jesus, you dont have to have a pocket to maneuver.. when you watch wilson drop, he does not stay static very often, he constantly shifts his position or deepens his drop, he does this because he's so good at seeing the rush and evading that he literally creates extra space that others cannot, while he's doing that defenders are not teeing off on their spots where they think the qb is gonna be....now watch ryan in the pocket...hes a sitting duck and the defense knows it, I believe there is a strong correlation here and why tannehill has been the most sacked qb for the past four years..
so thats what you all have been trying to say the whole time?, that a team can still lose a game if the qb plays well..?...no sh%% this all started when you all kept comparing ryans inefficiencies to poor surrounding variables then using wilsons variables as an example to make your point on how we should wait to judge ryan.. bottom line, wilson should never be mentioned in this conversation...he's already proven how great he is..and the last four games without Lynch and graham put a lid on that mother..
I brought Wilson into the conversation last week when someone constantly said, "It's all the line's fault Tannehill can't play like a top 5-10 QB." So I pointed out that Seattle has had the worst line in football three years straight, that Wilson has been pressured more than any QB out there, yet he's still clocked in two Super Bowl appearances and likely another playoff run this season. He's also taken far less sacks with a worse line, put up better TD/INT ratios and managed almost double our number of wins during that same span. How is that possible if a QB can't win with a bad line? Then I showed the actual stats of pressures in the league....Brady is the least pressured, Wilson is the most pressured. But the difference was around 3.5 pressures per game. Tannehill is pressured 1.9 plays more per game compared to Brady, so the O-line excuse is absolute BS. And that's when the conversation changed to everything being the receivers' faults. Or the offensive coordinators. Or the water boy. Or the fat kid that sits in section 504 of the upper deck. There's always more excuses, more to blame, because the person that's driving all of this hate and ruining the forum for thousands of people. He just wants to argue. And all of us are absolute idiots for buying into it; just put that troll on ignore and we can go back to having a perfectly enjoyable forum. And PS- I'm not talking about DJ or Resnor. Their argument (like many others) is a by-product of our resident troll keeping these fights alive.
It's a QB friendly team... except he allows them to run the ball like they do. He has over 400 rushing yards himself and a rushing TD. He scrambles, he makes big plays, his YPA is ridiculous, like 8.6. Also, he's always played behind a subpar OL and excelled. Only recently has his OL stepped their game up and now he's an unstoppable machine (16 TDs, 0 INTs, 1171 yards in 4 games). Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Wilson's passer rating in losses is around 90, Tanne's is around 80, and that is with some significant garbage time stat padding, Wislon on the other hand had no garbage time. Certainly could be that Tanne's struggles led to those losses, which is clearly not the case for Wilson. Also, Tanne has 7 4th quarter TDs, 5 of them are garbage time TDs.
What I'm saying is he consistently does well and keeps his team competitive more than almost any QB. Tannehill doesn't. Wilson has always excelled even with bad OLs. Tannehill hasn't. Wilson has always allowed his team to be effective running the ball. Tannehill hasn't. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I do notice an uptick in these fights. Just saying. It was quiet a couple weeks ago ... Yes, Russell Wilson should put these fights to bed. He's killing it with Baldwin as his #1? Imagine if he had Landry, Stills, Parker and Matthews. Baldwin is good but not THAT good and the rest are junk save for Tyler Lockett the rookie (scored him in Dynasty for the stash!). Wilson's oline has been bad since 2013 at least if not longer. He has one of the best passer ratings and team success since. Is he helped by the run game and defense? Absolutely. But he also has to deal with a leak offensive line and his individual performance has not suffered because of it.
No'one but stringer bell and myself have even talked about what wilson does for the run game..wilsons threats within the zone read creates space..but that will just be glossed over.
Oh believe me, I've mentioned it several times in these debates and it's always glossed over. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
They're 8-5. Points allowed in the games they've won: 0, 10, 3, 12, 13, 7, 6, 30. And this is a "down" year for their defense. Lol.
Wilson plays a role, sure. But I'd say the coaches' willingness to stick to the run and their defense keeping the score down are bigger factors. Would you agree that OL issues are exacerbated on a team that is pass happy/ often playing from well behind and mitigated on a team that commits to the run and is very rarely trailing by 10 points or more?
Yes, of course. Lazor's play calling was ridiculous but I'm positive he would've been less inclined to pass if Tannehill exhibited skills that Wilson has. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
He's taken more sacks per drop back than Tannehill, though you may be right about the OL. Wilson's clearly been the more efficient (and therefore better) player for years. Wilson's success doesn't mean everything said about Tannehill is an excuse though. With that said, some things likely are.
Points given up in their losses: 39, 27, 27, 27, 34. Point they scored in their losses (same order): 32, 23, 24, 17, 31. You can't really say that Wilson hasn't been pulling his own weight. He's only the highest rated QB in the NFL right now. He's already the only QB to post 100+ ratings in each of his first 3 years, and he's going to be the only one who did it through his first 4. Again, the Seahawks must be the most QB friendly team in NFL history, because Wilson is having the best start to his career of any QB in history, with Doug Baldwin as his best receiver.
stop discounting the greatness of russell wilson..just admit it and move on.. I'm just copying a page on the tv screen.. advanced stats.. russell wilson passing inside the pocket-since week 11 comp pct 82% NFL RANK 1 YDS per att 11.1 NFL rank 1 TD-int 15-0 NFL rank 1 Total QBR 99 NFL rank 1 wilson the first player in nfl history over this stretch to reach these numbers.. no lynch..no graham.. oh yeah dont forget the rushing yards he adds to that... no, he's not great.
Not that I am aware of. Specifically as it relates to Wilson, I did find this. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/film-room/2015/film-room-russell-wilsons-mobility I am not sure if zone read counts as designed run, as the attempts don't match up by just going 32+5X for each season. The whole thing is probably right up your alley to be honest though.
Listen, no one is disputing that he's played great. Pointing out point totals given up in losses vs wins doesn't really have anything to do with Wilson. I'm not sure why it's not possible to discuss the Seahawks without automatically defaulting to talking about Wilson.
I'm not sure we've talked on this topic but my point is that Wilson wouldn't have anywhere near that level of success playing in the conditions that Tannehill plays in. 40+ passes per game, little or no run game, shaky defense. Seattle and Miami are as far apart in that regard as they are on a map. I listed the wins, where they are allowing 10ppg to illustrate that. IIRC they are allowing 15-16ppg over Wilson's career while also leading the league in takeaways. Theyre also number 1 in rushing percentage vs total offenaive snaps. I know youre being facetious w the most friendly in history jab, cool. But can you name a QB that's ever come to the league playing under similar circumstances? I'll wait. And, are we not counting Jimmy Graham as a receiver?
So you're not gonna address why they are 1-5 anytime they allow more than 13 points? Gotya. I notice you've gone quiet on how Kaepernick is so superior to Tannehill. Do you still still think Miami should have outbid the Redskins to trade up for RGIII?
Seattle never had the worst offensive line. They could always run block. You cant just use sacks as an indicator of line play. It's overall efficiency. Plus Seattle dials up more chunk yardage plays in its pass offense every game which will lead to more pressures by its very nature. If they were a DINK and dunk offense like we had their passing numbers would increase
if you gave me a choice at qb, yes I would take kaepernik moving forward...you do know that i gave Ryan a fair chance at the position, it wasn't like i was pissed off for taking him..as his career played out I started to get more and more concerned about what he did from the pocket, his multitasking capabilities I started to question and wasn't keen about how he didn't threaten defenses with the dual threat skill set..last year i started getting more critical, and near the end I was ready to move on..This year hasn't made me change my mind..Kaepernik has proven more and played better in big games, than ryan so it is what it is, you think your getting me on something and your not..I'll reiterate, I would take Kaepernik moving forward if you gave me that choice. RG3..Yes I stated i had a scenario to move up for rg3, but did not say to outbid washington..that was when the situation was fluid, and russell hadn't declared whether he was gonna play baseball or football..when I did my final two scenarios {because up until the draft it is always changing} {one where it was from the dolphins perspective, one from my own} mine was to take luke kuechly and russell wilson in the 2nd {I also stated depending how things panned out in the first, I would be willing to move back into the first to select wilson just to make sure] the other option was, if we were gonna take tannehill, {which was fine with me}, that I would ''double down on wilson'' as far as seattle being 1 and 5 anytime they allow more than 13 points..this is year four in that qbs regime, please explain to me how thats an indictment on him? cause I'm confused as to what your insinuating.
Sure, it's a team sport and blame can always be split 11+ ways. Receivers drop passes. Linemen get holding penalties on what would have been a 1st down. Coaches make dumb calls. I'm not arguing against any of that because it's completely true. But at some point, players/coaches have to take personal accountability for things to change. And that includes Tannehill. Honestly, I'm still a fan of his and I hope he somehow turns a corner. But pretending a problem is not there and merely saying, "We'll get em on the next drive" isn't working for me anymore...not after four seasons. Tannehill absolutely needs to play better to remain the starter of this team. I didn't use sacks...I used overall pressures. And the stats show that despite being pressured more, Wilson somehow has averaged an extra 10 points per game, 6 wins per season and almost 80 first downs (per year) more than Tannehill.
Is Jimmy Graham their #1? Look, I don't know what kind of strange hateboner you have for Wilson, but regardless of any sort of justifications you can use he's at the been one of if not the most efficient QB in the league in his career, and that has absolutely nothing to do with his defense or run game. Wilson has the most 4th quarter comebacks in the last 4 years. That's him with a 68.8% completion rate and an 8.6(!!!!) YPA. He's thrown 26 TDs to 7 INTs. He's played record-setting football ever since he came into the league, and he's done so while taking the second most sacks and hits to Tannehill. The guy is going to end up being a first ballot hall of famer if he plays long enough. The other QBs you asked for would be Tom Brady and Joe Montana off the top of my head, with both of them having pretty damn good run games and defenses.
Soooo will you guys be chanting "we have a franchise QB" when he throws for 320 and 3 TD's tonight?? It's going down....cant wait to see a handful of you guys react to it.
But if he sucks, will you chant about how he's a terrible QB? Not fair if you can do that, but I can't talk about him being great. LOL
I doubt it registered in your brain...but I've already said no matter what he does tonight?? My opinion will not change. I quoted YOU when I said that....try and retain information before you start talking out of your arse.
Excitement and disappointment always gets the best of fans...Im sure we will get a plethora of "see how good he is when X" or "see he still sucks even with X" All hail over reactional fandom.
All we need to know is Seattle's offense is scoring 26 points per game good for 6th overall, and Miami is scoring 20 pts per game, good for 24th. We all saw what they did with a common opponent Baltimore, one week after the other. Tanny led the offense to what was it, 8 first downs and 7 points? Or something? The seattle defense could let Baltimore score 34 points and they still win. Dolphins don't win unless the defense scored the pick 6! The week before if the defense let up 37 they still win. For those who complain about how much Tanny throws he's only 13th in the league in attempts with 435, not much more than Wilson with 384 although Wilson has a few more hundred yards.
Oakland runs 37.5% of the time. Miami runs it 34% of the time. Not a HUGE difference. Carr does have a better oline though. But that run/pass ratio isn't unheard of.
