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Tua is not the Problem

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Galant, Nov 6, 2021.

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  1. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Add to this…

    Didn’t EVERYONE say going into the season our first 4 games were BRUTAL…and we’d all be ecstatic if we came out of that stretch at 2-2?

    We were 3-0 going into that game against Cincinnati…having beat the Patriots, Ravens AND the Bills. Even IF Tua hadn’t been knocked out of that game and we had still lost, wouldn’t a prudent person have still been thrilled with Miami’s first 4 games?

    Personally…with what I’ve seen the Dolphins do this season, had we not lost Tagovailoa in the Cincinnati game, I TRULY believe we would be undefeated right now.
     
  2. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    Those folks won't agree because there'll always be something they can shift their subjective opinions to focus on. Everybody's worried that they'll lose cred by admitting they were wrong. Count it as a win that they shifted from "he won't amount to anything, move on and replace him" to "all of those great stats are okay, but he might get hurt".
     
  3. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    You're quoting ESPN's QBR which we shouldn't use (it's a black box and not transparent formula). By passer rating it's:

    Tua #1 at 112.7
    Mahomes #2 at 109.5
    Geno Smith #3 at 107.2
    Allen is #4 at 105.9

    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2022/passing.htm
    Then come Hurts and Burrow.

    No way Geno Smith is staying up there. That's a bigger surprise than Tua IMO.
     
  4. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Who said I was arguing?
     
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  5. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Tua still number 1, right? :wink2:
     
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  6. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    I hope all sides can keep it civil. For peace of mind's sake, I think we can come here to enjoy ourselves and hope we can keep the discourse above the level of kids arguing on a playground. We're all fans of the team and all of our opinions, whether related to Tua or not, are based on what we believe will make the team successful.

    I've said things that have gotten personal and when called on it, I've been the first to admit that I was wrong to do it. In the end, we're all fans and none of us should be going low on somebody else.

    For the record: I respect the opinion of almost everybody who's posting here, including you. Even though we disagree on 80% of things related to Tua, we share opinions on probably 90% of everything else. Nobody should be attacking anybody because it'll spill over and every thread will be a b*tchfest. It's not necessary and none of us deserves being attacked for having the audacity to have a different opinion.

    Let's not give the mods a legitimate reason to lock what I believe to be a lively thread.
     
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  7. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    The thing is, if it wasn't for the 1st quarter fumble...maybe that's another TD pass a few plays later. And we ended the game in the red zone kneeling...maybe that's another TD pass a few plays later. Tua played exceptional the entire day.
     
  8. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

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    I haven’t watched any Seahawks games, only seen the highlights and read the post game reviews. I’m not going to bet on Geno falling, as the game reports are he’s legitimately balling out. No way I’m betting on him sustaining his play either given his prior history, but I am putting an asterisk next to his name as someone I may have to change my opinion about.
     
  9. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I have watched some Seahawks games. He is looking really good. I do not know if he can sustain it all season, however, he deserves to be in the conversation for MVP.
     
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  10. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    He was flawless. He even tucked it and ran a few times at the right moment. I swear if he can learn to do that with more consistency he will become unstoppable.
     
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  11. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

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    Week 1 - Tua can’t throw deep
    Week 2 - It was just one good quarter
    Week 3 - The Bills were missing half their starting D
    Week 4 - I told you he can’t stay healthy
    Week 7 - 4 Almost interceptions!
    Week 8 - It was only the Lions
     
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  12. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    The most important one is Tua is just a game manager and will never be an elite QB. Granted it's only 5 games, but to lead the league with a 112.7 passer rating after 186 attempts and twice carry the team to a win when much of the rest of the team was failing just blows away this narrative for now. As long as he ends up in the upper echelon of QBs this year he's "the solution" at QB, not "the problem" (directly answering the question of this thread). First true franchise QB since Marino.

    This season is worth watching. Finally, after all those miserable years!
     
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  13. Rocky Raccoon

    Rocky Raccoon Greasepaint Ghost Staff Member

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    Guys, I know the subject of Tua's play is a polarizing topic these days and I respect the passion of the debates, but I am asking all of you to be a little more respectful towards each other. We are getting multiple complaints about posts in this thread in all different directions.

    It has been a pretty fun season so far and I want everyone to be able to post about it, so please be better. I'm not going to individually warn anyone. This is for EVERYONE. Never attack the poster because you disagree with their stance. This ain't Twitter.

    Fins Up!
     
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  14. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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  15. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    Tua MVP and Dolphins Super Bowl win confirmed.
     
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  16. Fireland

    Fireland Well-Known Member

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    Imagine getting paid big bucks to come up with earth shattering sports takes like the Miami Dolphins will have trouble vs Buffalo in January.
     
  17. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    The game against the Lions was something Marino never did. I think that is impressive.
     
  18. Springveldt

    Springveldt Season Ticket Holder

    I take it you are looking forward to January then so you can come and say "I told you so"? :huh:

    Miami will fix this issue next season by having homefield advantage through the playoffs...
     
  19. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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  20. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    It won't take until January.
     
  21. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    Kurt Warner on the money .
     
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  22. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    What's he know about it?

    /casm
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2022
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  23. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    I wonder what Joy's saying? She's quick to bash her "favorite" team and hasn't spared Tua any of her harsh opinions in the past.
     
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  24. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    I think it's fair to say Tua doesn't have the strongest arm in the league. I don't think anyone has denied that. But, notice how he puts weakest in quotation marks.

    His arm is plenty fine for the NFL.

    I don't think that tweet means what you guys think it means. Not surprising though.
     
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  25. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    I was being sarcastic. Kurt Warner was in early on singing Tua's praises. He has no problem pointing out what he needs to work on, but he points out the nuances that make Tua a good QB.
     
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  26. Springveldt

    Springveldt Season Ticket Holder

    He’s already said Tua’s arm is fine as something like 95% of throws are under 30 yards. He’s been a Tua supporter this year.
     
  27. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    But that 5%...ohh that 5% matters the most. Get rid of him.
     
  28. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    It means exactly what it says, Tua has a weak arm compared to most NFL QBs, but it is mitigated by the scheme of the offense and the all star speedster recievers we have on the team, along with his quick decisions, quick release, anticipation, and accurate passing at short and medium ranges.

    It's basically the same setup he had at Alabama with a squad of all star recievers covering up his shortcomings and making his Job easier.

    Tua really does not have the arm to make all the throws, but with this supporting cast, he doesn't really need to in most situations. However when we go up against a good defense with a good secondary that tightens up the coverages, or when we have to play in the elements, then that is where his lack of arm strength will show up as an issue.

    His lack of arm strength, along with his suceptability to injury are the two major issues with Tua.
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2022
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  29. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    Well said. Better teams will get pressure on him, and that's where historically he's really struggled and tends to make dumb decisions. His opponents this season have been very weak. Reality will set in here soon enough.
     
  30. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    I don't know what kind of fandom this is, if any, but if you want to watch the games waiting (hoping) for failure, go right ahead. I can't see how that's fun or enjoyable especially with the way we have seen Tua play in this particular offense.
     
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  31. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I mean, Tua is manhandling the teams he's supposed to. For decades we've not seen that. It's certainly not realistic to expect any QB to go against top defenses and have career days. I'm interested to see what the drop off is.
     
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  32. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    Who is hoping for failure? Again, you are a troll and put words in people's mouths to fit your agenda.

    I'm saying reality will set in here. Like I hope I win Powerball, I'm rooting hard to win Powerball, but reality is going to set in soon enough. I'm not going to win Powerball.
     
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  33. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Reality is Tua is currently playing at elite QB levels. That is something many people here said was never going to happen. The claim was Tua is basically a game manager and at best slightly above average.

    So I think there should be some humbleness here claiming things like "reality is" Tua will fail at X, Y or Z when he's been proving otherwise for numerous predictions in the past. It's your opinion he'll fail, yes, but this isn't anywhere close to the odds of not winning Powerball.
     
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  34. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    This is beyond a terrible analogy.
     
  35. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    Even a Jests fan acknowledges...
     
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  36. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    LOL. You beat me to it.
     
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  37. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    Reality is it's a small sample against mostly poor teams and elite/generational weapons. It doesn't really prove much. This is the point. Start to play good teams, and keep these numbers where they are, and you have something. Until then it's a small sample that will likely normalize closer to career averages.
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2022
  38. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    Elite QBs can get it done even against good defenses and in bad weather. Lighting it up against a bad defense in a dome and with the human cheat code hill running wide open play after play is not that difficult.

    I want to see him succeed when the level of difficulty is a bit higher before I declare him elite and our franchise QB.
     
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  39. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    No that is not reality. Small sample yes, but not against "mostly poor teams". Tua played a full game against NE, Buffalo, Ravens, Pittsburgh and the Lions, and 40% of a game against Cinci.

    NE is 4-4, Buffalo is 6-1, Ravens are 5-3, Pittsburgh is 2-6 and Detroit is 1-6, with of course Cinci being 4-4. That's actually a good mixture of good/average/bad teams. It's definitely not "mostly poor teams". And despite you trying to dismiss the Buffalo win, no one else beat them injuries or not. That's reality.
     
  40. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    We've already been through this. Buffalo was missing most of their defensive team (Tua was 13/18 186 yards 1 TD). He scored 13 points against NE who is the only good defensive team he faced. Surprise surprise. The rest of the teams he faced are bottom 20 or lower in points allowed in the league with the Lions being dead last.
     
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