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List of TBAUM's failed decisions

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by hitman8, Nov 26, 2017.

  1. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    Seriously I would like to put together a comprehensive list of all the failed decisions TBAUM has made with the dolphins. He seriously should have been fired two seasons ago.

    1. Overpaying for SUH
    2. Trading for kiko and Maxwell
    3. Overpaying to extend a mediocre Kiko
    4. Overpaying to extend a very mediocre branch
    5. Giving up three picks for caroo
    6. Wasting a second round pick on Jordan Phillips
    7. Drafting an injured and injury prone devante Parker.
    8. Drafting a very overrated and flawed player in Charles harris.
    9. Not signing any guards in the off-season or drafting a good one in all his time here, this is about 5 fails in one as he wiffed on at least 4 different guard draft picks.
    10. Signing an over the hill Lawrence Timmons while at the same time passing on a cheaper Zach Brown who is just entering his prime.
    11. Resigning an injured koa misi
    12. Trading Jay Ajayi for a late 4th round pick
    13. Signing Mario williams
    14. Greg Jennings over Michael crabtree

    That's my preliminary list off the top of my head. Feel free to add more.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2017
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  2. miamiron

    miamiron There's always next year

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    Made Grier his GM
    Signed Cutler for $10 million
    That $10 million could have gone a long way in 2018
    Tunsil not what we thought he was
    Mario Williams
     
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  3. tirty8

    tirty8 Well-Known Member

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    Greg Jennings over Michael Crabtree
     
  4. Fame

    Fame Well-Known Member

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    But it’s clearly all the fault of the coaches.
     
  5. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

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    I think the maxwell/alonso trade was, overall, a good thing for the phins.

    However, the draft, has been unkind, which has been due to him taking risks on players with injury concerns as well as overpaying for Carroo. However he has gotten more positive impact with later picks than Ireland so overall not a disaster.

    He has overpaid for FA talent.

    Neglecting OG and LB (LB was partially addressed this year, but too late).

    However, I think the biggest problem is a culture problem. Miami seems to be full of players who think that they are owed a living by virtue of being in the NFL. You don’t see many worker bees dedicating the selves to their craft the way teams like New England and Pittsburgh get their players to behave.

    Miami’s problem is primarily an attitude problem, not a coaching problem or a talent problem. Tbaum doesn’t seem to be doing much to fix that. I think the failure to address OG shows the players that the FO isn’t serious about winning so when adversity comes along they don’t feel the need to dig deep.
     
  6. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    1. Overpaying for SUH. We did not overpay since Suh is a once in a generation talent- we paid fair wage.

    2. Trading for kiko and Maxwell. We didn't trade for Kiko or Maxwell, they were a perk in a favorable draft pick trade.

    3. Overpaying to extend a mediocre Kiko. He's been better than mediocre and he's still relatively cheap- good move.

    4. Overpaying to extend a very mediocre branch Branch played well last year...did your crystal ball point to him regressing? You should have told someone!

    8. Drafting a very overrated and flawed player in Charles harris. WAY TOO SOON to say that, especially since he's made two clutch plays to help generate our four wins.

    9. Not signing any guards in the off-season or drafting a good one in all his time here, this is about 5 fails in one as he wiffed on at least 4 different guard draft picks. We brought in free agent guards and drafted one. Lying doesn't help in making your point.

    10. Signing an over the hill Lawrence Timmons while at the same time passing on a cheaper Zach Brown who is just entering his prime. Timmons has played well and he's a 1-year placeholder for McMillian. Smart move.

    11. Resigning an injured koa misi He's been solid for awhile now- not great, not horrible. Hardly a reason to say fire a GM.

    12. Trading Jay Ajayi for a late 4th round pick. Ajayi was and still is a self-serving bum. Very bold move by Gase.

    You're either flat-out wrong or grossly exaggerating on 10 of your 12 points. Only two make any sense at all

    5. Giving up three picks for caroo This was a massive mistake because I'm told the Fins weren't actually moving up to draft Carroo. Their pick was taken right under their noses while they worked the phones...it was a team fail.

    7. Drafting an injured and injury prone devante Parker. Devante is our best receiver in practice by a longshot and he's everything you look for in a WR1. The kid just doesn't have any heart though and that doesn't always show in interviews. Even so, you're complaining about three picks out of our last two drafts....most GM's would kill to be that accurate in meeting team needs.
     
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  7. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    1. We did overpay for suh, no DT is worth that kind of money. It has hamstrung our cap for years and suh has not had the kind of impact in terms of actually winning games and having a top defense to warrant that kind of money. He should have never been signed if the price was that high. For that kind of money we could have signed 3 or 4 good players who together would have had a lot bigger impact on our winning percentage.

    2. We traded for them, they both suck, wether you want to admit it or not. Philly got the better end of the overall deal, as is usual of any team tbaum trades with. We always end up getting the short end of the stick.

    3. Kiko has not been better than mediocre, according to PFF he is among the worst starting linebackers in the league. Be honest, kiko has had a hand full of good games since he has been here, but overall he has been bad to mediocre. Definitely not worth over 7 million per year which is what tbaum in his genius gave him for mediocre play.

    4. Branch played average last year, he had 5 sacks and was not very good holding the edge and stopping the run. He is not worth the big contract extension he got. He is overpaid, this year he is actually playing about the same as last year. He has 3 sacks so far he could end up with 5 again. That is about where he has been his entire career, he is good backup material which is what he was until he got here and tbaum decided to make him a well paid starter.

    8. Charles Harris is overrated and flawed. He was not worth a 1st round pick. There are 3rd and 4th round picks this year that are out playing him by a mile. I'll give you that it's too early, but he looks to me like he will be another underperforming 1st. Round pick in a long line of underperforming 1st. Round picks for tbaum.

    9. Excuse Me, but signing a career backup in Larsen, resigning bushrod who was one of the worst guards in football Last year, and then drafting an overweight and not that good asiata in the 5th round does not qualify as adequately addressing the position in my opinion, and you failed to address the fact that he has failed on all four of his guard draft picks during his time here.

    10. Timmons has not played well, he was awol the first two games, his first two games back from the suspension he played well, but after that he started to break down and show his age, which was pretty evident to anybody who watched him through last season. He has lost a step. He is not very good in coverage anymore, he is missing a lot of tackles and is now being replaced by Anthony on passing downs. He most likely won't be here next year and he has not been playing "well" as you say. As far as being a placeholder for McMillan, they don't even play the same position and are not the same type of player. We don't even know if McMillan will be any good yet and you are talking like he is an established star with no question marks. Meanwhile we could have signed a younger and in his prime Zach Brown who is having another good season with the Redskins so far.

    11. Misi has been an average NFL linebacker since he has been here, but that is not the point, the point is he is never healthy and has a serious career threatening injury when tbaum decided to sign him instead of better and healthier players that were available. Misi has missed two seasons in a row now and has not played a full season for us since we drafted him.

    12. Ajayi is the biggest reason why we went on a hot streak and won ten games last year. He is a pro bowl running back, it's not his fault our oline sucks and gase cannot formulate a decent passing game or call better plays that don't have him continuously running into 8 and 9 man fronts. Either way ajayi was worth more than a late 4th round pick. Again this is a trade where we got the short end of the stick.

    5. The caroo pick is on tbaum, he is the man responsible, it was his deal, don't try to diffuse the blame.

    6. Parker is both soft and injury prone, both of these things were evident in his college career where he was frequently injured and was known for his aloof and shy personality. In fact we drafted him while he was still injured.

    You can try to sugar coat it and find all the excuses you want, fact is these are all major failed decisions by tbaum. If you actually think tbaum has done a good job and is the man that will lead us to success, then I dont know how you expect to be taken seriously. All I can say is I have a bridge I want to sell you.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
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  8. Serpico Jones

    Serpico Jones Well-Known Member

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    Tannenbaum couldn’t draft flies when he was in New York so how is anyone surprised by this? He should’ve never been hired in the first place.
     
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  9. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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  10. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    Wow!lets sign him to a 5 year extension since he is doing such a great job.
     
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  11. dirtylandry

    dirtylandry Well-Known Member

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    So where does Grier and Gase come in with this? Aren't they tied at the hip, esp in the draft?
    From what we here, Gase and Grier have a lot of influence too.
     
  12. Seadog

    Seadog Active Member

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    This is why we're where we are at...

    Mix that with the wiffs on coaching, we might not see another winning season in quite some time.

    Burke, the absolute worse position coach we had on D last year and he get promoted to DC, just a fricking joke...
     
  13. dirtylandry

    dirtylandry Well-Known Member

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    the more I think about it, the dominoes should start falling if we lose to Denver at home. Burke or Christensen
     
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  14. Seadog

    Seadog Active Member

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    Both teams are very much alike. Poor Coaching, poor GM's, very bad OL, bad QB's, both on a losing streak.... Except Donks have a much better D than Miami, but both have terrible DC's....

    Toilet Bowl game....
     
  15. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, grier and gase are partly responsible too, but the buck stops with tbaum in terms of personnel and contract decisions.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
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  16. miamiron

    miamiron There's always next year

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    Good job
    truer words have never been spoken
     
  17. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    Carroo was supposed to be Redskins CB, Kendall Fuller is what I recall the talk was at the time...

    Agree on most of your points.
     
  18. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    My big thing is that you can go back and look at ANY draft for ANY NFL team in ANY season and see them miss more often than not.

    For instance, the Dolphins 1983 draft landed us Marino, Roby and Clayton....three obvious team-changing picks and possibly our best draft ever. But they also had seven others (Charles, Benson, Woetzel, Brown, Reed, Lukens, Carter) that never lived up to their potential in Miami. We batted .300 that season in draft picks...a mere 30% success rate...should we have fired Joe Robbie as the team's GM for that? Or was it one heck of a successful draft?

    When the OP says to fire a GM because three of our picks over the last two years aren't superstars, it's a head-scratching moment for sure.
     
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  19. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    Ir you cant see that tbaum is a complete failure as gm then I dont think it's worth even arguing with you. You bring up the 1983 draft, and fail to realize that all of tbaum drafts put together can't equal that one draft.
     
  20. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    But what you're not realizing is that Marino was a nobody one year after the draft and Clayton wasn't a first stringer either. Reggie Roby was probably the surest pick that year since he launched balls a mile high, but you act like our picks are complete busts if rookies are not voted into the Pro Bowl by their 5th game of the season. That is not and never has been the standard. If you want to judge Tannenbaum, fine....I have no problem with that. But these rants by some people trying to call every draft pick we have busts is plain silly.

    Players don't develop for hundreds of reasons and most of them are not football related.

    The other part of the equation is injury- McMillian was suspected to be a day-one starter at MLB and he looked great in preseason. If he wasn't hurt, then we wouldn't have had the Timmons stuff....people conveniently ignore the actual facts while making blanket statements. Some things are out of the GM's control.

    I am not a Tannenbaum fan myself but that doesn't mean I'm going to make things up on a forum that our executives will never read to make myself feel better somehow. It's just silly- judge the man on facts and not pure fantasy.
     
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  21. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    I didn't state any fantasy I stated facts, tbaum has been a complete failure. That is fact. We have changed coaches, changed players, and still suck, the only constant has been tbaum, he is is one of the biggest problems.

    You are the one that is stating fantasy, Marino was never a bum, he showed himself to be great his very first year, and his second year he put together the greatest season by QB ever up till that point.

    Your statement about McMillan is factually wrong as well. He did not play at all in the preseason, he got injured on the first kickoff of the first preseason game. Just because coaches praised him in training camp and were thinking of starting him doesn't mean we should believe them and anoint him as a sure thing. They also said x howard was going to be a shutdown corner and he is now one of the worst corners in the league.

    Preseason and training camp hype is just that, hype. McMillan has not proven anything yet.

    As far as Charles Harris he is having the worst season out of all of the top edge defenders that were drafted this year, and there are even third and fourth rounders from this year's draft that are significantly out playing him. So yes it is correct to say he is underperforming up to this point, just as almost all of tbaum previous 1st round draft picks have underperformed.
     
  22. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Very true. Just to add to that, Marino was the first QB to ever start a Pro Bowl in his rookie year and named rookie of the year. Definitely not a nobody after his rookie year. I think KeyFin must be misremembering something there.
     
  23. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    He didn't start right away though- I think it was game 5 or 6 when they finally turned him loose. It was his second year where he tossed the 48 TD's or whatever ungodly number it was- it seems like he was around a 109 QBR that season?

    Anyway, the point was that you can't call most rookies busts based on what they did through 11 games. I used Marino as an example because he was a superstar from almost day one and one of the best ever, yet we didn't fully know what we had in week 11 of 1983. Of course fans thought he was good, but we didn't see a guy that would shatter just about every passing record 15 years later.
     
  24. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

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    I remember once reading Don Shula saying his biggest coaching mistake was not starting Dan Marino from game one as a rookie
     
  25. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Yeah I'm just focusing on that one quote of yours, not the overall debate which I'm going to stay out of. But I do think you'd be better off not using Marino as an example. He really was awesome right out of the gate.

    Anyway, for reference he played in game 3 but started from game 6, and had a 108.7 rating the first game he started. Ended with a 96.0 rating for the year when the league average was 73.1 lol.. that was 3rd best in the league in 1983!
    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MariDa00/gamelog/1983/
    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/1983/passing.htm
     
  26. Kud_II

    Kud_II Realist Division

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    hitman8 it's nice to see a fellow level head on thephins. I agree with all your bullet points.
     
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  27. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    The OP is clearly stating why Tannebaum is not effective in his job as, Head of Football Operations.
    Tannebaum should have NEVER been hired by Ross and he is on his way to leaving the Dolphins in the same sad condition he left the Jets in before he was finally fired.

    How anyone who claims to be a Dolphin fan can make excuses for the lousy job Tannebaum has done
    so far is beyond me. He is not capable of building a consistent winner in Miami and the years of mediocrity will continue as long as he remains with the Dolphins.

    Ross needs to sell the team and the next owner needs to clean house and hire a legitimate, Head of Football Operations. With the present ownership, FO, and coaching staff, the Dolphins are destined to
    be nothing but bottom dwellers for years to come.
     
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  28. dirtylandry

    dirtylandry Well-Known Member

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    Tannenbaum is all about bandaids. Run defense suck, sign Suh. That has quieted down a bit, but that's the mentality. This team needs to see how the Rams and Eagles were built so fast. My opinion we are one year behind, should have drafted a qb in May and seen if RT could hold up.
     
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  29. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    If I remember correctly he came in garbage time against the raiders and he led them to a td.I think that was the second game of the season but didn't get his first start until week 6.He made the pro bowl that year with 20 tds and 6 ints..
     
  30. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    This is so true.Ross needs to call jeff lurie to ask how to fix this team because he has no clue what he is doing bad hire after bad hire.
     
  31. Drizzy

    Drizzy Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The Andre Branch deal was the single worst contract given out by any team this offseason. I hated it the moment it was announced.

    Kiko Alonso was a restricted free agent, low tender would've paid him $1.8 million this year and we woulda been able to evaluate him another year, see if he can stay healthy, see how he performs when he doesn't have practice squad LB'ers alongside him to make him look better, and then we negotiate a new deal in 2018 or part ways. Rushing to give him an extension when we did made no sense. Now both of these guys have $10 million cap numbers next year. I'm ****ing sick and tired of having inept people running the team. Can't believe we followed Ireland up with Tannenbaum. With Dennis Hickey sandwiched in there, a guy who only got the job because everyone else turned us down. Hopefully Peyton Manning comes here and wipes out this entire joke of a front office.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2017
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  32. mbsinmisc

    mbsinmisc Season Ticket Holder

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    The one constant in this decade of mediocrity has been one Steven Ross.
     
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  33. Seadog

    Seadog Active Member

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    Bad news, there's plenty of tape on how bad Kiko has been with the Dolphins, but he wore a Dolphin uniform so he was automatically great...
     
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  34. muskrat21

    muskrat21 Well-Known Member

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    you do know that if you take ajayi's longest run out from each game in philly he's averaging 2.2 ypc right.... he had a long of 30 yards vs chicago and ended the day with 26 yards.... when your long run is greater than total yards, you suck.
     
  35. Seadog

    Seadog Active Member

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    That's true, but you can't just replace an owner, you hope he finally figures out he has no idea what he's doing. Then hires an agency to hire a GM....
     
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  36. Dolphin North

    Dolphin North Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't mind seeing Grier operate without Tannenbaum having final say. I believe that was the original setup and it has not changed.
     
  37. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    If you took almost any running backs long runs out they would be averaging less than 4 ypc.

    That is not the correct way to evaluate a running back. Ajayi is a unique talent, he is not the best overall back in football, but he is one of the best at actually running the ball and breaking tackles. There are backs that are better receivers than him, there are backs that are bigger than him, and there are backs that are faster than him, but there are few backs that can carry the ball with the burst and power that he has and break tackles like him.
     
  38. muskrat21

    muskrat21 Well-Known Member

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    if he were really good at breaking tackles, shouldn't matter if you take away 3 runs he should have better than 2.2 ypc. 85% of the time ajayi is going to get you 2.2 ypc....
     
  39. Phins_to_Win

    Phins_to_Win Well-Known Member

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    Sorry but this line of thinking is flawed when a RB is only getting 5 or 6 carries a game. You can't eliminate 1 carry cause that's a high percentage of his overall carries for a game. If he was getting 20+ carries a game and you eliminated 1 carry to prove a point then I could agree with the approach. If you are trying to stretch this over multiple games then you start to run into variables that change cause the defense you are seeing changes. In the end of the season his stats will be what they are.

    Now this isn't to say that you're wrong about your assessment of him. I felt like when he was here he was a little bit too hit or miss, when he was on he destroyed defenses, when he was off he gave you a few too many 3rd and longs. I just disagree with the mechanic of eliminating 1 of his carries when he only carries 5 times.

    However, if he continues to manage a major run every 5 or 6 carries till season ends, then I think we have to accept that its a matter of great coaching to put him into the right situation to torch a defense.
     
  40. muskrat21

    muskrat21 Well-Known Member

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    Is it still great coaching if his other 5 runs for the game go for a total of -4 yards?
     

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