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Ross trying to trade for Harbaugh?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Phins_Fan_87, Sep 28, 2014.

  1. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Three straight AFC Championship Games and a Super Bowl appearance would be nice. Also would be nice to be able to compete with and beat the best teams in the league even when your roster is full of suspensions, injuries and controversy...which always happens even to the very best teams.

    Lest we forget the player mutiny that preceded the Giants winning a Super Bowl or the player mutiny that preceded the Baltimore Ravens latest Super Bowl.
     
  2. DeDolfan

    DeDolfan Premium Member Luxury Box

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    All correct except the negotiations were not secret. Shula had a falling out with Carroll Rosenbloom and Shula asked and obtained permission from Rosenbloom to talk with the Dolphins about their HC position. The league still looked at it as tampering.
     
  3. heylookatme

    heylookatme Well-Known Member

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    I don't care if players like or dislike their coach. Many good coaches have been disliked by their players.

    What matters is if the coach is good and the players respect that he is good.
     
  4. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    Still didn't answer my statement about doing this while Philbins hired, possibly trading a draft pick (1st rounder) and michigan always looming if he's not successful.
     
  5. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Well...nooooooo.... because what has Philbin won?

    Lets take a look at this:

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2145944-san-francisco-49ers-how-much-is-jim-harbaugh-worth


    THE DUNGY INDEX:
    http://www.footballperspective.com/the-dungy-index-version-2-0/

    "One of the best systems I’ve seem to compare coaches is something called the "Dungy Index," put together by Doug Drinen and refined by Chase Stuart over at FootballPerspective.com.

    Basically, it grades a coach on his ability to crank out positive season after positive season, avoiding the natural regression to the mean each year. It’s hard to win 12 games every year, because players get hurt and aging happens. Similarly, it’s hard to lose 12 games every year, because new draft talent comes in and improves the team’s prospects.

    Drinen and Stuart take a team's performance in one year and then use historical averages to figure out how well a team is expected to do the next season, using something called the Pythagorean record. That's a way of trying to take luck out of the equation and just seeing how many games a team should have won, based on how many points and scored and how many points it gave up.

    What the system does, then, is calculate the number of wins a team should be expected to have and then sum up how much better or worse each coach performs.

    The list spits out Don Shula, George Halas and Tony Dungy as the top three coaches, which isn’t bad at all for an objective list. The fact that the rest of the top 10 is populated by people such as Vince Lombardi, John Madden, Bill Belichick and Tom Landry shows that it’s a fairly solid objective ranking.

    Let’s put that into perspective for Jim Harbaugh. We can go back and calculate, using this formula, how many regular-season wins the San Francisco 49ers were “supposed” to get each season and see how Harbaugh has fared against historical trends.


    Jim Harbaugh Versus Expectations Year Expected Wins Actual Wins Difference
    2011 7.4 13 +5.6
    2012 10.0 11.5 +1.5
    2013 9.6 12 +2.4
    2014 9.7 ?? ??



    You can see that Harbaugh’s teams have consistently outperformed how good they “should” have been, based on historical trends. That implies that Harbaugh himself brings an extra level of skill as a coach.

    It’s a very small sample size, and it’s inflated due to the sheer size of the jump between the Mike Singletary team of 2010 and Harbaugh’s first season in 2011, but it does at least imply that Harbaugh gets more out of his team than a random coach would.

    It implies an average coach could be expected to go 9-7 or 10-6 with this year’s 49ers, but Harbaugh’s coaching can add at least a win or two to that number.

    Again, it’s a small sample size, but it bodes well. It puts Harbaugh’s NFL career, so far, at 9.4 wins above expectations. By comparison, Bill Walsh’s entire career ended with 9.5 wins above expectations, so Harbaugh’s started his career in pretty good company."


    Harbaugh has consistently out performed win expecations. Two more wins a season....means we have made the playoffs the last few years...
     
  6. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Honestly....

    You potentially have a historically good Head Coach available for your team. Not just...next four years...but a Hall of Fame coach. If Im owner..and I believe he is that....then you go get the man. We didnt pass on the chance to take Don Shula...we didnt pass on the chance to take Dan Marino.....lets not pass on the chance to get Jim Harbaugh.
     
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  7. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I'm not seeing a question in that. I saw a statement.

    Philbin is good as fired, whenever is most convenient.

    The price for Harbaugh will be paid, and worth it.

    If Harbaugh decides on Michigan so be it. The rumors say they will pursue his brother instead. That will probably irk him too much to consider it, even if they circle back to the Harbaugh brother they deem to be the lesser. Jason Cole also reported that people close to Jim Harbaugh say he does not miss the whole recruiting scene and loves NFL football because it doesn't take him away from his family like college football did with all the recruiting trips.
     
  8. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Again, moving the benchmarks.

    When Ross tried to court Harbaugh with one still hired it was considered the biggest mistake ever made. Now its smart.
     
  9. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    lol what? I said it was a statement......not a question.

    Jason Cole is a great reporter, he knows his stuff /sarcasm

    Even if true, he'd be willing to move his family from the West Coast after decades, to South Cuba-America.....? But doesn't like recruiting trips?
     
  10. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    How does moving his family even remotely compare to leaving your family for weeks at a time while you go on recruiting trips? That's like comparing apples and ceiling fans.
     
  11. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    Because THEY are not leaving schools, friends, kliques, shopping malls, traffic patterns, PTA's, swim clubs, athletic associations, familiarity etc.
     
  12. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    And that has what exactly to do with Jim Harbaugh going on recruiting trips where he doesn't see his family for weeks at a time?
     
  13. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    Not liking recruiting trips = reasoning for not going to michigan or any college job

    Moving to Miami and taking his family away from everything they've had for decades = not a problem, lets get him to Miami baby

    Logic.
     
  14. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Does anyone seriously think...

    That if Harbaugh had an issue with moving to Miami....we would even be discussing this. I would bet anything...."somebody"....has had a discussion with..."someone" and through back channels has already confirmed this is not an issue.

    And..looking back...was it a mistake for Ross to go after Harbaugh? What if he landed him?....

    Give Ross credit for correctly evaluating the quality of coach Harbaugh is.
     
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  15. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

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    Wasn't Harbaugh considering Miami the first time around even with the cluster**** Ireland and Ross made out of it.

    Why wouldn't he consider it this time around? Especially when the price tag went up, and there's an owner almost assuredly willing to meet it.

    There is no team right down the block(SF) in the market for his services. So either way, he's gonna be up-rooting his family. Whether that's Miami or Michigan, or Cleveland.
     
  16. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    And if Im Steven Ross..and plan on owning the team for another ten years..

    Hes looking at this an investment....what is the likely value of this franchise in ten years if I can get Jim Harbaugh?..

    My guess its he feels it would be considerabley more then what its worth now
     
  17. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    You've not demonstrated to any degree whatsoever that there is a similarity in those decisions. You might as well be trying to suggest that not wanting to go bowling means you must hate basketball. It's purely absurd.

    Maybe a better example would be if a report came out saying Harbaugh doesn't like the idea of going to Michigan because it's really cold there, and so you say if that's the case then he won't want to go to Miami because it's so hot in Miami. You can try and say that the two aversions are connected in some broad, vague way...but the fact of the matter is one comes out looking like a pretty absurd assumption based on the other.
     
  18. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Harbaugh was on the verge of moving to Miami the first time. We had two sources with impeccable track records pointing toward signs that he was serious about Miami and then changed his mind during/after meeting with Ross.
     
  19. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    All in all, if this works out and JH is our next head coach, I am all for it if it doesnt cause problems.....dude is an amazing coach. Young, great track record with QBs etc. Think it'd turn this franchise and Ryan Tannehill around.
     
  20. Sethdaddy8

    Sethdaddy8 Well-Known Member

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    If Jet fans can continue to root for their team, with Michael Vick on their team, and Ravens fans can root for their team with Rice-Gate, then I can root for my team with a coach who is.... a stupid-head.

    I just don't know how I am going to enjoy all those deep perennial play-off runs, knowing the coach and players aren't BFFs.
     
  21. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Well...we can start a fan support sub section....."How to deal with being a fan of a winning franchise, while thinking its head coach is a ********"
     
  22. Sethdaddy8

    Sethdaddy8 Well-Known Member

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    Great idea, we can replace the "Forever Mediocre or Worse" with it.
     
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  23. heylookatme

    heylookatme Well-Known Member

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    I think the fact that Harbaugh acts like a huge baby on the sidelines actually brings value to the team. It's entertainment. It gives us really funny stuff to work with on Mondays, especially if the team loses.
     
  24. PhinGeneral

    PhinGeneral PC Texas A&M, Bro Club Member

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    Going after Harbaugh wasn't a mistake. The way Ross went about it was.
     
  25. PhinGeneral

    PhinGeneral PC Texas A&M, Bro Club Member

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    Speaking of which, I don't know if Geno Smith will ever become a real good QB in this league, but Jet fans are brutal. The guy is a couple of games into his sophomore year and they're already getting to him. I suppose if he lets the fans rattle him like that he's probably not cut out for that team, but it makes me think the Jets had better find a bonafide star out of the box at QB or they'll never get that far. The silver lining is that if things keep up Rex will be looking for a job. Hopefully we'll have a defensive coordinator job open.
     
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  26. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Man if the 49ers job becomes available, Gus Malzahn is going to jump all over that, that's his type of team.
     
  27. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    That's if Malzahn's desire to join the NFL is that strong to begin with.

    Right now I think his priority is winning an NCAA Football Championship as a head coach. He came close last year but didn't quite get there. If he falls short again this year then I think it would take a fantastic offer from a team he really likes (e.g. Dallas) in order to pry him out of the NCAA.
     
  28. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    Philbin is the man. We have not had a better HC, a HC who installed a better system, who delivered on QB, who gave us a fun team to watch, since the 80s. Philbin is a Dolphin. The job he is doing and has done is monumental.
    Harbaugh ain't shat. And Harbaugh already rejected us when Philbin took on the tough task and delivered.
    It's time the fans start enjoying this unbelievable offense and the team and stop biyatching, and start respecting the one, the only, tha man, the legend that is Joe Philbin!
     
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  29. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

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    I fist-bumped this cause it's awesome
     
  30. NorFlaFin

    NorFlaFin Active Member

  31. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

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    Ross probably won't be outbid, so I'm not worried about that being an obstacle
     
  32. heylookatme

    heylookatme Well-Known Member

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    1. It's not my money, so that's not really an issue for me.

    2. I don't think it's an issue for Steve Ross, based on what I've heard, either.
     
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  33. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Cowboys is his dream job...out the horses mouth.
     
  34. phinswolverinesrockets

    phinswolverinesrockets If he dies, he dies

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    Yep, I'd estimate 90% of Arkansans are Cowboys fans. Everyone I knew was a Cowboy fan.
     
  35. Sethdaddy8

    Sethdaddy8 Well-Known Member

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    Even with THAT owner? And those lunk heads buying the groceries??
     
  36. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    in blue
     
  37. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    you mean like in the sense of laughing hysterically at someone rather than with them?.... that kind of awesome? :lol:
     
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  38. EverFin

    EverFin Active Member

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    I can't remember seeing Shula on the sideline acting like a fool, yelling at the officials on almost every call. My reservations about Harbaugh are not because some 49er Players don't like to play for him anymore. I just don't like (what seems to be) his personality.
     
  39. Sethdaddy8

    Sethdaddy8 Well-Known Member

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    Yes....the "Harbaugh is a poopy-head" brigade is to the left sir.

    He reminds me of John McEnroe. I loved McEnroe.
     
  40. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    Knowing our luck, we'll fire Philbin.......get into deep negotiations with Harbaugh......Ross won't get rid of Aponte......Harbaugh will balk.....and we're hiring Jason Garrett who was just fired for Malzahn.....fml
     
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