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Marino

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by GARDENHEAD, Oct 8, 2018.

  1. GARDENHEAD

    GARDENHEAD Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Dan Marino is the greatest QUARTERBACK of all time. If you think you’re cute by calling him the greatest PASSER of all time you’re just lame. There’s no real distinction. It’s a cop out.
     
  2. Redwine4all

    Redwine4all Well-Known Member

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    Totally disagree. To me, hes not in the conversation.
     
  3. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    WTF do you mean he's not in the conversation. Nobody has ever been able to throw the rock like marino and no one probably ever will. You let him play on amy of the teams montana, brady or manning played in and he would have won more rings than he could fit on his hands. It's not his fault we always gave a ****ty team with no defense and no running game to help him out. Even then just having marino made us competitive.
     
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  4. GARDENHEAD

    GARDENHEAD Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ok.
     
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  5. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    It's crazy that some people say Marino isn't in the conversation...but throw out guys like Brady or Montana. Neither of those guys could do the things with the ball that Marino did.
     
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  6. Redwine4all

    Redwine4all Well-Known Member

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    He had one magical season...he had a great career. But in my mind, Elway was better. As well as Favre. Peyton. Brady. Brees. I'd say hes on par with Rivers and Roethlisberger, Moon, and Fouts.

    But no way was Dan the best.
     
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  7. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    WTF are you smoking. Did you even watch marino play? Elway was better? Elway didnt win anything until the end of his career when they built a great team around him with a great defense and a monster running game. Marino never had that and he still put up way better numbers than elway. Elway was a great QB, but marino was just on another level than anybody else. GTFO here comparing him to roethlisberger and rivers. You have no clue what you are talking about.
     
  8. GARDENHEAD

    GARDENHEAD Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Roethlisberger...ha ha
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 12, 2018
  9. Dorfdad

    Dorfdad Well-Known Member

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    Redwine I ***** and moan a lot around here as well but man can I ask you why do you even like the dolphins what is or was the deciding factor for you to become a fan? I grew up watching Dan and I can tell you without a shade of doubt he is in the conversation. All time leader in almost every category before the rules were changed to coddle the QB’s. Single handily won many games for us and took us to the Super Bowl and deep into playoffs almost yearly for a good run.

    I would kill to have a QB with the fire Marino had on this team. He was to me the Man! No one could pass like him or co trim the pocket better.

    If you Dislike Marino why are you a fan of the team?
     
  10. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Good thing that troll wasn't a rattlesnake in disguise. You'd be in the hospital right about now. =)
     
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  11. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    If u put Marino in his.prime in this ****ty defenseless league of today.Even with these ****ty coaches and teams we have had.He would throw 50 tds every year.
     
  12. canesz06

    canesz06 Well-Known Member

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    I agree with a lot of what you say about Tannehill but Wtf are you talking about "not in the conversation"? Marino is the ONLY reason the dolphins were good back then. He is one of the best there ever was, if not the best. I really don't believe in "trolls" on this site, cause who would bother wasting their time but your comments on Marino sure sound like you're just trying to get a rise out of people
     
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  13. canesz06

    canesz06 Well-Known Member

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    And as ****ty as the team is now, we'd be in the playoffs every year just because of him
     
  14. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    I truly believe that!The game was never over with marino.
    I knew sundays game was over even with 3.30 left down only by 3.That **** never would cross my mind all those years with Dan under center.
     
  15. bbqpitlover

    bbqpitlover Well-Known Member

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    My sister is a Tannehill supporter and she always says its not his fault its the offensive line, I like to remind her many times Marino had a bad offensive line and he wasnt sacked or picked off a lot like Tannehill is. Marino had three things Tannehill does not have.
    1.Field vision- He didn't lock on one player he saw the whole field.
    2. Presence in the pocket, Marino could sense pressure and move up in the pocket without even seeing the pressure.
    3. A winners mentality, even if bad teams built around him he still won, fans were always on the edge of their seats knowing Marino could lead them back.
     
  16. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    Those who truly know the game and understand the way it has changed since Marino retired, especially after 2005, understand that if Marino played in today's NFL he would be putting up video game type numbers every game. Marino did was Drew Brees is doing now in an era where DBs were allowed to mug WRs all the way down the field.
     
  17. Redwine4all

    Redwine4all Well-Known Member

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    I don't understand the need to personally attack some that expresses an opinion one disagrees with. I guess it's new society we live in. Not only is one wrong, they are stupid and malevolent.

    I loved Marino...loved watching him play. But imo, hes not top 5. That's all.
     
  18. Redwine4all

    Redwine4all Well-Known Member

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    Not at all. I had no idea it would cause people to lose their minds.
     
  19. canesz06

    canesz06 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think anyone is losing their mind but what do you expect when you talk negatively about the greatest player in the franchise's history. And for the record, I think he was the best. The teams around him just weren't very good. In his "one magical season" if we would have had even a hint of a defense, we probably wouldnt have lost any games. I can still see Roger Craig running across the middle and Joe Montana throwing little dump passes to him for huge gains cause Jackie Ship couldn't cover him, in super bowl 19.
     
  20. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Yeah Marino is DEFINITELY in the conversation. However, I think almost no one outside of this fanbase ranks him top 3 (just google all kinds of QB rankings and Marino is often ranked 5-10). I did a purely objective ranking based only on adjusting passer ratings both for era and for defense (points allowed) and Marino came in #10, at least among QB's with 4000+ yards passing since 1978. Here's that post for reference:
    https://www.thephins.com/threads/how-much-of-a-diva-was-landry.93018/page-12#post-3077291

    If you just go by efficiency stats, the guy that keeps coming out on top is Steve Young. If you go by total wins added over a career the top two are Peyton Manning and Drew Brees (Marino was 4th on that list.. post #475 in that same link).
     
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  21. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    Yep. Their defense was GREAT in the regular season, but totally crapped the bed in the Super Bowl. The Dolphins had the #1 ranked offense while the 49ers had the 2nd ranked. The Dolphins defense was ranked 7th while the 49ers were ranked 1st. If the Dolphins defense had shown up that game it would have at least been a lot closer.

    I get it that some may not consider Marino the GOAT. I think there are legitimate arguments for other being the GOAT. But to actually say that Marino isn't in the convo is absurd. I'm sure he's basing this opinion on the fact that the TEAM never won a Super Bowl. I mean, Marino held every single passing record in the NFL and he shattered the old ones. And he did so during a time when the QB could be murdered and WR's could be raped.

    The only QB's that I would consider over Marino are Rodgers and Manning.

    Claiming that Marino is like Rothlesburger and Rivers? That person is out of their mind.
     
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  22. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    Mostly because of the Super Bowl thing. Which, IMO, is laziness.
     
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  23. GARDENHEAD

    GARDENHEAD Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Nope.

    You're clearly silly for saying Dan Marino is in the same class as Roethlisberger...on a Dolphins message board. Its got nothing to do with "society today." Know your audience.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 12, 2018
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  24. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Yeah, when it comes to Montana and Brady, they're judged on their teams Super Bowl wins. Marino gets ignored because his TEAM never won a Super Bowl. It's why people consider Elway better now.

    So lazy.
     
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  25. Redwine4all

    Redwine4all Well-Known Member

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    I didn't talk negatively. He was a great player. I respect your reasoning. I disagree. Is that even allowed?
     
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  26. Redwine4all

    Redwine4all Well-Known Member

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    ROFLMAO. Alrighty then.
     
  27. canesz06

    canesz06 Well-Known Member

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    Of course its allowed. Im not bashing you, just STRONGLY disagreeing with you
     
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  28. Redwine4all

    Redwine4all Well-Known Member

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    And I respect that. I love passionate arguments. But too often today it devolves into "you're an idiot, a fool, and a bad person". Civility is lost.

    I think the best QB of all time was actually Johnny Unitas. But most here have never seen him play.
     
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  29. Patster1969

    Patster1969 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    God, that brings back horrible nightmares - 1st quarter looked good but the defense just didn't turn up for the last 3
     
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  30. Patster1969

    Patster1969 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The interesting thing is listening to current QB's talking about Marino and how he was the number 1 in terms of production & his ability- he would have feasted with the passing rules today
     
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  31. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    How in the hell did this thread get started with no context behind it?

    Everyone knows Marino was the greatest. And?
     
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  32. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End Club Member

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    Look, If I can have ANY QB that ever played the game in the history of the NFL, It's Dan Marino. Period. Sure I'm a Dolphins fan and even watched Marino starting in his Junior year at Pitt, but I have never, EVER seen ANYBODY release the ball like him with more accuracy. I still remember one of those stupid QB competitions and it went to the last throw and Marino had to throw a dead center strike on a moving target something like 60 yards away. The guy drilled it, dead center on a frozen rope. INSANE. There would be no doubt if we could have managed a couple Super Bowl wins while we had him, I rue the day when Arnsparger moved on and that idiot Tom Olivadotti took over the defense.
     
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  33. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Wow. I can't really see what's going on here, but I have a good idea by reading what I can see. All I can say is this, some of you need to start utilizing that block feature we have. It makes life easier in times like this.

    As for Marino, I wish there was a way of seeing what his numbers would look like in today's NFL. I wish there was an easy way to say, just add 15% to yards and TD's or something. Maybe cbrad, you can look at the trends on how things have increased over the years since he played and we can get some sort of statistical comparison? Of course, it's never going to be correct, but maybe it can give an idea.

    The game has definitely changed since Dan played. No doubt in my mind his numbers would be in line with, and likely beyond those of the players who have surpassed him now. It's "easy" for guys like Bree's, Brady, Manning now to rack up yards with the rules so heavily in favor of the offense. So it's hard to really get an idea how they all compare.

    Watching him play though, all statistics aside, if you can't see he's one of the best to ever play the position regardless of the era, then I'm not sure what you're looking at. His arm, his accuracy, his release, his fire, his leadership, his awareness, his pocket presence, all that typically without a running game and complete team around him essentially. You can't factor in the lack of a Super Bowl title IMO. I get it, that's the end game here, that's the ultimate goal, but plenty of times there's guys who are great, but just may not even win it. Look at hockey. Ovechkin is a great example. It took him how long to get the Stanley Cup in his hands? Does that mean he's bad? No. He's an incredible talent. Should be regarded as one of the tops to play the game as well. He's got one title though, compared to how many for Crosby? Not taking anything away from him, but his TEAMS have been far more stacked around him. If Dan Marino is an example of anything, it's how it takes a TEAM, not just one player to succeed at the highest level of any sport. Sticking with hockey, Connor McGregor is another example. He's already better than both guys previously mentioned IMO and he's never been past the fist round of the playoffs because the rest of the team is lacking.

    I assume this whole debate came up because of Drew Brees breaking the record last night for passing yards, and how it got to this, I'm not sure. One thing is clear though, and we all already know this, but we made the wrong choice years ago. Imagine if we signed Brees... that still haunts me. Although, with the parade of coaches and poor front office folks we've had here theres no guarantee he'd have excelled here either. It's really a great pairing between him and Payton that's helped. Again though, that's more proof how it's not always just about the player and his individual talent. The right situation, staff, system, and team have alot to do with it. Not taking anything away from Drew with that statement either.
     
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  34. Dorfdad

    Dorfdad Well-Known Member

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    Still kills me we could have had Drew Brees but chose Daunte Culpepper over him. This team keeps making mistakes. Imagine where we would be right now from that perspective. We may be ruling the AFC and had 2 Superbowls.
     
  35. Dorfdad

    Dorfdad Well-Known Member

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    His Pocket Presence and release were second to NONE. Didn't have the rings so you can bash him on that. Never had the team around him needed to get the ring.
     
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  36. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    The big difference to me about Marino if he played now instead of then, the Patriots dynasty wouldnt exist. Mind you they still wouldve gotten a super bowl or 2, but all those divisional champs they had, would have been split in half.

    The yardage and touchdowns would have been about the same or maybe less as Brees currently has. To say marino would have thrown so and so on this era is kind of weird to say, considering it takes more than just the quarterback to get the stats. 71k is a ton of yards, Favre reached that point at the very end of his career when he was below average.. brees is still a top 3 quarterback and may reach 85k when he is done..
     
  37. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Well, that's what I was saying though, I wouldn't bash him on that. It's more indicative of this being a team sport over anything IMO. If you just study his play, and his achievements, it stands on it's on merits in support of Marino being high atop the list and very much in the conversation. It's only because of the lack of super bowls that people discredit him.

    I'd be curious of the perception if he had a ring. Just one. I'm sure it'd be different for alot of people, and those people are wrong IMO.
     
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  38. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    I guess we can start with passer ratings adjusted to 2017 where league average was 86.9

    Marino 2017-adjusted ratings:
    1983: 109.91
    1984: 124.35
    1985: 99.43
    1986: 108.48
    1987: 103.08
    1988: 96.32
    1989: 88.39
    1990: 92.86
    1991: 97.85
    1992: 98.21
    1993: 108.65
    1994: 98.87
    1995: 99.63
    1996: 99.22
    1997: 90.84
    1998: 88.79
    1999: 75.97

    So except for his last few years he was well above average, and sometimes elite.

    Oh, and stats for that record breaking year 1984 would look like this in 2017:
    Yards: 5540
    Y/A: 9.2
    TD's: 51
    Passer rating: 124.35
     
  39. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    How exactly did you go about adjusting those passer ratings & stats?
     
  40. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Divide by league average for that stat in that year and multiply by league average for that stat in 2017.
     
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