He did both of those. How long do you give it for the most replaceable offensive skill position exactly?
Depends on how good the coach is. While KeyFin is right about us not really knowing what happened behind the scenes, I'm pretty sure a coach like Parcells would have had more success convincing Ajayi to get with the program than Gase.
the team plays better and way more amped with moore back there, the second half showed that whether or not you agree hes good or not im merely saying the team plays better when hes taking snaps, and the fact cutler had 3 picks and moore is 1 bad safety call from a comeback should auto put him starting this week.
No your response is based on nothing. Parcells was famous for being able to "push the right buttons" and did so differently for different players. There are tons of testimonials to that and maybe you should look that up before claiming what I wrote is "based on nothing". Anyway.. I can see where this is going: you're going back to your trolling days. Count me out of such a useless debate so go ahead and have your all-so-desired last word.
No it's based on nothing else his teams never would have had to cut/trade people that weren't too old. Disagreeing with you is not trolling.
Oh? Do they? Is that why we got beat 40-0 with Moore in at QB in Baltimore? I mean, I get what you're saying to an extent, but lets not get carried away here. He's not going to change things much.
Yeah, that’s really farfetched. I don’t know of anybody that thought he’d be this good. But plenty of people would’ve wanted to trade Tannehill.
I know I was seething about this team after that loss and even aimed some disdain at Moore with his picks. They were playing on a short week with a new starter at QB who's not had any reps with the 1's aside from his comeback win vs. the Jets. Then Gase in a stroke of sheer genius errrrrrrr I mean stupidity decides to scale down the playbook and march him out there with new plays. They were also still hamstrung by Ajayi's insistence on freelancing and not being a legitimate passing threat out of the backfield. The Ravens kicked their asses, but that was the quintessential overreaction game. How often would they find themselves in that kind of scenario? Not very. We all know Moore's limitations, but at this point it's pretty clear "overall" the offense responds to Moore moreso than Cutler.
I would’ve adapted my offense to be more like the Ground Chuck offense. I would’ve brought in blockers (fullback, tight end, linemen, whoever was available). I’d never run the same play twice unless it was disguised in a different formation. I’d run the damn ball on 3rd and short the vast majority of the time. I’d run the play action and throw bombs with Moore as the starter.
The eagles did!And they found a way to move all the way down from 14.Because they know what the they are doing.We have no clue.
i wouldnt say our defense was good at all this year we looked decent against **** teams. our defense hasn’t asserted itself in any game IMHO. Burke has to go and gase has to hire accomplished coaches his buddy network sucks.
I hear ya with all that Rock. I said some of the same things after that game about Moore. Tough spot, short week, etc, etc. However, alot of that game is typical of what you get with Moore from time to time. My issue more so with the comment was how we're simply going to say... ahhh. the team is better when he plays. It's just not really the truth from what we've seen. I get it, there was contributing factors to that Baltimore game, but it's not like Moore hasn't laid stinkers before either. However, Moore also has a pretty distinct advantage when he comes into a game when the starter goes down. He's good enough to get a defense into trouble. Some backups are capable of just not losing the game... you hope. Moore is good enough to be able to win games, but he's also not good enough to avoid the complete stinker. However, I think when he comes into a game where the D hasn't gameplanned for him at all, he's got an advantage there, I think that's a part of what we see when he comes in. He's got more fire than Cutler, that's for sure, so maybe that helps inspire other guys out there too temporarily. Either way, I think we can all agree we've seen enough of Jay Cutler, and we should all be able to agree that putting Matt Moore out there right now, really doesn't help the team in the grand scheme of things. Unlikely we make the playoffs given our current record, and future schedule, so what good does playing Moore do? I'm not one to say tank it... NFL players don't believe in that, or think that way either. Especially vets, so I'm not rooting for that. I just think... what's the point? We know what we have in Moore; a capable backup. We know what we have in Cutler; A broadcaster. Neither is going to help this team in the long run, so lets not pretend that because Moore "gives a spark" means that we'd be significantly better.
We've got vertical threats in Parker and Stills - the latter of which Moore is clearly more capable of hitting deep. Both of those guys are supposed to be integral cogs in the offense. That's the largest and most important difference IMO. With Cutler running the offense you're constantly looking at long dink and dunk drives, which is nearly impossible to maintain. I just have a hard time saying things definitely won't change when one guy has played most of the season and the other eight quarters of football. It's the element of "chance". Personally I have no desire to watch someone like Doughty at there. At least for the rest of the year I could watch someone who's easy to root for.
I hear ya, I just don't see the point at this point. Season is pretty much done, so even if we win an extra game or two switching to Moore, Yeah, I'll enjoy those few wins too, but I'd rather see us blow things up on a pretty minor scale, that may not be so minor lol
Let's look at each component - Tannenbaum D- He has been able to bring in some good players and make some solid players via the draft, but he has missed too many times. Signing Greg Jennings over Michael Crabtree, sticking with Koa Misi over Zach Brown, and most importantly, failing to address the offensive line are just a few of the many roster mistakes. Moreover, there are a lot of bloated contracts on our roster because of him. Gase F I think that it is easy to give him a pass because RT is out for the season, but he hand chose Cutler that was experienced in his system. Despite what our record states, we could very easily be a 1 or 2 win team right now. Last year, we won a lot of close games. Why did we win those games? We road the J-Train to victory. Gase subsequently rides him out of town when things turned sour. Can you imagine what our record would have been last year with out Ajayi? Gase keeps blaming the players because they cannot understand his system. Admittedly, he has scaled back our offense to an overly simplistic offense. Our offensive line has almost no discipline. I would be all about keeping Gase if were playing disciplined football, and the play calling looked good. Even with Cutler, we are not the worst offense in the league. Gase deserves much of the blame. QB C+ I am a huge RT fan, but even I think that we need to draft a QB (2nd round?) with such a deep draft class. I don't know what to expect with RT being out for almost a year and a half. I think we should look at the Eagles for the model to getting a QB. Remember, they drafted Wentz, signed Bradford and Chase Daniel. Bringing in a plan A, B, and C makes a lot of sense in retrospect. RB C+ At the onset, this may seem low. Remember, Williams was upset that he was a restricted free agent last year and was late to report. I feel iffy about giving him a second contract. Conceivably, Drake, who has showed explosion, could be the only RB back next year. WR A- I do think that this is a solid unit. I am willing to give Parker one more go. He looks so athletic when he is on the field. I get the feeling that once things click, he could be a premiere WR. We need to keep our heart and soul, Landry. Stills has speed to burn. TE C- Julius Thomas looks nothing like he did in Denver. I doubt he returns next year. Fasano is old. I wish we used Gray more. This group needs an upgrade. OL D- Not only are we bad, but we may need to get worse. Pouncy is expensive and often hurt. James is okay, but will be very expensive. Tunsil needs to improve. This group is undisciplined. No QB would succeed behind this line. No matter who our QB is next year, he cannot survive behind this group. DL B+ I think that this is the anchor of our defense. Godchaux is showing promise, Suh is elite, and we have gotten decent production out of Hayes. It will be interesting to see if Wake is deemed expendable or not next year. LB C+ Kiko has looked bad this year, but with Raekwon returning, he may kick out to outside LB. Timmons has been mediocre. CB C+ Tank and Howard are young. Lippett will be returning, but I think we need to look to improve this group. S A McDonald looks massive on the field and is already paying dividends. Between him and Jones, the back end looks good. Special Teams C+ I would look to upgrade from Haack. I think that the Jakeem Grant experiment is a failure. I would like to see more Drake in the return game. Parkey has been pretty good.
Sometimes they do, sure. Especially when comes in as a relief pitcher. As a starter, color me meh. He's a backup. We are going nowhere with him. If that's what it has come down to, start Fales or Doughty.
They didn't have a real QB on the roster. We had Tannehill. This argument is dumb as ****. Now this year? After 2 Tannehill knee surgeries, coming up on the end of the contract, still not really sure what he is? Pull the trigger.
you have a good point. Gase, first of all seems very impatient and stubborn. Second, look at the discipline happening in Jaxnow, and how that is helping them. It is a dangerous thing, because I don't want to lose good players because Gase has a short fuse.
Ever notice that good teams don't whine over two of three games being the worst officiated in history and handing the W to the other team? Good teams win. We're not a good team. Sure sometimes we look good. So does a white castle burger at 3 am after goldschlager shots. You know it doesn't look good the next day sober. Some people thought the Edsel looked good and the Yugo.
I mean im not saying im the smartest football knowledgeable person here but I think Ray Charles could see Matt Moore brings more to the table for the TEAM than cutler.
ya I mean it was a short week and he SH!T the bed which im not giving him a pass for that, I think it was just downhill form the start all around, not just on 1 guy. but the second half against Tampa it was clear all around.
he's better than Cutler easily, I do believe are record would be better with Moore than with cutler I have been saying this since we signed him, but is Moore going to lead us to promise land? who knows probably not, but what I do know is if he played in the first half of the Tampa game we probably win that game easily and your only as good as your last game so that's all I am looking at.
this started out good but then I threw up in my mouth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Goldschlager havnt thought about that in years!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL
I do believe all teams complain about the refs, the difference is, is we are looking for help because the play on the field cant do what we need hahah so when we get boned by the refs it hurts more than a team who usually has a chance to win the next game. Im pretty sure Dallas is still a little bit upset about the dez Bryant catch against GB I know ROMO is.
Claiming that Luck is better than RT is just not true. Moore is a big drop off from RT. Nobody in their right mind would think that Moore is better than RT. He went with Foster because Ajayi threw a temper tantrum. Ajayi is no longer on the Dolphins because he sucked this season. You could take Bushrod and place him on the Eagles and he's look good. You could say that Luck had/has a higher ceiling, but he has not reached that ceiling and he's pretty much RT at this point in his career up to and including being injured. However, there's speculation that Luck may never play again.
In many ways, the Colts are very similar to us, though even worse at talent evaluation and team building. Luck absolutely had a higher ceiling, but Indy's inability to field an OL that was even as "good" as ours have been was criminal. Having their young QB play through injuries and then not getting it properly taken care of. All examples of how NOT to run a franchise. Plus, a good example of a team with actual bad ownership as opposed to Ross. Unless Ross is just suggesting the injury was all in Tannehill's head while doing a line of coke and I missed it.
They did show a hit to the helmet by the defender, oddly nothing was called and it was pretty obvious the guy hit the QB on the head. The call against our LB was not as bad as that hit. Cutler laid on the ground for a moment
Hey, a civil discussion between us, very nice. Luck has been inconsistent and injury prone, but I do believe he has the higher ceiling. The same way I believe Ajayi has a higher ceiling than any of our guys but has been inconsistent (for whatever reason). We can go back and forth forever on Foster and Ajayi, but at the end of the day, Gase couldn’t handle the most talented offensive player on his team and he was traded for next to nothing. Now, the Moore thing. We can go back and forth on this forever, as we have, but it’s my personal opinion that Tannehill’s draft pick and contract don’t justify the gap between him and Moore.
Several things happened in that horrible game from Moore a few weeks back. Short week, Gase handcuffed him... all that other stuff that's been mentioned. But Moore's body language in the first half was different than I've ever seen him. He actually looked nervous and anxious which I don't recall ever seeing him that way. When he first trotted on the field he was definitely pumped. I can't put my finger on it, but something seemed off in his demeanor. Maybe he knew this was his real shot to get back in the permanent starter conversation. Whatever it was translated into his performance being erratic, and inaccurate throws. Then it was just a downward spiral of everything around him, and just not being able to overcome the simplistic game plan and the maddening pass rush. He was asked to win a game in which Gase was not planning on running anything more than a high school level game-plan. That was arguably Moore's worst performance. I'm torn about how much to count it against him though. The whole situation does make me wonder if Gase has something against Moore. Is Moore not a typical coaches QB? Is he kind of a loner who connects with his teammates, but not in the kind of tandem way the coach would like? Something is definitely going on there with the chemistry between Gase and MM. Moore has played better than Cutler in his limited time. Moore had one horrible game with a TON of suspect issues around him, after which Gase seemed awfully quick to put MM back to bed. Cutler has had multiple horrible games, and even seems bad when he's getting the stats to appear like he's doing somewhat decent. Gase forgives ALL from Cutler. Gase is the coach tho, so that's football. If Moore gets the start this week, we'll probly see similar shackles that will force a complete disaster on him. If Cutler gets the start, we will likely see a complete disaster despite Cutler's absolute best effort and the coach trying to prop him up. I hope I'm wrong on either count, but based on what I've seen this year so far, that's what I expect.
I didn't see a "shackled" Moore this past Sunday....he came out aggressive and pretty much stayed that way the whole game. Why would Gase change up the play calls so much if he didn't have faith in Moore? That's what really throws me. I don't see how anyone couldn't see the difference between Moore and Cutler though and what it did to the rest of the team....they simply respond to Moore and play harder. You're right about everything else though. Folks are judging him harshly because he had one bad game, against the same team that RT Pennington and Henne always had a bad game against as well. He is by far the best option we have moving forward BUT someone mentioned yesterday that Gase said he's sticking with Culter if he's healthy.
I agree 100% he was sabotaged in the ravens game based ont he short week and gase and i seen the same thing about him going onto the field. Maybe Moore is changing plays and gase doesn't like it. Maybe Moore is the one not doing HW based on what gase is telling them to study maybe hes actually studying what a qb should be studying. I dont know what it is but i agree Moore is on his SH!T list and i think if he had more time he would have found someone after RT went down last yr. I think he (MM) likes to boast up players and be a good teammate and has a connection, so in the huddle him and stills go lets get this SH!T going and hook up on a nice dig route or something, instead of cutler just saying "zy wiggle switch 32" break and throwing to option 1. I will bet you cutler is out of concussion by Saturday easily even if he clears Sunday morning 6 min before game time he is playing. Hell even if he clears 8 minutes into the second qrtr cutler is going in. This is why i have the fire gase mentality now is solely based on his love for cutler and cutler horrible performances.
Agreed. He never is shackled when he comes in in relief because he's allowed to take over the game and play how he feels most comfortable. The coach didn't game plan for him. My theory is that's why he so often is great and leads comebacks when he comes in as relief. What appears to happen with MM is, he gallops in after QB1 goes down, and it's like the gunslinger Roland Duschain (Dark Tower) to the rescue. He goes on a streak of typically 2 - 3 games. Then something happens. Is it him? Or is it the coach reeling him back in to avoid QB controversy? Or some other offensive scheme that's not going to play to his strengths? How about this for a plan... After 2 great games of MM gunslinging for success... how about we spend the next game calling the same 4 - 5 plays and 3 of those are variations of running it up the middle of an offensive line that you already know sucks. This season, Gase didn't even let it go as far as Philbin would. He put a bad game plan in place quite readily and it's easy because you have the horrible offense to blame for it all. Now is this what happened? I can't say that. But it's interesting how it seems like that. When MM is allowed to ball, he is fantastic and WINS. Cutler, not so much. Cutler is probly more "coach-able". So that bumps his game up a bit. But even when he's being coached really freffin good, mmmm, he's not so much.
I agree with some who are saying "what's the point". This season seems lost with this record, what's the point. A wildcard team is likely to get in with 9, possibly 8 wins. It's unfathomable, unless you start to see an amazing turn-around starting this week. Completely get that that is some serious shet in the pipe, but it's not necessarily time to throw the towel in yet. Awe hell, what am I saying? Of course it is! This team makes me schitzoidal.
