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How would you feel with a Trevor Lawrence NY Jet QB

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Dorfdad, Oct 17, 2020.

  1. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I talked about this in another thread- I can honestly see us winning 5 of 6 or the next 6 straight if the team stays on this level. I'm not counting on it but it's absolutely possible if we're playing like we have recently.
     
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  2. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    He is a far better prospect than Elway, Peyton and Andrew Luck. He is as cant miss as there has ever been. He would have gone #1 overall in last years draft despite the numbers Burrow put in. The intangibles, leadership, mechanics, athleticism, that arm.. he is the most complete prospect I have ever seen.

    The scary part is the coach the Jets would hire.. if they get Lincoln Riley or Dabo, with all those first round picks they have from Seattle (Jamal Adams trade got them 2 first rounders) and possibly getting a late first/2nd round pick from Darnold.. things look terrible now for the Jets but it can look a whole lot different two years from now..
     
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  3. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    The way I predicted our season record was just going through each game and picking ones I thought we could in theory win without playing perfectly. I came up with 9 winnable games to start the year.

    Though we wont win all of those games obviously, we will also win one or two we expect to lose because it's the NFL.

    So I dont expect us to run off that many in a row but I do think we have a shot in each of those games at minimum.

    In the end I predicted 8-8 give or take a game so I'll stick with that for now.
     
  4. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    There is no way they bring back Gase if they post the leagues worst record, and no any prospective new coach would sign off on keeping Darnold VS drafting Lawrence. Hell, even Gase wouldn't, drafting a new QB gives him the chance to extend his stay more than keeping Darnold.

    Also keep in mind, Joe Douglas didn't draft Darnold.

    Passing on Lawrence would be the Jestiest thing ever. Well, Lawrence staying in school specifically to avoid them would be, but the point is there.
     
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  5. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    There is no way they bring back Gase if they post the leagues worst record, and no any prospective new coach would sign off on keeping Darnold VS drafting Lawrence. Hell, even Gase wouldn't, drafting a new QB gives him the chance to extend his stay more than keeping Darnold.

    Also keep in mind, Joe Douglas didn't draft Darnold.

    Passing on Lawrence would be the Jestiest thing ever. Well, Lawrence staying in school specifically to avoid them would be, but the point is there.
     
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  6. DolphinGreg

    DolphinGreg Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    First off, there's no sense debating Trevor Lawrence's abilities. He's as perfect a candidate to build around as there ever has been. He's got virtually every physical trait you could want. He's clean and responsible off the field. He comes from a smart coaching staff. He treats his role with respect. He successfully replaced a prior great in Deshaun Watson. There's nothing to really debate with Trevor Lawrence.

    The question is about the NFL where single players can still end up on average or below-average teams. I think Trevor's good enough to be in the strata of Wilson, Rodgers and Mahomes. That said, look at Deshaun Watson on the Texans this year. He's a great player but a bad team is a bad team. We've seen Matt Ryan and Drew Brees sink to losing records for the same reason.

    So IMHO Lawrence would check one box for the Jets but there would still be many, many others things to do. Could the Jets do those things and build a real team? That's the question.
     
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  7. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I wouldnt call Watson a great QB. Hes definitely second tier at minimum in the NFL.
     
  8. DolphinGreg

    DolphinGreg Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Actually, if you compare Deshaun Watson's first 3 seasons with those of Russell Wilson the statistical output, the overall efficiency and the knack for making impossible plays look easy is there with both guys in a strikingly similar way. They both have a career passer rating over 100 (and achieved that early on) which is insanely great.

    The TDs, INTs, Y/A....it's all basically the same. The difference is that one guy played on a team that was capable of dominating it's division and ultimately contending for titles while the other guy played for a questionable coach who recently got fired and has had to repeatedly spark his team and lift it up.

    Rather than saying one guy is "great" and another isn't, it's actually better to use the two as an example of how much a QB's surroundings dictate not only the overall outcome but (judging by your take) the narrative that gets applied by fans/media wherein one guy is applauded while another isn't.

    Truth is, a QB couldn't be much greater than Deshaun Watson has been.
     
  9. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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  10. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Oh my gosh, that would be the best outcome ever! Lawrence goes #1 overall to the Jets, poses with his green hat/jersey for the cameras, then abruptly says no thanks a few days later and returns for his senior season at Clemson. I thought I saw a new rule a few months ago where that would be a possibility- I swear that would make my top-10 Jets plays of all time!

    Sorry JT & your game-winning pick-6 against the Jets....Trevor could have that one beaten!
     
  11. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    I would rather Trevor Lawrence go to the Jets then the Pittsburgh Steelers try and make a crazy off season play for him. This wouldn't be the first time the #1 overall draft pick was drafted by one team and then traded to another due to the a player refusing to play for the team that drafted him.
     
  12. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I'm not exactly sure what it means, aside from Wilson the Seahawks roster (on offense) is bad. Wilson has done it with lesser weapons.

    I just know if I'm picking a QB to lead my team Watson would probably be just barely in the top ten.
     
  13. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    They have some serious talent on defense, including hall of fame linebacker Bobby Wagner. Plus Metcalf is a beast.
     
  14. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    Right as you were quoting me I added the "on offense".
     
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  15. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Fair enough.
     
  16. Hooligan

    Hooligan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Don't you almost feel sorry for Jest fans? Almost? No? Me neither.
     
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  17. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    To be fair, Trevor Lawrence can run from our defenders faster than Joe Flacco. So there's that. Personally, let the Jests get Lawrence. I think he'll do well unless he's put into a horrible situation. And although I'm not comparing them, I said the same thing about Sam Darnold.

    So there's that.
     
  18. DolphinGreg

    DolphinGreg Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The one thing I do appreciate is that the NY media is very quick and more than willing to call out ineptitude when they see if.

    That much I do appreciate. There's nothing better than listening to Jets media people bemoan being Jets fans, LOL.
     
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  19. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I think the Jets are doing a tank year without actually claiming it like we did. I'm hoping I'm wrong and the only way to prove that is the Jets winning....so I'm actually rooting for them this year.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
  20. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End Club Member

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    Miserable because I really like the guy and would hate to have to start hating him because he is a Jest.
     
  21. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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  22. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I'll be honest, I dont mind a player going back to school but i do mind a guy just refusing to play for a team when his college days are up.

    The reason a team is drafting you so high is that they believe you are part of creating a new winning culture. It kind of reeks of self importance from the player, thinking they should be able to choose what situation they go into.
     
  23. Rick 1966

    Rick 1966 Professional Hipshooter

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    When a team has destroyed one QB after another for years and years, maybe they don't deserve the benefit of the doubt that they are able to create a new, winning culture.
     
  24. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    Players still dont just get to choose to play or not somewhere in my opinion. Unless you're a free agent.

    This is the process of entering the NFL, to me it's just being a baby and avoiding the process.
     
  25. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I see both sides. I mean, look at a guy like Tannehill. Miami almost cost him a nice paycheck and, probably more importantly to him, the respect of people around the league. Going to the wrong team can ruin your career, your legacy, and potential earnings.
     
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  26. Puka-head

    Puka-head My2nd Fav team:___vs Jets Club Member

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    Seek professional help, you are clearly having some kind of breakdown. Don't despair, there is hope, or drugs, either one would work for you.
     
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  27. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    I get what you’re saying but the only reason a team is drafting you so high (in this case the Jets) is because they suck to the highest level of sucktivity.

    Now when you tear everything away, bottom line, professional football is a job. There are 32 employers in this particular profession. It’s not slavery. If I as one of these employees had the chance to get a job with a company that sucks or one that is good or great I’m going to try and get hired by the employer that doesn’t suck. If one of those other employers is willing to do what they have to do to hire me, so be it. If not, my choices are work for company (team) that sucks or don’t work (play) for the employer that want to hire (draft) me.

    In the case of the Jets, they’re one if the perineal jokes of the NFL. I wouldn’t want to play for them even if they offered me all of Trumps money.
     
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  28. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    That made me think of an interesting point. Rookies are free agents....until they declare for the NFL draft. So what would happen if a team convinced Lawrence (or any high profile player they liked) to not declare for the draft? Think about it- every college player going to the next level could freely choose who they wanted to play for.

    Now take that to the next level- why should ANYONE declare for the NFL draft? If Lawrence bypassed that process, he could negotiate a deal for more money with the team he wants to play for and on his own terms. Now all of a sudden, everything changes...you have to treat rookies like people and show them reasons to join your team. If your offensive coordinator or your head coach sucks, top QB's aren't coming to you for career suicide. I think it would be freakin' awesome...just say no to the NFL draft!
     
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  29. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    Until the Patriots get every player lol
     
  30. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I wouldnt want to either, but it's exactly why the draft exists. So that teams in bad locations or with bad players can have a hope of attaining talent.

    I'm pretty sure most QB dont want the Jets to draft them, but they still need a QB. You're right it isnt slavery, but they will be making millions regardless so I dont really make the comparison.

    It's the Jets so I'll laugh if it happens, just saying generally.
     
  31. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    So the thing is you arent drafting the player but the rights to sign the player in the league. See this from google:

    "College players automatically are eligible for the NFL Draft without a declaration when they exhaust their college football eligibility or graduate from college. or once five years have passed since the player entered college"

    The team that drafts you holds your rights for a few seasons before you can become a FA.
     
  32. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I tried to research that as well & see if they could opt out...and I'm not sure. Just because you're eligible shouldn't mean it's forced. Of course the NFL wants them in the draft since it makes things nice & neat, but I'm not sure if it's legal to force someone to participate in the draft vs free agency. It's interesting.
     
  33. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    The NFL doesnt have to let anyone play technically. It's why you cant come out of HS straight to the pros, even though it's a bad idea for the NFL anyway. They can basically choose what makes you eligible to play like a game show or contest.

    So I'm sure someone could file a case and it would be looked at, but I dont know that they would win.
     
  34. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I mean, look at Wake's path...he went to Canada for a few years. That was probably because he wasn't drafted, but still...he got to choose his own fate. Hundred of other players try to walk on each year as well, but again....it's because they weren't drafted and a lot of them weren't even on a team's radar.

    I'm just curious if you can refuse to enter the draft but still remain eligible to play that season (if you happen to get hired)- that's the answer I can't find.
     
  35. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    The thing is once you're eligible you dont have to declare and you cant undeclare.

    Wake went through a draft cycle after college which created his eligibility to go anywhere.

    For a player, let's say Lawrence, to do what you're asking they would have to not be drafted when they are eligible regardless of whether they officially declare.

    Once they have gone through a draft cycle with eligibility and not been selected they can go anywhere. If they are selected but dont intend to play, that team still owns their rights a few years.

    So if Kyler had decided to play baseball, Arizona could still have taken him and owned his rights if he changed his mind.
     
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  36. Dorfdad

    Dorfdad Well-Known Member

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  37. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I think it would be silly because generally the team that goes #1 is a mess. So he would be trading one mess for another mess.
     
  38. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Are you positive about that last part? I could have swore I saw something earlier this year that players could un-declare for the draft due to COVID. If it's a forced/automatic draft like you say then I think it would be unconstitutional.

    You're probably right, I just found the whole thing really interesting from a legal & business standpoint. I can't find the exact words that say players are forced to participate in the draft though once they graduate.
     
  39. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    That would take a person to sue to try to get it changed.
     
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  40. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Yup, so here's hoping the NFL enters me into the 2021 draft so I can sue them! Hey, my daughter is 19 and a former band nerd, maybe they'll draft her!
     

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