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QB option

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by english dolphin, Nov 22, 2015.

  1. english dolphin

    english dolphin New Member

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    i like tanehill, i believe in a better team with better players and a balanced offence he would play much better, the bad O-Line is really hindering him

    But my question is outside of the top 4-5 Qb's in e.g brady, romo, rodgers, newton, dalton ect whom are obvious elites,and make a difference to there teams who else would make a differencein miami, and if we had them today v the cowboys would have won us the game?



    Roll on the draft to get some new players on D too

    bill lazor is dumb also
     
  2. english dolphin

    english dolphin New Member

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    hard not to start ranting haha
     
  3. DolphinGreg

    DolphinGreg Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It doesn't seem like a meaningful conversation to argue about other teams' QBs.

    Would Miami have won with Carson Palmer playing today? I don't know. There are so many variables to that. It doesn't seem relevant though.

    The Tannehill question is about whether or not you believe he'll gain the kind of consistency one needs to be successful in the NFL. He's great and then he's nothing. Is that the team or is that him? Different people have different answers to that question.

    Either way, a team can't really rise above .500 with that production. Tom Brady gets hot and his team goes 8-1. Tannehill gets hot and he completes a bunch of passes in a row, which is great, but it doesn't seem to do anything for the record.

    Winning is a team stat and this team isn't great, but you need coaches and a great front office for that to happen. A big reason QBs haven't been developed in Miami is that there's nothing in Miami in general. No QB is going to carry the team by himself. Look at Oakland, they've put the necessary pieces in place around their young QB. Matt Ryan had the best running game in the league when he entered and he went 50-20 or something like that to begin his career. Flacco and Dalton both had good teams with solid defenses. Roethlisberger walked onto a team that carried him to the Super Bowl with terrible stats!

    You just can't put a developmental QB on a badly-coached team with obvious deficiencies and expect for good things to happen. In Miami, there is some talent but the coaches don't know how to utilize it very well.

    So would Miami have won with Carson Palmer...I don't know. Either Palmer would've been caged in by the horrible play-calling of Bill Lazor or Bill Lazor would've been able to call a great game because Carson Palmer is a better QB.

    We don't have information to answer that question but after 5 years Tannehill will have had a fair enough shake in most people's eyes and Bill Lazor isn't doing anything to redeem himself with his play-calling so it's likely they both may end up elsewhere at some point.
     
  4. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Here's the much bigger question- would we have won with Matt Moore on the field today?

    And for the 3rd or 4th time this season, I believe that the answer is yes. Even though Moore gambles a lot more often and makes some reckless throws, he's also a true team leader that can inspire and find the end zone. The answer is right under our noses people and Moore is the perfect stop-gap for the next 1-3 seasons.
     
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  5. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Is he a team leader? I can't remember all I'd like about Moore but his unreliability was my main problem with him. I never thought he had the tools to be a good QB in the NFL. Tannehill has the tools but doesn't know how to use them. I think we have to look elsewhere, probably draft.
     
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  6. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    The answer to your question is: No. No, we would not have won with Matt Moore.

    The thing that jades opinions on Tannehill is that while he may not be great, this team as a whole is very bad. Regardless of QB this is a .500 team at best.

    Bad OL, bad secondary, bad LB unit and bad OC.

    Complain about the QB all you want, it really doesn't matter.

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  7. muskrat21

    muskrat21 Well-Known Member

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    um dalton is elite? Did you watch him at all last week? He is average with a great team around him.
     
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  8. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. As it is, only a top 5 QB could get this team to the playoffs.
     
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  9. AdamC13

    AdamC13 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, QBs don't really have that big of an effect on the rest of the team and whether that team wins or not. We saw a perfect example of this today. Look at the Cowboys, does it really matter whether Romo is playing or not? NO, the Cowboys are a .300 team at best regardless of who is playing QB.
     
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  10. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    If that.

    The problem is consistency.

    I actually thought the defense was OK today. To be honest the offense probably lost the game. More weeks than not it's the opposite though.

    My biggest beef is play calling. How you run for the YPC you do and still have do few attempts is mind boggling. I don't get it.



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  11. Phins Up Wins Up

    Phins Up Wins Up Banned

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    3-0 with Romo 0-7 without. And 12-4 last year. Yeah man doesn't matter who plays QB in Dallas. That team cannot win. They are 0-7.
     
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  12. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    I know you're being sarcastic but Romo wasn't very good today.
    He had 2 back breaking turnovers, 1 in the red zone, and 1 of his TD's was on a terrible play by Taylor (the other was when a LB was covering Dez lol)

    So, to your point, the QB didn't really matter today.

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  13. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    Except for when they NEEDED a drive, he delivered.
     
  14. Phins Up Wins Up

    Phins Up Wins Up Banned

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    Better than Tannehill. Remind you this is the same team that had a 7 game losing streak. But yeah ending that had nothing to do with Romo. Gotcha.
     
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  15. Phins Up Wins Up

    Phins Up Wins Up Banned

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    Also did a great job evading sacks and extending plays today. That was the difference in the QBs today.
     
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  16. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    If anyone thinks this game wasn't QB vs QB you're terribly wrong. Romo delivered when he needed to and Tannehill didn't. Tannehill had about 5 drives starting from his own 40+ and did absolutely nothing.
     
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  17. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    Of course romo is better than tannehill, but Romo also wasn't good today.

    Both can be true.

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  18. Phins Up Wins Up

    Phins Up Wins Up Banned

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    Nah man. The franchise QB is here in Miami. Only scoring 14 points has nothing to do with him. That pick 6 was the OLs fault. And averaging 18 ppg is everyone else's fault. Learn football bro. Tannehill is money.
     
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  19. Phins Up Wins Up

    Phins Up Wins Up Banned

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    Bad QB too.
     
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  20. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    He's average, the rest are bad.

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  21. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    Ah yes, the ol' unquantifiable "needed a drive" statistic.

    I'll check PFF to see who leads that category this year.

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  22. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    You can't be serious. People like you who lookup fake stats from a madeup website, that bases stats over their own madeup concoction, who takes their stats to heart is hilarious.
     
  23. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Matt Moore has a better starting record than ANY Miami quarterback in the past decade. He also played behind a worse starting line with nowhere near the talent at receiver, although he did have Brown and Williams at RB (which we could call a wash with Miller/Ajayi). The year we drafted Tannehill, it was no secret what the team thought of the QB controversy either....they all wanted Moore.

    So what's changed in the past four years? Sure, Moore is four years older now and that's definitely a negative. But he's still the same leader that the offense rallied behind and fought for on a weekly basis.

    And what would happen if Moore started? First off, we could use the entire playbook since he has excellent vision, excellent arm strength and a much better touch on intermediate passes. That means we're no longer the 2-yard dink/dunk offense where defenders can stack the box and constantly blitz, which opens up 10x more than an average week with Mr. Tannehill under center. But more importantly, it puts a genuine leader in the huddle that understands what it takes to win in the NFL....and he has a freaking clue about how to do it as well.

    I know you enjoy being all nellie negative since you've been preaching Tannehill's strengths for the past few years, but it's time to admit that you were (are) wrong and that we need a competent QB under center. And since Matt Moore is the only viable option for 2015, we're lucky that he just so happens to be a heck of a lot better than Mr. Tannehill in many aspects of the game.
     
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  24. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    yeah. thats really it in a nutshell. when you look at this matchup on paper we should have gotten blown out. dallas returned dez bryant, romo and sean lee for this game. we are missing jenkins, wake and james. we are so overmatched i'm surprised we kept it competitive. this forum is delusional sometimes. every week, no matter who we play, people believe we are going to win every game. its nuts
     
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  25. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    We were 2 point underdogs. Nobody with anything more than a bar stool guess thought we were going to get "blown out".
     
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  26. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    Bryant has been back for a while. Romo looked like horse **** and was rusty for the most part. Stop it. Miami should have won this game, at home, and they didn't. Enough with the excuses.
     
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  27. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    No. I don't take any stat to heart. If I did, I'd tell you that Tannehill had a better passer rating than Romo today.

    Instead, I'm telling you both were average. Romo's team was just slightly better.

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  28. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    Actually our defensive ppg allowed is a lot better than our offensive points scored. The defense is far from great but the offense is factually worse.
     
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  29. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    I don't want that team...I don't want Marino #2...I want a GOOD OVERALL TEAM. PHUCK having a QB that can "carry the team on his shoulders" all the time...we had that for SEVERAL years with nothing to show for it except being pre-season prediction as Super Bowl champs.

    Yes QBs matter a lot...no ****...this something new? BUT...they aren't EVERYTHING except in cases like Dallas...no thanks. Marino, Rodgers, Manning...all the same...if they go down, the team does with 'em. Other teams have lost their starting QB (a Dolphins team about 43 years ago for one...managed to go undefeated) and did fine...THAT'S the kind of team I want...damn good overall, with a good, solid QB. Cheatriots won 3 rings with that formula (with the cheating sprinkled in of course).

    This "TEAM" lacks talent in some crucial areas...I'm not talking elite talent, I'm talking reliable, trustworthy talent...and has shown ZERO discipline this whole year, Philbin's tenure included. That won't ever get it done.

    RT made more bad throws today than any other game this year, with a few great ones sprinkled in...that formula won't do it either. That sack he took where he had all day to throw was sickening. I'm middle of the road on him now, as much as I hate to say it. I don't think he's trash, but I don't think he's the answer either...middle of the road at the moment. Can he get to the point we need him to be before he's run out of town in a year or two? We'll see.
     
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  30. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    i did. i had money on dallas. first game of the season i bet against miami. and i felt lucky i won. god bless lazor. my take was when sean lee went down thats when dallas started having trouble stopping the run. sean lee returns and they should be able to stop the run right? lol. miller is gaining 8 yds a carry, ajayi gaining 6 and what does lazor do. shuts it down. lol. i was on the fence about lazor till this game. he's horrible though. i thought campbell would get him to run more. i was wrong. that guy just wants to throw every down
     
  31. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    Dude, cmon. Matt Moore is a backup QB for the Miami Dolphins. If he had half the talent you say he does, he'd be in a different situation for a different team.

    And btw, I've never claimed Tannehill was the second coming. To this point, he's been extremely average. I like his potential but am not sure he reaches it, at least not in Miami anyway.


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  32. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    Wow....what kind of fan actually has the nerve to bet against the team they root for? Has this country no morals and self dignity???



















    [​IMG]


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  33. Shane Falco

    Shane Falco Banned

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    I can still play!

    Put me in coach!
     
  34. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    I can tell you're fake because Shane Falco isn't that confident.
     
  35. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    in god we trust lol
     
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  36. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Are you serious? Tannehill was a package deal for Philbin and his offensive coordinator. They would have started Tannehill regardless, and he was going to keep on starting until Ross cleared house.

    Moore has thrown a total of 31 passes since going 6-3 as a starter on a Dolphin team that started the year 0-7. And in the one game Tannehill got hurt in 2012, Moore stepped in and went 11/19 1 TD/ 0 INT 96.9 passer rating. His two drives in the 4th won the game....when's the last time Tannehill had 2 4th quarter drives for the win? And that's Moore cold off the bench....without a single snap during the week.

    So please, don't tell me that Tannehill is automatically better than Moore because he got the nod in a completely biased contest 4 years ago. Anyone with a halfway decent memory clearly knows better.
     
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  37. gilv13

    gilv13 Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  38. muskrat21

    muskrat21 Well-Known Member

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    tannehill got the job bc moore got hurt. the plan for the first year was to sit tannehil bc he was a project qb and he needed time to learn. he got forced in. just setting history straight for you two to squabble properly.
     
  39. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    David Garrard.
     
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  40. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    campbell put the offensive shortcomings today on 3rd down drops and penalties edit: 4 minutes in he mentions the pick six and says you cant do that edit: and also laid the blame at his own feat for not getting on guys more during practice
     

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