Tua is not the Problem

Thanks for posting your glorified Madden rankings.

 

How do they measure that "got that dog in him" stat?

 

Seriously? You are going to take subjective, made up rankings by some dude over actual measured stats? At this point you are just sticking your fingers in your ears and shouting "nah, nah, nah nah" at any evidence that doesn't fit your narrative about Tua.

So from the stats he was the 2nd best QB against bottom half defences and 3rd best against top half defences yet you cite this junk as proof?

 

Yes, Marino played well without those two guys.

I hate when people say this type of ****. It's really annoying. Tua is nothing like Marino, and using Clayton/Duper is a non sequitur.

Again, just like at Alabama, to me it doesn't seem that Tua is the focus of the offense or even the main cog.

 

How are the defenses ranked?

 

Don’t get me wrong, Marino is one of my all time Dolphins heroes…but after the departure of the Marks Brothers, Marino only eclipsed 4000 yards twice, in 1988 and 1992

 

Probably PPG.

 

Marino has been argued about as GOAT for years before Brady. OF COURSE Marino set records with elite receivers.

But him and his offense weren't dog **** when he didn't have those two guys.

 

Please tell me you’re not comparing Shula with Godsey & Studesville. Is that what you’re doing?

 

What?

I was saying that while Marino didn't hit 4k all the time, he was still one of the most dominant QBs in the game, even without the Duper Bros. So while Tua put up some awesome stats, he wasn't a dominant QB in the game without those two receivers. Comparing Tua to Marino is off base.

That was my only point. Not sure why you think I was talking about coaches.

 

The Dolphins offense last season under Studesville and Godsey an anemic, ineffective and let’s face it, lacked any dynamic schemes that allowed for any big plays. Tua was handed the keys to a 1967 VW Beetle and told to go race against Mustangs, Cameros and Corvettes. That’s not Tua’s fault. Tua did what he could with the offense he had.

And I’m NOT talking about players…I’m talking about the OFFENSE itself.

This season, that Beetle was scrapped and the Dolphins brought in a Corvette for him…the OFFENSE, designed for big plays. Did having Hill added to the roster help? Of course it did, only a fool would say it didn’t, but to say that Hill is the only reason Tua’s performance this season was lights out is dishonest.

This is where the Marino and Shula comparisons are relevant. Marino took the helm of an offense with the dynamics for being able to produce big plays. Did having Duper, Clayton and Moore help in producing those big plays? Absolutely but as you said, Marino was still able to put up numbers like he did…not only because of his own talent, but the offense that was tailored for him.

This is no different than what McDaniel did for Tua…develop an offense tailor made for Tua. If it was all Hill and Waddle, everyone who tooted Bridgewater’s horn would have seen this “reliable veteran” backup put up similar numbers and continue Miami’s winning streak when Tua went down in Cincinnati.

We all saw that was NOT the case.

 

Actually, Bridgewatter played better than Tua against Cinci, he just couldn't stay healthy.

 

Neither was that good against Cinci. Both missed opportunity after opportunity to take a large lead. But overall there's no question Tua was WAY better compared to Bridgewater. Bridgewater was so bad that the HC actually decided to start a 3rd string QB over him even when healthy. The dropoff in performance was massive. I'd be surprised if Bridgewater is still on this team next season.

 

Yes, because he was.

 

Not really a fair take. He chose to start Skylar because Teddy couldn't practice.

 

He better not be. You can't have a Glass Joe QB backing up someone with durability and concussion issues. If Miami bangs their head on that wall again, I'll chip in on the "Fire Grier" banner.

 

H

How many QB's did that even once in that time frame?

 

What are you talking about? Thompson was named the starter against Minnesota even though Bridgewater was cleared to play. That was the coach having such little confidence in a veteran that he'd rather go with a 3rd stringer who played bad the game before (against the Jets). Bridgewater of course came in to relieve Skylar after he sustained an injury. But that was McD saying loud and clear what he thinks of Bridgwater: not even worthy of a backup QB.

Tua >> Bridgewater.

 

Cleared to play but he didn't practice which is why Skylar named the started before Teddy was cleared. If McDaniel didn't think Teddy gave them the best chance to win he wouldn't have started against the Patriots.

Obviously Tua is much better and anyone suggesting otherwise is trolling and should be ignored but the gap between Teddy and Skylar is probably just as big.

 

Dude.. generally, starting QBs who don't practice after injury but are cleared to play start over their backup QB. Similarly, to suggest that a vet backup QB with all that experience would in most cases not start over an untested 3rd string QB post-injury because they didn't have the chance to practice is ludicrous. That's not how it works in the NFL. No, this was McD clearly saying Bridgewater wasn't even good enough to be the backup QB at that time (well.. technically he was backup to Skylar lol).

As far as late in the season starting Bridgewater, well that was after Skylar had more opportunities and didn't prove himself either. But at the time of the Minnesota game McD clearly thought Bridgewater wasn't good enough.

 

Didn't same happen between Tua and Brissett the previous season? Tua had a finger injury, Brissett started, Tua backed up and eventually came in.

 

Yeah I think that was one of the rarer cases where you see that. Keep in mind though that Tua had a broken finger, not just recovering from a concussion. In general it's true that starting QBs who are cleared to play post-injury will start over the backup even if they didn't have the chance to practice. I think it's mostly because of the (generally) vast discrepancy in ability between the starter and backup that leads to this, especially playing with the 1st unit. If I had to guess you'll see more exceptions where that discrepancy isn't that great, and it's worth noting that Tua in 2021 was merely an average QB statistically, not the league leader in many key stats in 2022.

 

Maybe that would all make sense if Skylar had anything resembling a good game the week before. Teddy clearly looked better in his short stint at that point than Skylar in his short stink.

And yeah that isn't how it works with the starter but the starter was Tua. So in this case yes McDaniel was putting a lot of value in getting reps and having someone to game plan with.

 

Your explanation would make sense if the team was out of contention or so far ahead in the standings it didn't matter. This was midseason at a crucial time. So ask yourself: was McD trying to maximize the chances of winning or not? You're basically implying no. I can't believe that. I think the assumption is McD wanted to win, which means he was (likely) so disappointed with Bridgewater that he wanted to see if Skylar could improve to be better. You really only need to game plan for the backup QB, not a 3rd stringer.

 

Why would he be so disappointed in Teddy? He was perfectly fine in relief of Tua and at that point that is all he did.

 

No he wasn't. You go back to the game thread and posts afterwards and you see all those posts about how big the discrepancy is between Tua and Bridgewater. Of course this is coming after one of the most impressive comebacks in Dolphins history by Tua against the Ravens. So the perceived difference is understandable. But neither QB played well against Cinci that day. We were lucky to be near-tied for so long before Cinci pulled away.

Also, Bridgewater looked disinterested. I think that played an important role in McD's perception of him, or at least if that wasn't disinterest it was lack of preparation.

 

1986
Jay Shroeder; 4109
1989
Jim Everett: 4310
1990
Warren Moon; 4689
1991
Warren Moon; 4690
1993
John Elway; 4030
Steve Young; 4023
1994
Drew Beldsoe; 4555
Warren Moon; 4264
Brett Favre; 3969 (honorable mention)
1995
Brett Favre; 4413
Scott Mitchell; 4338
Warren Moon; 4228
Jeff George; 4143

I'll stop there but to answer your question, there were others that eclipsed the 4000 yard mark

 

Dude. It's. Not. About. Stats. Ross looked poor. On his own. Bondy on here wanted to give Tannehill a break when he was throwing to nobodies (and making one into a 1k receiver), but regardless, Tua did not look good those seasons. Like, just a thought experiment, put Marino on Tua's squads those seasons. Marino would still look good, even if they weren't winning. Lol

 

That doesn't make him not perfectly fine for a backup. If you have a good starter you would expect a noticeable dropoff even more so off the bench. Its not believable McDaniel would have been troubled that much by that game and Teddy looking disinterested is just some fan fiction silliness

 

Assuming McD wanted to win the game (I see no viable argument he was just there to experiment), then that means he didn't think Bridgewater was good enough to be the backup to Tua at that time. There's no way around that.

 

Even if you go with that Teddy was still ahead of Skylar every other week so based on your belief it would have had to be an experiment

 

Everything is an experiment. No exception. Each time Tua goes out there that's technically an experiment too. I'm saying it wasn't "just" an experiment. McD wanted to win, so he goes with the best available player which at that time was Skylar (in his mind). That was the point you contested. Unless you're willing to argue McD isn't trying to win, then there's no arguing against my position.

 

I believe that McDaniel believed they both needed full reps and only Skylar could get them

Or thought Skylar looked really good during the week

 

What does that mean? Both were cleared to play. Bridgewater proved he could play by coming in later in the game. Again.. do you or do you not agree he wanted to win? If yes, then he played the better of the two players (in his mind). No way around that. End of story.

 

He was cleared to play at the end of the week. McDaniel named Skylar before that when only Skylar could get full reps.

 

So? You're telling me a HC can't change his mind on who to start up until the start of the game? Look.. Bridgewater is a vet with 7+ years experience, and he can't beat out a 3rd stringer who had a bad game the week before and a week of practice? Just proves my point. The guy isn't worth having as a backup QB, and like I said in that original post I wouldn't be surprised if he's not on this team next year. btw.. if that happens that's conclusive proof McD doesn't think Bridgewater is worth having as a backup QB. We'll see.

 

Dude, please don't start acting like hitting 4k back then wasn't a big deal.

 

What are you talking about? When did I ever suggest that? He asked me how many hit 4000 yards a season during that time frame. I replied factually.

 

All he was doing was answering a question.

 

I'm sure he won't be on the team because he wasn't reliable