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Ross Refuses Questions

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Galant, Oct 26, 2021.

  1. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity

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  2. Rouk

    Rouk Well-Known Member

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    Man the amount of [cowardice] from the dolphins front office is hilarious. If you want watson man up and say it. Everyone already thinks you want watson. The qb for your team thinks you want watson. The pr nightmare isnt going anywhere. If you dont want watson then shut it down and stop the nonsense. Just hiding is ridiculous.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 26, 2021
  3. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    That’s what we‘ve been the last two decades, ridiculous, doesn’t seem it will change anytime soon. Only difference to the Lions is the location and no state income tax…
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 26, 2021
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  4. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

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    I’m laughing at the value of his franchise plummeting because he’s a moron and has no clue what he’s doing.
     
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  5. Daytona Fin

    Daytona Fin Active Member

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    Exactly, if it's so funny just say , we have zero interest in pursuing Watson, Tua is the future qb of this franchise. No backbone whatsoever. If anybody should be laughing, it should be the fans and the media at the the amount of playoff wins the Dolphins have since he bought the team. Ross is a clown owner, I'm sure all the owners are laughing at him silently when he enters a league meeting.
     
  6. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Since the value of this franchise is tanking, then I say we all pool all of our money together and buy the team ourselves...although "cbrad" and I would constantly fight and argue over the importance of a GOOD running back :sidelol:
     
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  7. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    Not defending Ross overall, but in this case, I don’t see this as that big of a deal. What did you expect him to say?
    This is how it is done. This is the game.
     
  8. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    Clueless as can be.
     
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  9. Rick 1966

    Rick 1966 Professional Hipshooter

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    No, the game would be to say "Tua is our QB and I have every faith and confidence in him." What he's doing is causing problems for Tua and the coaches without coming out and saying he's interested in Watson.
     
  10. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Fan ownership would be one of the best innovations this side of the Atlantic. In Germany's top soccer league the Bundesliga they enforce a 50+1 rule (with a few rare exceptions) that stipulates that members of the footballing Club (i.e., fans) own a majority of the shares of the team. Outside investors and thus "owners" can only own 49%. It's been a tremendous success, with the Bundesliga having by far the highest attendance per game in the world because fans are part of the process, not "customers". Competitiveness hasn't decreased either.

    In the NFL only the GB Packers are owned by fans, and they've done real well too. It's a great idea. We wouldn't be stuck with the likes of Ross, and crowd intelligence is often superior to that of experts. Oh, and we'd probably get both a good QB and a good RB!
     
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  11. Hooligan

    Hooligan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    First order of business,, the low-go.
     
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  12. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    Can't expect accountability from your players and coaches, if it doesn't even reflect in the owner.
     
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  13. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    This is a great idea, should have been implemented here a long time ago so we don't have to keep dealing with these clueless old oligarchs.
     
  14. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    Or Dan Snyders of the world. Any other planet he would be behind bars.
     
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  15. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    That’s only partly true. It’s not like the fans own the team. The team has a President and the Fans (actually only paying members of the Club) get to vote that President. The reason they did the 50+1 rule, is that the team can’t relocate or be selled somehow and sadly it‘s not really an success because there are quite a few teams that bend that rule or are getting exceptions from the league and that‘s the reason why a lot of traditional clubs relegated to the 2nd Division because of those „fake“ teams. I actually like the system they run in the US a lot better because everybody has the same chances and it‘s fairer then over here in Europe and especially Germany.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2021
  16. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

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    I don’t know how much the ownership structure has attributed to their success vs landing back to back HoF QB’s which basically only one other franchise can boast. If anything, you could say they’ve underperformed over these 30 years.
     
  17. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Not being able to replace the owner is very similar to not being able to replace the leader of a country. No it's not better to have what is essentially a dictatorship power structure unless ownership changes hands based on performance. For owners that invest in teams more as an investment rather than as a fan that probably works out, but there are many owners like Ross that don't intend to sell no matter what. You're seeing the downsides of this type of "dictatorship" structure that you don't see with 50+1. So while no system is perfect, allowing sole ownership with no competition (fans don't change teams as easily as they would with commercial products due to emotional attachment) is worse than forcing the team to be responsive to the fans.
     
  18. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    No one knows how much ownership structure affects success, but you can see with the dysfunction here in Miami that it clearly does. And there's no way you can argue Green Bay has underperformed. They've been publicly owned since 1923 so the entire SB era counts. They have 5 SB wins, which is 1 shy of the top two teams Pittsburgh and NE. They're also top 7 in winning percentage, playoff appearances and playoff wins.

    Also, over the entire SB era GB went through their fair share of changes at GM, HC and QB. They've had 11 HC's and 13 starting QB's that coached/started a minimum of 6 games in at least one season throughout the SB era. Yes, their SB's came when they had 3 very good QB's: Starr, Favre and Rodgers, but that just shows how important the QB is AND their ability to land a very good QB 3 times in the last 55 years, which is quite a bit better than most teams.

    Hard to argue with that much turnover that ownership structure has no influence. Anyway, at minimum it's clear public ownership would prevent the kind of mess we're seeing with Miami and Ross.
     
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  19. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

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    I’m talking about having 2 HoF QB’s over 30 years and only winning 2 Super Bowls.

    I’m not arguing that ownership structure doesn’t impact things. Rather landing Favre and Rodgers can hide a lot of bad decisions. Conversely, Miami not having a franchise QB for 20+ years makes every bad decision that much more amplified.
     
  20. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    Well that 50+1 one thing is probably going vanish soon anyway, because it's all about the money, that's the main reason why attendance numbers in the German Bundesliga are going down and the 50+1 rule is a farce anyway because there are more then a few teams with exception rules that have more money because of it, so they get the better players and there is less room for teams with tradition. I'd rather have a fair competition like you got in American pro sports unlike in the Bundesliga where Bayern has like 200% more money for their roster then Eintracht Frankfurt for instance and the gap is getting bigger and bigger...
     
  21. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Who selects the QBs? Or decides when to select a new one? Over 55 years ownership structure has a major effect on that, so being able to land two HoF QBs back-to-back is a sign of good management.

    As far as what is expected with 2 HoF QB over 30 years, 2 SBs is close to expected. With a passer rating of 1 standard deviation above the mean (which is where "elite" QBs on average tend to lie) you have a 6.3% probability of winning the SB in any given year. In other words, over 15 years with an elite QB your expectation is about 1 SB win. It's not much more than that.
     
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  22. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Check out the Yankees with their massive discrepancy in salary vs. many other baseball teams. The money issue you talk about isn't a 50+1 issue as much as a salary cap issue. The NFL used to also not have a salary cap pre-1994 and you had lopsided salaries for different teams. So I'd separate ownership structure from salary cap. 50+1 with a salary cap would solve the issue you're talking about.
     
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  23. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    That's interesting. The Marlins effectively "built" championship teams twice right before the team was sold in each instance. Since their success rate was so high, I figured it was common across baseball. Maybe not though.

    Side note- I loved the movie Moneyball and the idea of using metrics over dollars to build a championship team.
     
  24. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Yeah the Marlins were a bit of an exception. But in general, it's the teams that shell out higher salaries that tend to win the World Series. Yankees for example have won 27 WS while the next closest is the Cardinals with 11. That's massive, just like in European soccer.
     
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  25. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    50+1 with salary cap would be great, but I don't think there is such a thing in Pro-Sports world wide, at least not from what I know. The Packers being the lone exception. But 50+1 in Bundesliga is a joke nothing more and Football in Europe is nothing like it used to be, then I'd rather have fair competition like in the States, even if bigger market teams have an slight advantage.
     
  26. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    Well from what you are saying the problem is the exception rules. What you need to do is get rid of the exception rules, not change the whole system. I don't think you want to have clueless oligarchs owning your teams.
     
  27. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    Well that is what is happening with soccer here in Europe + no cap + no draft just look at the Premier League and what they tried to do with the new Super League which luckily failed. Things over here are way worse, then what is going on in the States at least when it comes to the Pro Sports...
     
  28. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Worth pointing out that one reason the Super League failed was 50+1 preventing Bayern and Dortmund from joining. If Bayern and Dortmund had joined I think you would have had a Super League. Also worth pointing out that forming the Super League is precisely following the US model, and that was pushed by US banks and in some cases US owners.
     
  29. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    I don’t think 50+1 played a big role in the failing of the Super League there were enough other reasons why it didn’t happen, European Football is quite complicated… :)
     
  30. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    It was widely reported that it played a major role — arguably second only to the intense level of fan/player/federation protests against the SL — and it's been central to the Super League discussion post-demise. The (English) Football Supporters' Association has publicly stated that it wants the 50+1 model implemented in the UK precisely to prevent the will of fans from being ignored to the extent it was.

    So the very rule you criticize not only helped keep two German powerhouses from defecting, it is also seen as the antidote to the formation of an American-style Super League that you're against.

    Oh, and on that note, there's something contradictory in your views here because on one hand you say you prefer the American-style model in Pro Sports, which is precisely what the Super League represents, but then on the other hand say you're against the SL. So something isn't adding up. Maybe it's 50+1? :smile:

    btw.. I would actually love to see a Super League for competitive purposes, but these things don't happen in a vacuum. In Europe, the powerhouse clubs subsidize the entire football association, so the health of the entire game in that country depends to some degree on them. So I understand the loss that would be incurred.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2021
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  31. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    The Fan protests were reason number one + the **** shat with the UEFA and FIFA + the TV Contracts + the Local Leagues (Serie A, Premier League) + you've got the Super League with the Champions League already and on, and on, and on...Those are the main reasons why it didn't work.
    I don't criticize 50+1 in general just how it's applied in the Bundesliga where teams like Leipzig, Wolfsburg, Hoffenheim are allowed to play even though they don't have 50+1 in place which costs other Traditional Teams their spot in the first division because they got way more money then 50+1 teams.



    It's not contradictory because European Soccer and American Pro Sports are 2 totally different worlds when it comes to how they are built up. What I prefer about the American Style Model in Pro Sports is that every team has about the same chance to win the Championship + you've got the draft to even things out even more. I know there is Bigger Market Teams who have an slight advantage but in the Bundesliga it's totally different Bayern for instance pays 200% more money on their roster compared to my teams roster + there is no draft which helps the bad teams. If your're bad you relegate...
     
  32. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Of course it's contradictory. The proposed Super League IS the equivalent of the NFL in soccer. You wouldn't have relegation and you would arguably have even more competition than in the NFL (all the teams they wanted to include are powerhouses and spend tons of money), so yeah it's contradictory to say you like the American Pro-Sports model and be against the Super League.
     
  33. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    My team would not be in the Super League but it could win the Champions League although that's very unlikely and as I said European Football and American Sports are two different worlds...
     
  34. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Which team do you root for? I follow Dortmund because Reyna is there (RARE hope for American soccer).
     
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  35. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    Look at my logo ;). Eintracht Frankfurt is my team and they’re quite similar to the Dolphins. Maybe I like to torture myself or shouldn’t be such a homer.
     
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