The state of this team at the moment it would take perfect play from an elite QB let alone Tannehill to overcome the mistakes, drops , boneheaded play and penalties to even sniff a win. Who really thinks that if Tannehill hadn't overthrown Landry or Sims not dropped a TD the defends wouldnt still hand the win back? Suh's elite and unlike in Detroit there's just too much crap around him to mask.
You are right, to a point when you said this is on the QB not scanning the field but alot of the blame lies on the offensive schemes. Alot of Lazor's offense was scripted. This means that there was little reading required by the QB. The play was designed to go to one player or direction regardless. This was his philosophy, quick strike scripted plays. This, unfortuantely, does not allow your QB to adjust to the defense or develop the skills to read a defense.
I think FinD responded to this pretty well. Bottom line, this offensive line only looks serviceable when they play against the worst dlines in the league. When that happens, Tannehill is actually afforded a modicum of protection, and can then do things like, maneuver out of harm's way, or pump fake at a receiver, then throw to a different one. These are things that we saw him do on Monday night, but it starts with the oline. He was able to move because he wasn't constantly having multiple guys from multiple angles collapsing the pocket. That's why Tannehill was able to do the things we want him to do. It all starts with the oline.
stop ranting for no reason, noone expects him to playmake like wilson..he's getting criticized because of what he gets paid relative to the production and offensive units production. weve all seen ryan break the pocket on occassion and throw on the run...its not the point..Point is have you seen our qb take over a game when things werent going well and win it....I honestly have not, maybe you have or we have different definitions..
its never gonna be perfect, at some point he will have to make plays on his own...now if lazor and sherman took away all his improv privalages then they should be hung, if they made it where he was not allowed to change plays because of their own stubborness then we should gut em.. so last three games we'll see how things go, then going into the new year it should be a clean slate..im hopin that these coaches completely took all of these privalages away and thats what affected his play.. some of us think he needs to retrain himself this offseason, to becoming a dual threat qb..
We scored 7 points in the 2nd half and punted on our last 4 possessions. Our QB averaged 5.8ypa. We played a bad defense at home and couldn't take advantage of them (scored just below what they typically give up). That's not good offensive production, and the offense starts with the QB. He played fine, a solid game...but when you face a hi-scoring team with a poor secondary and pass rush, your QB needs to be better than 'fine'.
C'mon...it's not like when the game was on the line he missed a wide open player for an easy TD...uh wait, never mind.
Yeah, it's the same old thing with you guys. Ignore the abandonment of the run game, and the effect that has, and ignore the penalties, that absolutely destroyed our chance to score on two drives, and ignore the terrible drops/lack of effort on multiple plays that prevented us from scoring...and boil it down to Tannehill.
I think most are in agreement that he needs to run more. I'm really hoping it was a coaching thing that had him acting as more of a statue in the pocket. With our line, he certainly needs to move more often.
Seriously, do you think the two throws Tannehill missed on the final drive, when the game was on the line, had anything to do with any coach or player other than Tannehill?
The overthrow to Landry? I think that had far more to do with Landry being gimpy, and not able to go full speed.
Lol...with all due respect, I am not surprised you see it that way. So Tannehill's postgame response to missing that throw, "Jarvis did a good job of separating and I overthrew him. I had time to make a good throw, I saw him break and tried to get the ball to him quickly and didn't make the throw. You know, that's the ones you got to make (frown)," can be translated to, "That gimpy bastard couldn't run worth a crap. I threw a perfect throw and he just puttered out"?
good to great qbs can take over a ballgame, but they have to be able to make plays in crucial situations to do so, thats how you inspire your teammates to elevate their focus..They have to see it before they can believe..
Its hardly for no reason. There is a clear and significant narrative going on. And you're doing it with your second paragraph. You, like all the others, are still ignoring the what I'm saying about pressure and in doing so, go right back to the doesn't take over a game/doesn't have pocket presence/doesn't will the team to win/blah, blah, blah. I'm literally addressing what the problem is and you guys pretend it doesn't exist and just restate the results of that problem. Thill not playing well in the 4th is not the problem, its a symptom. The problem causing that symptom is the oline. Watch the game again. Tell me you honestly don't see a difference in the type of pressure Thill faced in the first half and the second half. Forget you're watching him, just watch it like it was a team you don't care about.
ok bro, all ryans pocket issues are o-line related, being 30th in third down conversion has nothing to do with the qb, being 32nd on 4th down has nothing to do with the qb..being the most sacked qb over a four year window is all oline related.. its not about will to win, its about the ability to understand situational football and put the whole skill set on display to convert, thats how you keep from being the worst in all those categories above.. now if you wanna stick to the argument that he was completely restricted to the pocket I'm open, but I just cant imagine that being true.
Fin, I think you need to look deeper within yourself, to find your inner jedi force field and revisit what you think a qb is capable of, and actually how a qb can single handily win football games.
You realize it can be both, correct? As in, under normal circumstances, Landry is able to get there, but in this situation, he couldn't, and Tannehill didn't throw it where it should have been. I'm not saying it was a good throw. Tannehill missed it. But to act like Lanndry clearly being gimpy wasn't a factor is silly. And I wouldn't expect Tannehill than to do anything other than take the blame. He's always taken the blame, whether it was actually his fault or not.
Good to great players make plays, regardless. If people are going to find fault with Tannehill, then they damn sure should be finding fault with guys who dropped balls, or didn't make quality efforts on balls, also. This loss was not solely on Tannehill, again, no matter how much some want it to be.
In this case "NO" they are not both correct. That overthrow was 100% on Tannehill. Had nothing to do with Landry being gimpy as you say. He was running just fine on that play. What is silly is making a weak excuse for Tannehill's poor throw. Landry was THERE! Let's put it this way, Odell Beckham wouldn't have been able to catch it. I have rarely heard Tannehill take sole responsibility or blame as you call it. I usually hear him say "we" need to do better. And how do you explain 2 plays earlier where Tannehill missed Landry by throwing the ball behind him? I suppose you will claim he was overcompensating for Landry's gimpyness on that play?
Wasn't he on the move on both? Regardless, every QB misses on throws. No QB throws perfect balls every time. Not sure why Tannehill is supposed to. When he misses a throw, that becomes what people focus on, and then try to pin the blame on him. People should be raging over the penalties, the poor effort on balls when Tannehill escaped and threw on the move, the abandoning of the run game again, or the poor defense. But, no, we're complaining about Tannehill, who, again, wasn't even close to the biggest problem on the field.
Still ignoring my point completely about different types of pressure. I mean you're not even acknowledging I even said anything about it. To a man, the posters that are sour on Tannehill do this consistently. Ignore the point, then make some bizarre misrepresentation like "ok bro, all ryans pocket issues are o-line related". Its infuriating. If you respond to this, please, start with answering this simple question? Do you or do you not agree that are different types (or degrees) of pass rush....yes or no?
our garbage oline went up against a garbage pass rush, that is the only reason why our guards looked remotely competent, jason fox was still getting spun around and whiffing. if this was the jets or bills front 7, the offense would have looked the exact same as it has for all year. you cannot move around a pocket that has utterly collapsed by having pressure up the middle and around the edges. there have been times this year when pressure came off the edges where tannehill did step up just to have an interior olineman completely miss on the block and tannehill get drilled. does he need to work on things yes, but tannehill showed against the giants if he has adequate blocking he can move around the pocket just fine. when we play new england again that will disappear since our guys cant block jack ****.
Yeah wins and losses dont mean much at this point. Truthfully if some fluke occurred and everyone lost that has too and they got hot and somehow backed into the playoffs I would not expect them to get past the 1st rd. This team is not good enough to win in the post season. I watch the games hoping to see solid performances to build from. Thats about all is left. Im OK with people citing the obstacles RT has had to overcome as an explination to why he struggles. I think they are generally valid but after watching it for 4 years you have to begin to wonder if he is damaged goods at this point. I view him as another joey harrington type. The lions ruined him and I think the Dolphins have ruined RT Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
I have, a 100 times, further proving you, like the others, are ignoring what other people are saying. Which in all honesty, proves your guy's zealotry. Is there a difference between one guy breaking through the protection at the snap and one guy breaking through after 2.5 seconds? The stats don't think so. Is there a difference between one guy getting through and a 3 guys getting through? The stats don't think so. Is there a difference between 3 guys getting through all at once and three guys that come through at different times? The stats don't think so. Is there a difference between any of these things listed? The stats don't think so. Its not just the stats, its all of you as well. None of you see past pressure. If there's pressure, then there's pressure, it doesn't matter if the pocket collapses in 1.3 seconds or if one guy gets through in 3 seconds. You guys don't acknowledge the difference. If you did, you'd understand the oline is major problem for Tannehill and its a worse problem for him then it is for just about any other QB. Our pass blocking is Houston Texans expansion level bad. It gets rated higher than Seattle's right now, because as I've been saying, the stats don't differentiate between pressure types/degrees. I challenge you to watch the Giants game again and pretend its two teams you don't care about and have no preconceived notions about. Watch the oline. Tell me what difference you see between the first and second halves. You'll see that our oline allowed pressure, but it was single pressure or staggered so Ryan actually space to move. You'll see in the second half, the pressure was quicker and it was the jailbreak variety leaving Ryan no room to get out of the way.
I'm not blaming him solely for the loss..defense couldn't stop the giants...im always evaluating our qb.
I would say if this was the first game that Tannehill played I would be excited by what I saw, but at the end of the 4th year I wonder if it was really anything. Even though he avoided pressure and it was nice to see, he still missed throws that were there.
He did say explicitly that he missed the aforementioned throw to Landry. And by and large I find no problem with him saying "we" because for one it is true, and two the questions he is typically answering are about the offense or team overall, not just his own performance. On questions about him solely, I never hear him shirk responsibility though I do hear him re-direct praise.
Holy mother of...why are we still dissecting every single play from Monday night to figure out how global warming is ultimately Tannehill's fault? Is it not enough that he played better than he has all season long? - He scrambled WAAAAY better than he has in all of 2015 - He ran the read option better than he has in all of 2015 - He went down field a lot more than he has in all of 2015 - He was more accurate deep than he has been in all of 2015 - He was more efficient on 3rd down than he has been in all of 2015 - He ran the ball better than he has in all of 2015 - His receivers had more drops than any other game of 2015 If that's not enough to say to yourself, "Hey, maybe we should give this guy a pass for the week and blame somebody else for a change," then you're not here to talk about Ryan Tannehill in the first place. You're just here to create arguments despite what happens on the field. And another thing, let me give you a quick football lesson. Starting in Pee-Wee league, any competent coach will tell you that if you get a hand on a football in any way, shape or form...it's a catchable ball. An NFL receiver has no excuse, zero, for dropping such a pass. - The high throw to Sims in the 3rd series went THROUGH his hands. If the ball was thrown low, it was an interception. That was PERFECT pass folks. PERFECT. - In the 4th, we had a very similar deep throw to Cameron. He got both hands on the ball, the ball hit the defenders helmet and he lost it. Not really Cameron's fault, but definitely not Tannehill's either. - The throw to a streaking Williams grazed his fingers on both hands...he was one step away from an easy TD. Or he could have just leaned forward 2 inches. Or dove. Very, very catchable. - Or how about the 3rd down where Tannehill scrambled and hit Landry in the numbers on a 20 yard rocket? PERFECT throw, yet we punted. That was Landry's 3rd drop on this drive. Just right there...that's four series where we punted and walked away with zero points. Yet all of those throws were catchable and three of the four would have given us a 1st and goal inside the 10. Landry's three drops (and the massive penalty) were on the final drive, and any one of them would have moved the chains. The ball hit his hands every time (or beamed him in the chest) and those are plays your star receiver absolutely has to haul in. Yet he didn't...and we lost by 7. But that's only AFTER we pissed away three red zone opportunities off of drops. No way that's a Ryan Tannehill thing. And the sad thing is, I've been one of the most vocal anti-Tannehill folks here...because he's played horrible in 2015. But he had a borderline great game this week and I seriously can't understand how others are searching for reasons to bash him.
Lol...Tannehill lovers are doing plenty of raging over the penalties, run game and defense. This is a Tannehill thread. If you want me to comment on the penalties, run game, and defense perhaps start a thread stating as such. Ever QB does miss throws. Tannehill had already missed quite a few this game. Fans appear enamored with his play this game and I can see why. Tannehill did some things that are, well, anti-Tannehill. He moved outside of the pocket and took chances down the field. Much better style of play than the familiar cement cleat syndrome and throws underneath all game. From that perspective those are things that are routine for good mobile QBs in the NFL week in and week out. We'll see the next 3 games if the Giants game was an anomaly. Why I don't think Tannehill had a good game is his throws were inconsistent and erratic all night. He made two "stellar" throws...the TD pass to Stills and a timing route to Landry on a 3rd and long in which the route actually went beyond the 3rd down marker. Those were outstanding! Then there were throws and decisions that were very poor. The Williams probable TD, a couple of throws to the goal line that were easy interceptions and a few others missed. Tannehill was lucky not to have 2-3 interceptions against the Giants poor secondary. Tannehill or any QB doesn't usually get away without turning the ball over against most defenses on those throws. Perhaps this is where the biggest divide between you and me or Tannehill fans and non-fans...Tannehill fans seem to say he is not the biggest problem therefor he is okay. Where I think the QB and particularly when the game is on the line and the plays are there for the making if the QB doesn't make them he "IS" the biggest problem. Have you seen Tannehill's contract? He is not getting paid to not be the biggest problem. He is getting paid to be the solution. On the plays we are talking about Tannehill moved outside of the pocket, on those throws he was not under duress and was able to square up and throw the ball. Those passes had nothing to do with the OL, just terrible passes. When any QB misses easy throws with the game on the line, blame has been earned. Regardless of whatever the OL, penalties, run game, defense or that QBs play up to that point had on the game. That game was there for the taking on a relatively "EASY" throw. It might be different if there was history of Tannehill stepping up and coming through, but there isn't. Tannehill understands that, why don't his fan-club? In Tannehill's own words after the game: "When it came down to it in the 4th quarter we didn't get it done and that's when the good teams step up, the good players step up and make plays and we didn't do that." "Jarvis did a good job of separating and I overthrew him. I had time to make a good throw, I saw him break and tried to get the ball to him quickly and didn't make the throw. You know, that's the ones you got to make (frown)."
I think he is still 'learning' to be a real QB. Seems to me if he didn't play QB in HS and some of college he might not ever get that 'feeling' of the team leader. He IS a good athlete... I think the Dolphins should script that 1st quarter play plan and use it until it doesn't work. Why not use an obvious asset he has over most other QBs. I don't know if he will ever be a true QB... but we could use what he does have.
Actually not the case for another season. Right now what he makes is in line with how he is playing. Which is why he agreed to the contract he did. He essentially gambled on himself that by that time...he would be performing to that level.
Um, it was an extension, His money this year was set by his rookie contract. They pay you later but he got guaranteed money. IF the Dolphins were to cut ties, it'd be after 2016 and I'd argue, he should get 2017 anyway even if he stinks the joint up next year with a new staff.
