Great players do great things in key moments in professional sports. This actual applies to regular people in life. Until Tua steps up in those moments, the scrutiny is going to continue. I think the people that don't fully believe in him (Resnor, Hitman, Pumpdogs) simply just want to see him elevate his game and accomplish that before they accept him. It's understandable, but instead this turns into a constant argument and nitpick fest every damn week. I like Tua, but he isn't getting it done when we truly need him to and it's maddening. I just want to win. This isn't about being right or wrong. He continues to fail miserably in these do or die games and it sucks to see because I really like the guy and I think he’s talented enough to do incredible things in this league. It's been Buffalo twice in playoff/division clinching moments, it's been a blowout against the Titans during Flores last season, it was injuries the following year, last year it was a total collapse in December/January and a beatdown in KC, and now this time he tosses three very bad ints in a game that we absolutely HAD to have. It sucks and he has to do better. This team is so reliant on him being at the very top of his game every week that it's almost unfair. Again though, that comes with the territory of playing quarterback in this league. Bad quarterbacks don't lead teams into the postseason. Average quarterbacks can get you to the wild card game and that's about it. Is Tua average? The things we've seen him do suggest that he's far above average at the position. The overall results in big moments suggest that he is and has a lot to overcome before one can put him in the upper echelon of QBs. In other words, the skills are undeniable, yet the results are dissatisfaction and frustration. The bottom line is that he's not going anywhere any time soon. It is so fkin hard to find a mainstay at this position in the NFL. Teams spends years of draft picks on the position and never get results. He's worth waiting for in my opinion because again...He's shown us what he can become. People that dislike him or don't believe in him have made valid points towards why they don't. To me, I understand it, but this is not Jay Fiedler we're talking about here. He's worth sticking with despite not getting the results we've all wanted.
The problem is, Tua has "stepped up" numerous times only to see the team lose. This year he had 124 and 114 passer ratings against the Bills and Packers and they still lost, for example. The shortsighted viewpoint that a different QB would somehow make this team a SB contender is just not plausible. When it comes to QB play there are certain things we can look at to see what correlates to winning. There are 3 things that do this best: Passer rating, ANY/A, and NY/A. The past two seasons, Tua has ranked (respectively) in these stats: 2022- 1st, 1st, and 1st 2023- 5th, 2nd, and 2nd This season he is at 8th, 15th, and 16th He is definitely not playing as well this season as he has the past 2, but he's still average and above in all of these important stats. However, the mantra regarding him has always been the same regardless to whether or not he's playing average or elite. Facts are, Tua has played, overall, like a top 10 QB (and top 2-3 the previous 2) over the past 3 years.
But he didn't play well this week. I watched the game. Strictly eyeball test. He missed some throws. Whether you believe Reek should have had the ball, if he led him a little bit more it was a huge catch and no way to intercept. I get it those long throws can't always be perfect but that ball didn't have enough zip on it to me.
Great players don't always start off great in these do-or-die situations. Peyton Manning went 0-3 in the playoffs his first 5 years in the league with ratings of 62.3, 82.0 and 31.3. He was putting up elite regular season stats during that time though, in the 90's when the average passer rating was around 80 (from 1999-2002 he was 4th, 6th, 8th, and 5th in passer rating). Very similar to Tua doing well the last 3 years in the regular season but not doing well in do-or-die games. These anti-Tua posters would have given up on Peyton Manning with their view that a small sample size of do-or-die games is more important than consistent regular season performance. Statistics says otherwise. In Manning's case it took 6 years until 2003 where Peyton's combined rating in the playoffs over 3 games was 106.4. Peyton was generally very good in the playoffs after that, excepting some crucial individual games of course, and the fall-off at the very end of his career. Point is.. until you have a large enough sample you really shouldn't conclude much. And players do learn and develop. Tua is thankfully not going away. We have a franchise QB. And yes, statistically speaking consistently good regular season performance tends to translate into good postseason performance if you have large enough sample size (problem is often you don't, even over a career, which makes the sample size for that statement not as large as one would want, but still worth noting).
I agree, I mentioned that he didn’t play well yesterday. But his “off” is still average most of the time. When Allen and Mahomes have off games, however, their teams win. This creates a false narrative.
It's about points scored, not stats amassed. Maybe you're fine with some great stats, I prefer points and wins. I couldn't care less about Tua's stats when he disappears in big games, and we don't score points.
I don't think there is any fair comparison of Tua to Peyton. At least Manning was going deep into the playoffs.
They scored 27 points against Buffalo. Do you actually believe that WORSE stats make it more likely that they score points? Or do you think it’s possible that Tua played his part and the team lost the game?
Maybe it's not talent but doesn't handle pressure well.Meaning mental pressure. I guess you call it the it factor that Mahomes has when you can always count on him when the team needs him even if he is having a bad game. Burrow has that also and to a lesser extent Jackson,and Allen do also at least in the regular season for the latter two.They seem to choke in the playoffs. Not something you can teach but every sport in every era has those clutch players. So far in his career Tua has not been that.
Talking about cherry picking, at least you didn’t include the Green Bay game. Don’t you agree that Tua mostly shrinks in big moments and crucial games? I mean it’s not a one time thing, the whole team does it with sometimes(maybe even more than that) the defense holding their own and especially Sieler, he’s probably the best we got on the team. The problem I think people have (besides the circle of mediocrity we’re in for decades) is, that this offense was supposed to carry this team and they don’t really do it. It’s not like in Cincy where simply the defense sucks donkeyballs and when it comes to Tua, he’s Samoan Alex Smith until he gets some more monkeys of his back and shows otherwise, that he’s indeed elite.
Clutch is a myth created by sportswriters. It’s pretty much a proven fact that, given enough sample sizes, players who play well in the regular season play well in the postseason. There’s typically a drop off due to opponents also being playoff teams. Look at Brady and Manning’s regular season stats and compare them to their postseason stats. ALL players in pro sports who have average length careers do well under the pressure of playing in pro sports. A great example of this is Reggie “Mr. October” Jackson. He was called Mr. October because he played well in October and the media (and some ignorant fans) took this to mean he was somehow raising his play in the playoffs. Well, his playoff stats were nearly identical to his regular season stats. Using “clutch” as any sort of metric to evaluate a player is lazy and will lead to inconsistent conclusions.
Jackson??? There is no other QB in the league today that exemplifies choking in the playoffs while playing great in the regular season than Jackson. You know what his playoff ratings are? 78.8, 63.2, 74.8, 61.5, 121.8 and 75.5. That's 5 terrible games and one good game out of 6 total in 6 years. If there's anyone where sample size is starting to suggest the guy is a choker it's Jackson. Not there yet, and we'll see this year, but he's worse than everyone else out there in this regard. Don't include him with QBs you think have the "it" factor and handle pressure well.
You included them with QBs that have the "it" factor and handle pressure well. Why mention Jackson in the first place in such a discussion?
Burrow: Regular season passer rating: 100 Post season passer rating: 93 Is he a choker? No, he’s not. And how exactly can a player be counted on when they are having a bad game?
Makes no sense to include anyone having the it factor and handling pressure well if they're terrible in the playoffs. No such thing as ignoring that part and giving them credit. Hell if that's the case why attack Tua? Tua has played well in the regular season against good teams (not yesterday) even if the team lost. Sorry.. Jackson does not have "it" until proven otherwise.
Yea I am the only person in country talking about Tua playing lousy against good teams in his career. Made the whole thing up. Lol!
Tua has played very well multiple times against good teams. It is still a criticism that the Dolphins (with Tua as QB) tend to lose so many such games. But Tua himself is often not the main reason.
OK.. well just take Jackson off any list. Ravens are one team I'm really interested in following in the playoffs precisely because I want to see if Jackson can change that narrative. He's got 195 total attempts in the playoffs. That's getting close to being somewhat reliable. btw.. Josh Allen has a higher playoff rating than regular season rating: 100.0 to 93.6. He's had some really bad games but also some fantastic ones. Not sure you want to say he sucks in the playoffs.
Some people talk about the Earth being flat, too. Listen, the sports media creates narrative in order to get viewers. They are rarely correct. Even former coaches and players say BS when they get into the media in order to get viewers. Watch the film. Be objective. Look at quantifiable stats. Study the game. If you (not just you) want to just casually watch the game and come to conclusions, fine, but getting angry when others who actually do those aforementioned things tell you you’re wrong isn’t the way to be. It would be like me getting angry at cbrad if he told me my math is wrong.
I think only Allen and Manning the Lesser (lol) are the only two QB’s with higher postseason PR’s than regular season.
This is a big gripe for me. Allen can have a 68 PR against KC and win so he’s considered great while Tua can have an 80+ and lose so he’s considered a choker. It’s absurd really.
Also, I think Jackson will finally get the monkey off of his back this postseason. He looks better than he ever has. I’m thinking his failings are more like what happened to Manning his first few times in the playoffs. We will see though!
Allen has 10 playoff games, and in 4 of them he had a higher rating than 120. Tua only has one playoff game. So it's fair to criticize Tua and not Allen in that case. But it's also important to note that a sample size of N = 1 is so small to be essentially meaningless.
I’m not saying that Tua doesn’t need to play better more often. I think that’s a given. What I’m saying is, the Bills lost only one playoff game when Allen put up those numbers. Tua does that this season (well, 114 not 120), and the Dolphins lose both. (Bills and Packers)
btw.. on a related subject, since the argument against Tua is turning towards wins rather than performance against good teams in the regular season, and performance in the cold and in the playoffs, let's make sure we apply the same criteria to Herbert. Herbert this year against winning teams is 1-5. One win and 5 losses against good teams in the regular season, and of course he choked in the playoffs last year. So let's be fair and attack Herbert the same way since so many wanted him over Tua.
Right again. I wonder what I was looking at when I saw that about Eli. I believe it was an article. Maybe they were talking about active players. It was a good while ago. I just noticed that Mark Sanchez also has a higher passer rating in the post season. lol
