN BILL WE TRUST.
I guess I'm not going to see eye-to-eye with many then because it's just how I feel. This is a business, I don't hold a grudge for Taylor wanting out... If he comes back, I welcome him back. It's that simple to me. I don't feel the need to hold any grudges against a player that has no reason to show loyalty to us. A team doesn't show loyalty to a player, why should a player show loyalty to a team? I don't think Jason Taylor mishandled the situation, I think it was blown out of proportion. If they think he can still play at a high caliber -- he was DOPY two years ago -- then I'm fine with him back. What Taylor brings to the football field as well as the community shouldn't be ignored...
You have taken this soo far off from football. Who are the little fans on a board? And whats all of this envy stuff? And Chicks dumping you? Less fortunate people? Your digging deep. If you have a mancrush, then that's fine. But he wanted out (made it very, very clear) and in the end he got what he wanted. End of discussion if you ask me. Doesn't get more simple than that.
It has nothing to do with envy. Guy went all girly, dancing all offseason. And guess what, he said he was in the best shape of his life, and might have been. But he wasn't in football shape, and football shape is an entirely different beast. Skipping everything the Dolphins had planned for the offseason didn't help his cause, or the Redskins...embarrassing season with them. See if Tom Brady, or some other star spends the entire offseason dancing...it doesn't happen. For that matter, all of the previous nfl players on that show, I believe, were retired. And I think a lot of people held a grudge, and didn't wish him the best, including myself. Sometimes when you leave/how you leave, it can show your true colors. Zach Thomas, actually cut by the dolphins, left without a word. He was never a primadoma and never was. JT showcased himself all offseason, while Parcells, Ireland, and Sparano were constructing an 11-5 team.
I was a big JT fan when he was here. With that said, he wanted to leave and didn't have any faith that we were going to compete so he packed up his sh## and left. Now that he's been injured and he's not feeling the love, he might think about coming back? I'd certainly hope that the Phins organization one day does the right thing to allow JT to retire a Dolphin. He deserves the Ring of Honor (so does Zach) and possibly the HOF. Come back to play though after you whined like a little girl? Parcells will give him a glass of go F yourself. Mark my words.
Agree with most of that GIK. Disagree with that, JT wanted O-U-T of Miami, he did not even go through the motions of wanting to stay, and not attending the voluntary workouts due to his DWS schedule was a blunder on his part. We did not put a single Dlineman on the injured list, that was not an accident, JT spend a good part of the season in the IR. At the end of the day, Parcells handled things correctly, JT did not. Eh, can't wait until the 25th and see who we take with that #44 pick.
Alen I don't care what happens on other teams, if they do or don't. On last years team EVERY OTHER VETERAN that was healthy was there ! His example to younger players, of which we had many, was a TERRIBLE example. I don't care how many people want to pooh-pooh it, his selfishness was one thing that Parcells would not tolerate. This team needed discipline and a veteran leader defying, The Man (Parcells) and fueding with him, was just not going to be tolerated.
Wow, I think the way that the whole JT thing was mishandled by both JT and the team, given how much he has meant to the team in the past, but the key is that what he has meant to the team is in the past. If he returns this year, it'll be under the Trio's terms and not his own. Taylor's big mistake last year was thinking that his twinkletoes routine could replace the work he'd get in the offseason with the team, any team for that matter. Doesn't anyone else find it more than a little circumstantial that he spent a good portion of the year inactive due to injury after the very same offseason he spent DWTS instead of with a team, preparing for football ?? At any rate, it's way to late to be upset because he's gone. Would he have helped us this year ?? Doubtful...and that opinion is predicated on his lack of football shape, not his age, football ability, etc. Will he help us if he plays here this year, well that is also up for debate. Is he healthy ?? Can he stay healthy ?? Will he put the same effort he put into getting his body ready this year as he did the previous 12,minus last year ?? There is a hint of lack of trust that he'll give it his all here because of how he was treated and how he treated the Trio last offseason. It would, of course, go both ways...would he trust the Trio and vice versa... I still think that the best for everyone is for him to move on, or retire at which time I hope he signs a one day contract to retire a Fin....This is not sour grapes about him. He was great player for us, but I believe, as I did last offseason, that his time here is up. As to Zach, again, another great player for us and I'd welcome him back with open arms...to a one day and retire contract... His time is up here but for different reasons...I cannot bring myself to watch him any more with the thought that the next concussion may just be the one that brings with it permanent damage. It may have already happened, we don't know that, but it's time for him to ride into the sunset the hero that he is for fins fans...and enjoy as much of the rest of his life as he can...
Grid, that is the system, like it or not. The team doesn't have to show the same kind of loyalty to the player, that the player has to show to the team. Its the same relationship most of us have with our employers, you tell me the difference ? If my company wants to get rid of me, they just do it, but if I have signed a contract to work for certain conditions I am bound legally to do work for that company to the best of my ability until the contract runs out. If I don't like the conditions I can always resign, and Jason Taylor could have retired and pursued his dreams on DWTS and Hollywood with no restrictions. There are no guarantees in life, God knows I know this one as well as anyone does. So Jason Taylor isn't guaranteed a SB ring or even a shot at it. If he wants one, he should have honored his contract, and the wishes of his employer, and shown the loyalty his handsome salary says he should give, and done everything to help the team that owns his contract to be a better team. Just because you don't do well one year doesn't mean you give up, it means you buckle down and work all that much harder, just like all the other veterans did last year on the Dolphins. Look where that hard work ended up ? In the playoffs. Vonnie Holliday didn't complain and ask to be traded, he worked harder than ever before in the off-season, and he was rewarded. So did Vernon Carey, and Joey Porter, and Chad Pennington. Remember Pennington had a horrible 2007 and was replaced by Clemons in the middle of the season I believe. How did he respond to it ? Did he talk about retirement ? Because many within football think that Pennington, if he wants it, can & will be a great coach. He could have slid right into a nice QB Coaches job anywhere in the league. But Chad went to work, and worked harder than ever with his personal trainer friend from Tennessee (I think was a former teammate of his in HS or at Marshall). He did what was necessary to get better, stronger and show everyone he was ready to play, and he was rewarded with his best season ever. Meanwhile what did JT do ? He went to Hollywood, took dancing lessons (while his team mates sweated and conducted off-season OTA's). He also went to Hollywood parties (while his team mates sweated and conducted off-season OTA's) and did female talk shows (like The View) (while his team mates sweated and conducted off-season OTA's). Even if Jason had returned to the Dolphins, don't you think this would have cause a certain amount of resentment from his team mates ? I know I wouldn't be very happy with him. I don't think he would be as openly recieved by his team mates as he would be from some of the fans. Oh I think it was terribly mishandled. His lack of loyalty and his selfishness was out in the open, and he showed no remorse for it. No matter how much charity work he does now, many fans, and certainly many NFL players will see through his true character. When it came down to it, he showed us where his true loyalty lies, even when he has a signed contract, and that is what he wants. He puts that above everyone else or any team, or team mates. I consider loyalty above anything else. I only post at this Dolphin site out of that loyalty. I have nothing to stop me from visiting or posting at the "other" site. But I chose to follow the Admins of this board here because of who they were and what they stood for. After hearing the story of what happened, I took a stand, and made it a point to not post there anylonger, and I don't believe I have posted there since before May or June of last year......maybe even since April. Jason Taylor showed none of that loyalty to an owner, or a franchise that had rewarded him personally very handsomely. He won DPOY, he had status and rank as an elite player in the NFL. He had been to Pro Bowls, and was even able to have some commercial viability off the field. Its not as though being on the Dolphins had actually hurt him financially. I have no financial reward for posting here or over there, but I chose to be loyal. JT had a legal responsibility to be loyal (his contract) and showed just how selfish he is when you see his true character. I can smell a phoney a mile away, and JT is a phoney. I've worked with some very high profile people in my life experience. Some of them extremely well connected politically and socially. He fooled me for a while, but when he had his "press conference" last May (or was it the 1st week of June ?), it showed me what he was really all about.
You will just have to show me where this is speculation.. I see it as how things actually went down. what part of that is speculation bro? The team was asked, Jason was committed elsewhere(and NOT here) and.. he said he would probably retire if he wasn't traded. Held us over the barrel, we simply were not good enough, he wanted to go to a contender. How can you dispute that? Whether you want him back or not is not the issue here, it is your refusal to admit that this stiff is not speculation that brings this post. You didn't like it so you dismissed it as "speculation", well, disprove any of it and my apologies swiftly follows.
With all due respect, when you find an article that says Jason Taylor never bonded or talked to his teammates... and specifically said "I want to be traded." then I'll zip it. People draw their own conclusions, it happens every day... Writers twist words to make a story and people believe what they want to believe, not the truth. I've read enough of media literal analysis books to know that we're being deceived because we want to... Maybe you're right, maybe I am, I really don't know... I guess it doesn't really matter because we're arguing about a big "if"...
He never said those exact words..."I want to be traded". With that said though, he did everything BUT eat ho ho's during the offseason to suggest that he wasn't interested in returning to Miami. And that is fine. We have a great up and coming team right now. Something for us to be excited about. I am enjoying it!
Actually he probably did scarf down some ho-hos between dance sessions. That said I wouldn't want JT back. He didn't want to stay with his team and help rebuild, so he doesn't deserve to be here for the success.
how could he brother? he wasn't there.. that sort of thing takes physical presence. He was busy dancing with his Hollywood friends, not lifting with his team mates hwere he belonged. That sort of thing was acceptable with all the past coaching staffs because he was such a hero, and look at our record. There was SOMETHING that happened this year and they all say it started at ota's.. while Jason was absent. There is no big "if" to any of my or Kevins arguement.
The time that a player leaves a team on good terms, will be the first time. Fans always see the player as the bad guy regardless if they had any fault or not. Teams NEVER show players any loyalty, especially in football where the contracts aren't guaranteed and they can cut you whenever they feel your play is slipping. Why should a player show any loyalty to a team if they don't get it back? JT didn't go out into ESPN like Chad Johnson asking to be traded, he denied that every interview he did, which he did a lot of. If he did ask for a trade he did it the right way, behind closed doors And how can you possibly blame him for asking for a trade. This would be the 4th and the 3rd in a 4 year span h he'd be playing under, and another rebuilding year. No one takes losing harder than Jason taylor and he just had enough. If he would be willing to take a reduced role and pay cut and realize that he won't be the star of the team(which i don't see why he wouldn't, hes the first guy to tell you when he is playing like crap or isn't worth what he is getting payed).
The only thing Parcells, Ireland, and Sparano are thinking right now is that they screwed the Redskins out of a 2nd round pick this April. And that's where this whole thing ends. EDIT - and a 6th round pick next year
Jason Cole said it on the sporting news radio around a year ago, he also talked that same day about Bill's deal in Miami only being a one year deal and he could walk and still get payed for all the years left on the deal if the owner sold the team. That very same day Bill Parcells was on that same radio show.The host was a fill in from New York that has been friends with Bill Parcells for years. I say fill in cuzz it was in the Tony Bruno time slot on "sporting news radio" but Bruno and sporting news had a falling out and Tony just stop doing his show...............so they had to get someone to take over the time slot tell they knew for sure what they wanted to do. I' have talked about this a few times here.I don't know,or care, how i'm viewed here but i'm not a liar.
I don't call you a liar, I'm sure you heard it. But I do the validity of the content if that was just something said on an out-of-town radio show, we'd need to have more proof it was something that actually happened than just something said on a talk show.
According to the Miami Herald, Jason Taylor will formally demand a trade at an 11:30AM news conference tomorrow morning. He will announce that he wants to play for a contender and that 2008 will be his final in the NFL, adding fuel to the speculation that Taylor would rather star in Hollywood than play football. Wow. Taylor has been adament about holding out and has stuck true to his word, despite being fined $8,638 for every camp absence. Taylor’s agent was apparently told beforehand and Taylor made his mind up to announce it infront of everyone. http://helmet2helmet.net/2008/06/01/breaking-news-jason-taylor-will-demand-trade/
According to Jason Cole (ex Dolphin beat writer for 2 papers before becoming a national football writer for Yahoo sports), Jason Taylor has once again politely asked the Dolphins for a trade to a contending team. Taylor is one of the top performers on "Dancing with the Stars" and aims to be a Hollywood star once he decides he has had enough football. He could retire if the Fins DON'T trade him. He wants to pattern himself after another former Miami area football player, Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson and become an action star. http://popculturelane.blogspot.com/2008/04/jason-taylor-reiterates-trade-demands.html
And to be fair to the other side of the argument No, he did not demand a trade from the Miami Dolphins. Yes, he wants to play one more season before moving on to an acting career. No, he still hasn't spoken with new Dolphins boss Bill Parcells. Yes, he believes Tony Sparano will be a good coach in Miami. No, he doesn't regret missing workouts to appear on ABC's "Dancing with the Stars." Yes, he desperately wants to leave football a winner. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3421178
they mentioned in articles that both bp, sparano, and ireland were communicating with jt during his dancing as well as some of his teammates were watching him dance........... sounds like bonding to me.
"communicating" could be to tell each other to "piss-off". That is not bonding, or at least the kind of bonding he needed to be doing. It is with his former teammates he needed to do that with.
it said in the articles they were wishing him luck so, no unless you have knowledge of otherwise. And I do remember it saying his teammates were watching him as well as telling him good luck.
Some of his team mates might have been saying that, but it by no means implys that the majority were telling him that. Also I would never expect that Parcells, Ireland or Sparano would say anything publically against Jason. But every indication was that Parcells was unhappy, and probably there was a lot of tension in other places within the Davie facility over Jason Taylor and his defiance against the new regime. If you tell me otherwise you are just fooling yourself and I believe arguing, just to argue, and I will be done with this thread.
Well then you can not say he was not bonding with his teammates he just was not bonding with all of them. I see. Im sure there was tension, now was it because the of the media storm or because all of his team mates believe jt was jumping ship is a different story...... Every indication is reports in newspapers correct? Yet there were also reports his new coach and ireland were wishing him luck in his endeavors. Now that I think about it not to sure if the report said BP had wished him luck as well. We also have the fact that BP came out and said there was no tension. So basically you are saying I am arguing to argue and fooling myself because I choose to believe another set of reports. That is a cop out argument no different then your naive comment you made earlier. And fyi if in the future you don't want someone questioning your opinion, don't post it on the internet.
The Miami Dolphins treated Jason Taylor very well, they tried to surround him with enough talent to win and unfortunately they weren't able to put it all together. But to say that the Dolphins didn't show any loyalty to Taylor is silly. The thing is, he had several opportunities to end the speculation that there was a rift between him and the FO and he chose to fuel the flames. Even if he wanted to be traded, he was still a part of the Miami Dolphins until his trade was finalized. Instead of preparing himself and putting in the work like his teammates were, Taylor had no intention of showing up to practices and workouts and he thought he could waltz in here at his leisure and everything would be fine. From ESPN Also from that ESPN article Instead of being here and sweating with his teammates, he knew in advance that he wasn't going to attend any of the offseason programs or even training camp. If Jason is a leader by example as he said in that interview, what did his actions say to the rest of his teammates and the youngsters that we brought in? It said that training hard and preparation mean nothing because you can just walk in at any point and things will be fine, it's not like you're reinventing the wheel, football is football, right? And truth be told, Taylor did request a trade and the Dolphins tried to accomodated him, but they couldn't get a deal done before the draft and both sides tried to smooth things over (downplay his request) because it looked like he was going to be a Miami Dolphin. Once the Redskins suffered a loss of one of their players to injury, they went after Taylor to fill that need and Jason got what he wanted. No offense brother, but Jason told a different story to ESPN. Parcells wasn't happy that Jason was blowing off the team to further his post-football career, I don't blame Parcells one bit for not jumping up from his seat where he was watching tape and scouting players to go shake the hand of a guy who made it clear that the team wasn't his priority. You either follow Tuna's rules or you end up in his doghouse. Taylor made his choice.
thats an assumption and nothing more. in the brotherhood we call the NFL, people usually dont treat eachother with unwarranted and unneccesary disrespect. they dont bother with that kind of pettiness. people with beefs address it like men. figuring how to unload a 9 million dollar cap hit for draft picks isnt telling someone to "piss off" either, which the media tried to sensationalize. its business management. i doubt Parcells dislikes JT as a person, he was just trying to better our team's future. and he succeeded in spades.
