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State of the Unit: Cornerbacks

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by zwave21, Jan 22, 2015.

  1. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    2014 Recap: Our Pass Defense was superior to our Run Defense but that shouldn't be looked at as an overall postive. The unit while marginally better still doesn't mean this unit is good. Brent Grimes wasn't his 2013 self but he is in the Pro Bowl and a Top 10 player at the position. Listen fellas, we gotta be thankful for some players and he is one I am happy we have. Behind him it may as well have been a MASH unit with the injuries that occurred. Finnegan/Taylor missed significant time during the year. Davis/Thomas were put on IR early in the year. It got so bad we started a guy we signed on a Wednesday... yeah. Regardless, when you play in a division with Tom Brady and a conference with Brady/Manning/Luck/Big Ben/Flacco/Rivers etc. you got to have depth.

    The Unit: Grimes is our best CB and pro bowler and he will be back. Negatives with him is he is at the age where decline in play is imminent, and he is still undersized. Behind him Cortland Finnegan was brought in and he had a few ok games but there is zero reason to bring him back at his age, his price, and his lack of quality we can do better. Jamar Taylor needs to toughen up, and Will Davis can follow suit. Such pansies man, listen Davis can't tackle and truthfully if we had better depth he probably woulda been cut. Since he is still young and on rookie deal and with our cap situation he should be in training camp. I am hoping beyond hope Taylor becomes a player who can be counted on, because the best thing for us is for him to step up as a starter. Jimmy Wilson was terrible in the nickel this year and had a 120+ passer rating against him. Michael Thomas got injured so early in the year not much can be said of him in the nickel, but staff seemed to like him. RJ Stanford came in and gave effort but there is a reason he is a camp body but not someone who should see a lot of minutes. So with that said. We have one established starter in Grimes. Two 3rd year players who were 2nd & 3rd round draft picks who can't stay healthy. All are under contract going into 2015, and that isn't too reassuring. Lacking a consistent nickel and boundary corner and if this year should teach us anything depth, depth, depth.

    Areas of Concern: #2 CB; Nickel CB; Depth

    Free Agents: Jimmy Wilson, Michael Thomas

    Potential Cuts: Cortland Finnegan, Will Davis

    Potential Free Agents: Darrelle Revis (NE); Antonio Cromartie (AZ); Buster Skrine (CLE); Sterling Moore (DAL); Kareem Jackson (HOU); Walter Thurmond (NYG); Brandon Flowers (SD); Byron Maxwell (SEA); Perrish Cox (SF); Chris Culliver (SF)

    Top Draft Options: Trae Waynes (MSU); Marcus Peters (WASH); Quinton Rollins (Miami, Ohio); PJ Williams (FSU); Ronald Darby (FSU); Jalen Collins (LSU); Senquez Golson (Ole Miss); Alex Carter (Stanford); Kevin Johnson (WF); Doran Grant (OSU); Kevin White (TCU)

    I know the list is long but I'll put it this way, there is no elite type CB prospect this year. I don't think Waynes is better than his counterpart from last year Dennard who was a 1st rounder. Peters if he had a clean rap has top 10 talent but he got dismissed from team before season's end. Rollins is the hottest riser of this group, a basketball player turned CB with incredible athleticism. The FSU boys are good but not elite both probably round 2-3. Collins is young but has good size. Golson will make a name working the nickel. Carter is a good size Pac-12 CB but i am catious on Stanford players. Johnson could work into 1st round after combine. Grant/White are likely 3rd-4th rounders.

    My Plan: So, with previous posts I've addressed DT; ILB; S; OG and out of those units I have gone the FA route with FS (Rahim Moore), OG (Franklin/Boling); DT (resigned Odrick after cutting Starks). DT had two needs and the NT type was picked in round 2 with Jordan Phillips from OU. ILB we took Clemson ILB Stephone Anthony. (BTW those two picks I expect serious contributors day 1 if not starters). I also said we should draft OG in mid to late rounds so say 5th or 6th. That leaves available picks in Round 1, Round 3, Round 5 or 6, and Round 7.

    With a lack of elite Cornerbacks and one unit I have yet to address that has more elite players I wouldn't go the 1st round route with CB. We haven't had much draft luck at the position TBH. Davis/Smith were poorly managed and traded and now are Top 10 players at their position....ugh. Jamar Taylor has some promise but I can say I have zero hope for Will Davis. The draft scares me, but so does spending big money on CB. Thankfully, for us the market has gone down considerably. Revis is not an option so just don't. He ain't coming here and we can't afford him. Looking at FA market all those players above outside of Cromartie/Revis are under 30 years old, so players who still have good years left. My POA would be too sign a mid level veteran, not the same type as Finnegan someone who has declined and trying to bounce back. The aforementioned list has some quality names not big names but quality. Skrine started in CLE this year over a Top 10 pick and played well. Moore is more of a nickel type but since we need that he should be considered. Jackson had a very good year in Houston and would bring size element. Thurmond got hurt and didn't make impact in NYG I doubt they bring him back and his price tag may drop, he is a talented player nontheless. Flowers is a former pro bowler but 29 and would be a rinse wash repeat of Grimes a few years ago and we don't need to get older. The SF guys get me excited as both are fly under the radar but talented players. My fear is they will look at staying or following Fangio to Chicago. With that said Taylor has ability to play both slot or outside so finding a guy who can flip flop both would be great to have. I want a proven veteran as Taylor/Davis worry me. I also would like some size at CB at least more than we have so my guy would be Chris Culliver, he is only 26 and coming off 4 int year. He has experience in both the slot and outside. He would come on a manageable deal and be able to step in and contribute. I;d also mentioned in FS post, that Michael Thomas I want resigned and with his ability in the nickel it would give us a little flexibility on how to complete the unit. That's where round 5 should come in. I know round 5 is hard to beleive the player will make an impact but when Chris Harris Jr. is the #1 rated CB as an UDFA and Richard Sherman is #2 in the NFL an former 5th round pick, it cetainly can be done. The player who I liked was Umiami's Ladarius Gunter who has great size and ability. He may have put himself in high consideration after the Senior Bowl. But, either way BPA for CB in round 5 would be fine with me if we sign a veteran to come in.

    Grimes - Culliver
    Taylor - Rookie - Davis - Thomas - FA/UDFA
     
  2. LBsFinest

    LBsFinest Banned

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    Of the free agent corners I think Maxwell is the best overall choice, young with good size, long, and good speed for his size as well, best of all he knows how to find the ball in the air.
     
  3. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    Agreed on his ability just don't think SEA lets him go, and if they do I see him looking at JAX or ATL with his former coordinators there.
     
  4. Piston Honda

    Piston Honda Well-Known Member

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    I'd be fine with Taylor, Davis, Thomas behind Grimes if they were healthy. CBs are expensive and we need the $$$ for other positions.
     
  5. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It would be nice to get a guy w/ some size.
     
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  6. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    i think we need to add a corner, Im ok going into the season with grimes and taylor but we need a corner, just like we need safety, theres some good prospects in the mid rounds..
     
  7. Limbo

    Limbo Mad Stillz

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    Marcus Peters is one of the better if not the best corners to come out in the past few years. He was not the only one to butt heads with that coaching staff, and it sounds like a situation that went both ways...the culture there just wasn't right. Teams will have to get a feel for that situation in interviews, of course, but if he checks out there he's totally wourth our 1st.

    He's immensely talented, and he has an alpha attitude that this defense needs BADLY, just a really edgy competitor. As of right now he's the guy I want at 14.
     
  8. DcDolfan420

    DcDolfan420 Banned

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    This is a great post like the last ones you've done. I agree with pretty much everything except your distrust for Will Davis. I get that he doesn't seem like a very physical player, but from what I remember the training camp reports were he was a ball hawk and made lots of plays and picks during camp. I don't think he was drafted to be a real physical type player, and I believe he hasn't even been playing the position for as long as most other corners. I think he had the best 3 cone drill of any CB in the draft that year, so I'm not trying to say he will be great, but I wouldn't totally discount a relatively "soft" corner if he does have great quickness and cover skills. It's a passing league, and even if Davis isn't physical, if he can cover, we can use him. To be honest I'm more concerned with Walt Aikens, considering the fact he was healthy and we had a decimated secondary at times and he still couldn't play corner. At least I've seen Davis on the field playing corner when healthy. And you can give the rookie excuse for Aikens, but Carolina this year turned their season around by starting rookie corners. If you can play, you can play.
     
  9. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I think pass rushers & another safety should be a priority over CBs for pass defense right now.
     
  10. DcDolfan420

    DcDolfan420 Banned

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    You always need more pass rushers and our FS position is basically a black hole right now. But we need at least 1 more corner, Jimmy Wilson played his way off the team imo. Grimes, Taylor, Davis, Aikens. That is pretty much our core right now, 3 are unproven and 1 is old, that's a problem.
     
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  11. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    CB's aren't expensive my man unless your adding Revis. Position has become much more affordable then past years.

    The expensive ones are : QB, WR, LT, DE IMO
     
  12. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    DJ always, respect your info but what happens when Taylor get's hurt as it is always inevitable.... Will Davis/RJ Stanford....
     
  13. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    Thanks really means alot. Regarding Davis, I hear you while "soft" may not be right for the type of player he is, I mean in a sense of toughness. When it comes to tackling they guy shows zero aggression, and that is concerning. At least Jamar hits and takes pride in it. Great, he is a practice ballhawk but when the lights come on what has he done? I want him to succeed cuz he was a 3rd round pick but nothing so far has showed me he can. No reason to toss him aside just yet but if he is beaten out in camp let the best player play. His athleticism is very good and he was a ballhawk in college we need that so hopefully it clicks.

    Agreed on Aikens but then you got to remember our staff has zero faith in young players. Literally we red shirt people yearly which is foolish. He was a healthy scratch in Week 17 because a neighbor complained about noise.... (*big whoop). But, Aikens pretty much had a clone rookie season as Will Davis with little impact.
     
  14. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    I don't think Pass Rush is needed as much as Defensive Tackle. We have a good rotation of capable players with Wake/Vernon/Shelby/Jordan/McCain/Fede. That's four draft picks and one UDFA we've invested over the past four years so no need to add just need to develop.

    I'd rank having a good FS > over having a good #2 CB. Either way I think we can get both for relative cheap price.
     
  15. LBsFinest

    LBsFinest Banned

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    This season even when Davis was healthy he couldn't get on the field, he ain't the answer, neither is Jamar Taylor, just add em to the list of disappointing Ireland picks. We need to add a couple corners... I'd sign one in FA and draft another one.
     
  16. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He's got a healthy prognosis Z, we saw flashes of real ability, I liked the draft pick to begin with, we saw he could play the position, he's a 2nd round pick and I'm gonna ride his ***, I'll look for another vet backup if Finnegan doesn't come back, and maybe draft a kid like Gunter from the U..

    Are you thinking you wanna go free agent signing like Brandon flowers or someone at that level?
     
  17. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Chris McCain looks to me like a real pass rushing prospect who got no reps so that's like a new draft pick this year..hopefully a slim working out now with cam wake dion Jordan will provide some danger as well.
     
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  18. Limbo

    Limbo Mad Stillz

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    It gets more and more depressing as we talk about the wide array of needs on this defense, the fact that it makes sense to use a first on almost any position on that side of the ball. Sheesh. I don't even want to imagine this unit without Wake and Grimes, both of whom are in their 30s and appear to be declining just a little...ugh.

    That's why I say pick the elite talent (Peters). Pick someone who has the most potential to dominate their position, because Wake has been our only guy like that for years and won't be able to be for much longer. We need game-changers.
     
  19. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    I did like the pick. Like some I've seen just not enough so it's kind of frustrating. I'm keeping him but no way he is my #2 outright in camp. Depth regardless. I love his physicality in the run game. Finnegan I'll pass. Love Gunter but he prob isn't a Coyle guy, lmao.

    Flowers I wouldn't hate but I will say he isn't my top 3. I love the SF guys cause they compete and will come affordable. Seattle guys too.
     
  20. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    Love Peters but doubt he is even in consideration after getting booted from UW. But, he will be a very very good player.
     
  21. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Taylor had moved up the depth chart to #2 at the end of the year...dont see why he wouldn't get penciled in as the starter unless were going after flowers...

    Gunter better be a coyle guy..if not he's a real doucher.
     
  22. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    He moved up IMO from process of elimination. Finnegan got dinged up and created room for Taylor. When Delmas went down Jimmy moved to FS which created even more of a need an opportunity for him. I am fine if you want to pencil him in for January 2015 but when April rolls around we better have someone who make him earn it.

    Would love Gunter to be our type of guy, I'd like some more size out there at CB.
     
  23. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Same thinking here. At least 6' w/ long arms would be nice w/ some attitude and strength to back it up. Not thrilled about Trae in part because of his size.
     
  24. zwave21

    zwave21 New Member

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    Waynes isn't worth our 1st round pick.
     
  25. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    And if our run of luck continues, the guy we take w/ our first won't be either.

    There are some exciting prospects out there though, obviously contingent on what we do in free agency. There seem to be a lot of good WR and DL prospects in the draft this year. I think we are good at TE and even fair at LB if everyone is healthy. Not wasting a high pick on QB.

    Need a guard, which I think is probably best fixed in FA and probably more reasonably fixed in FA. Safety. Corner w/ size as mentioned. And some good coaching. :D
     

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